BF2S Forums midwest flooding compared to hurricane katrina and the aftermath

I'm pretty sure Iowa as a state isn't anywhere near as poor as New Orleans is...

ok, you win, all black people are criminals and leechers.

@Masques:  so you claim that economics and lack of opportunity is one aspect that is holding back NO from developing?  i believe that this is true to be honest.  i'm wondering why this is the case.  is it corruption in govt that prevents these opportuniites?  is it racism?  is it lack of initiative on part of the people?  i hope not (on this last part)

CaptainSpaulding71 wrote:

@Masques:  so you claim that economics and lack of opportunity is one aspect that is holding back NO from developing?  i believe that this is true to be honest.  i'm wondering why this is the case.  is it corruption in govt that prevents these opportuniites?  is it racism?  is it lack of initiative on part of the people?  i hope not (on this last part)

Corruption mostly and a little bit of racism. This is after all the state that almost elected David Duke as governor. He got 40% of the vote and 55% of the white vote.

And graft is the bane of Louisiana politics. Literally almost every LA pol is bent in some way (more so than the national average IMO). A serious effort at rooting out corruption in LA would lead to indictment or resignation of ~75-80% of elected officials in the state. Corruption is taken as a given in local and state politics there, from the Long brothers to Leander Perez to Edwin Edwards and now William Jefferson, David Vitter, Bobby Jindal (his anti-corruption talk is mostly bull), and C. Ray Nagin Jr.

EDIT: I would add that the long history of corruption has definitely led to a certain apathy amongst the population. When your elected officials are stealing from you openly with impunity...what can you do? The police are hopelessly corrupt (read about the NOPD in the 1980s, they were doing hits and selling drugs and that's confirmed) and government is either distant and uninterested or actively fucking with you.

Last edited by Masques (2008-06-18 16:00:28)

Ohhhhhhhh, I thought the levies were purposely destroyed so "whitey" could clean house in Louisiana, and the people in Mississippi ( whom you didn't hear shit from by the way) just got caught in the crossfire......

The truth is ALL able bodied adults (thats right I said it------ ALLLLLLLLLLLLL) still looking for handouts and free housing 4 years later obviously were worthless then, and are worthless now. After 4 years , your excuses are pretty much exhausted

Unless the news reports are biased in the opposite direction from what happened in NO, and I don't think so,  I think it more of local community effort and not government effort that makes the 2 situations stand apart.  As to the looting.  There was looting for supplies for survival, right wronf or indifferent, and there was looting for the hell of it, very wrong.  I really don't have a lot of sympathy for people whining about what happned 4 yrs ago.  I don't recall hearing about people hit by tornadoes in the Oklahoma City area, (I have family there) whining about it a year later. 

I have to agree with lowing about katrina refugees looking for handouts being lowlifes after 4 yrs.  You need to quit whining and get on with your life.  Sure it sucks to have lost everything, but things can be replaced. 

Government won't solve your problems, it will only make them worse.

CPTS wrote:

the midwest is currently experiencing what some people call the once in 500 year flood

http://www.ens-newswire.com/ens/jun2008 … -16-01.asp

yet we don't hear too much about rioting, screwups with evacuations, local and state authorities unable to cope, etc. 

the sheer scale of it seems about the same - huge areas are flooded out.  yet, i do not see the same style aftermath and mismanagement (yet) as in Katrina.  i'm hoping that this is just a case of putting into practice what we learned from Katrina but i have my doubts.

discuss...

[edit] - i must give credit to Lowing for this topic idea and i thought it warranted discussion on its own.

Because New Orleans had chronic social problems and sky-high levels of crime before the flood...? Also to my knowledge no several million strong urban area has been completely flooded as yet in the mid-west.

Population density.

DoctaStrangelove wrote:

Population density.

QFE

We are talking about a far less densely populated area. This disaster is happening more slowly than Katrina. Besides every white person in Iowa would fit twice in Kinnick Stadium.

Kill me.. but there are little to no black people being affected. Sure, they're there, but they're sensible and not the trash from New Orleans.

Fuck NO and LA. Shitty ass city/state.

Turquoise wrote:

CaptainSpaulding71 wrote:

@Masques:  so you claim that economics and lack of opportunity is one aspect that is holding back NO from developing?  i believe that this is true to be honest.  i'm wondering why this is the case.  is it corruption in govt that prevents these opportuniites?  is it racism?  is it lack of initiative on part of the people?  i hope not (on this last part)

Louisiana is one of the most corrupt states.  I'm sure you've heard of Huey Long.  Some of what he did was good for the poor, but he assumed power in a nearly fascist way.

Also, the KKK has a long history with Louisiana (much like the rest of the Deep South).  David Duke is proof that the KKK still wields considerable power in Louisiana.

Finally, Louisiana has a large population of poor blacks.  Most of these people are directly descended from slaves.  Despite gaining freedom after the CIvil War, not much was done to bring the freed slaves out of the poverty that they had always known, and many of their descendants fared only marginally better.

In short, Louisiana is kind of fucked.

this last bit of not much has been done to bring the blacks out of poverty is an interesting point.  Honestly, i make the claim that