nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6748|New Haven, CT
Could someone give a concise statement detailing why we don't utilize nuclear power as a greater percent of our electrical energy output?

My understanding is that it was a bunch of misguided and myopic environmentalists capitalizing on Three Mile Island and Chernobyl, but I think it is less simplistic than that.
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY
A combination of things.

Fear.

'Not in my backyard' people.

It's made even more expensive because of the above, but cost is an enormous factor also.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7025|132 and Bush

Clearly you have never watched the Simpsons.


The primary reason is waste disposal and as mentioned "not in my backyard".
Xbone Stormsurgezz
nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6748|New Haven, CT
It always seemed to me that waste disposal is cited as big factor against it, when it really shouldn't be.

Can't we just find an isolated pot in the desert, create a giant cavern, coat said cavern with 15 feet of concrete and lead, treat the concrete/lead against water damage, and happily store waste?

Or what prevents us from disposing of it in space?

Edit: Assumably, the potential for disaster resulting in a dissemination of radiation would preclude this option.

Last edited by nukchebi0 (2008-04-28 23:26:06)

SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

Kmarion wrote:

Clearly you have never watched the Simpsons.


The primary reason is waste disposal and as mentioned "not in my backyard".
Waste disposal is turning into a far smaller problem by using breeder reactors.  You still have long-lived waste, but it's not the truly dangerous materials like Iodine.
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|7099|Canberra, AUS
Mostly fear, and a NIMBY attitude to waste (which, by the way, is not irrational at all - there are very legitimate problems with waste disposal)
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

nukchebi0 wrote:

It always seemed to me that waste disposal is cited as big factor against it, when it really shouldn't be.

Can't we just find an isolated pot in the desert, create a giant cavern, coat said cavern with 15 feet of concrete and lead, treat the concrete/lead against water damage, and happily store waste?
Yucca Mountain is a pretty good choice.  You want something seismically inactive and far away from ground water sources.  But the problem is, nothing man makes will last the 106 years that some of that waste is around for.  The concern is essentially designating a no-man's land for the long term future.

nukchebi0 wrote:

Or what prevents us from disposing of it in space?
What happens if something goes wrong and all that waste explodes in the upper atmosphere?

Edit:  I just saw your edit.

Last edited by SenorToenails (2008-04-28 23:29:16)

Reciprocity
Member
+721|7005|the dank(super) side of Oregon
The same reason people get an MRI and not an NMRI.  The difference between a Magnetic Resonance Image and a Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Image?  nothing.  The word "nuclear" terrifies and confuses all the sheeple.
nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6748|New Haven, CT

SenorToenails wrote:

nukchebi0 wrote:

It always seemed to me that waste disposal is cited as big factor against it, when it really shouldn't be.

Can't we just find an isolated pot in the desert, create a giant cavern, coat said cavern with 15 feet of concrete and lead, treat the concrete/lead against water damage, and happily store waste?
Yucca Mountain is a pretty good choice.  You want something seismically inactive and far away from ground water sources.  But the problem is, nothing man makes will last the 106 years that some of that waste is around for.  The concern is essentially designating a no-man's land for the long term future.
I see.

nukchebi0 wrote:

Or what prevents us from disposing of it in space?
What happens if something goes wrong and all that waste explodes in the upper atmosphere?
I edited my post after I realized this. Thanks for pointing it out anyways.

Reciprocity wrote:

The same reason people get an MRI and not an NMRI.  The difference between a Magnetic Resonance Image and a Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Image?  nothing.  The word "nuclear" terrifies and confuses all the sheeple.
What caused the word "nuclear" to have such fear in people. Is it a continuation, subconsciously, of Cold War mentality, or the results of successful exploitation by the myopic environmentalists?

Last edited by nukchebi0 (2008-04-28 23:32:18)

Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7025|132 and Bush

"In the US, where much of the world's uranium is enriched, including Australia's, the enrichment facility at Paducah, Kentucky, requires the electrical output of two 1000-megawatt coal-fired plants, which emit large quantities of carbon dioxide, the gas responsible for 50per cent of global warming."

..irony

http://snipurl.com/269sm
Xbone Stormsurgezz
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

nukchebi0 wrote:

What caused the word "nuclear" to have such fear in people.
Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6748|New Haven, CT

Kmarion wrote:

"In the US, where much of the world's uranium is enriched, including Australia's, the enrichment facility at Paducah, Kentucky, requires the electrical output of two 1000-megawatt coal-fired plants, which emit large quantities of carbon dioxide, the gas responsible for 50per cent of global warming."

..irony

http://snipurl.com/269sm
Ugh...I see the whole solution to dirty power will be less simple than more nuclear plants.

But is the process of enriching uranium less energy-consuming than the resulting U-235 produces when reacted?

SenorToenails wrote:

nukchebi0 wrote:

What caused the word "nuclear" to have such fear in people.
Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
And by extension, the Cold War?

Last edited by nukchebi0 (2008-04-28 23:35:09)

Reciprocity
Member
+721|7005|the dank(super) side of Oregon

nukchebi0 wrote:

Reciprocity wrote:

The same reason people get an MRI and not an NMRI.  The difference between a Magnetic Resonance Image and a Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Image?  nothing.  The word "nuclear" terrifies and confuses all the sheeple.
What caused the word "nuclear" to have such fear in people. Is it a continuation, subconsciously, of Cold War mentality, or the results of successful exploitation by the myopic environmentalists?
An entire generation of people was raised to think the Soviets were going to vaporize the United States some time before or after recess.
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

Kmarion wrote:

"In the US, where much of the world's uranium is enriched, including Australia's, the enrichment facility at Paducah, Kentucky, requires the electrical output of two 1000-megawatt coal-fired plants, which emit large quantities of carbon dioxide, the gas responsible for 50per cent of global warming."

..irony

http://snipurl.com/269sm
I think that article ignores breeder reactors and using Thorium fuel.
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

Reciprocity wrote:

An entire generation of people was raised to think the Soviets were going to vaporize the United States some time before or after recess.
That too.
nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6748|New Haven, CT
Okay, I see. People developed an innate fear of nuclear following Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which was perpetuated by the Cold War and (assumably), the two highly publicized incidents I mentioned earlier. Nuclear consequently produces negative connatations in the minds of many people today.



As for the breeder reactors, don't they themselves give more fuel through the Pu-239? I used to be addicted to this stuff in eight grade, but my memory is serving me much worse than it should it should be.
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7190|Cambridge (UK)
Also, cost - both of building the reactors and of storing the waste somewhere 'safe'.
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

nukchebi0 wrote:

As for the breeder reactors, don't they themselves give more fuel through the Pu-239?
Yes, it is in fast breeders.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7025|132 and Bush

SenorToenails wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

"In the US, where much of the world's uranium is enriched, including Australia's, the enrichment facility at Paducah, Kentucky, requires the electrical output of two 1000-megawatt coal-fired plants, which emit large quantities of carbon dioxide, the gas responsible for 50per cent of global warming."

..irony

http://snipurl.com/269sm
I think that article ignores breeder reactors and using Thorium fuel.
We aren't there yet are we?

Edit: I was looking at the next gen.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Reciprocity
Member
+721|7005|the dank(super) side of Oregon

nukchebi0 wrote:

I used to be addicted to this stuff in eight grade, but my memory is serving me much worse than it should it should be.
Did you ever get to see the Trojan Nuclear Reactor in Rainier?
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

Kmarion wrote:

We aren't there yet are we?
India is researching the use of Thorium fuel in thermal breeders, I believe.  They have huge domestic amounts of Thorium, so they want to be self reliant on fuel.

Also, fast breeders are being used in many countries already.
nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6748|New Haven, CT

Reciprocity wrote:

nukchebi0 wrote:

I used to be addicted to this stuff in eight grade, but my memory is serving me much worse than it should it should be.
Did you ever get to see the Trojan Nuclear Reactor in Rainier?
No.

Yes. I drove by it and saw it.
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6554|North Tonawanda, NY

nukchebi0 wrote:

Yes. I drove by it and saw it.
I almost got to take a tour of Ginna Nuclear Plant, but the tour ended up being on the same day as an exam I had to take. 
nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6748|New Haven, CT

SenorToenails wrote:

nukchebi0 wrote:

Yes. I drove by it and saw it.
I almost got to take a tour of Ginna Nuclear Plant, but the tour ended up being on the same day as an exam I had to take. 
That sucks.
Deadmonkiefart
Floccinaucinihilipilificator
+177|7130
Technology is progressing at such an incredible rate that I would consider it a waste to build a nuclear generator at this time. The safe transportation and storage of nuclear waste is a huge burden.  There are much cleaner ways to generate electricity.

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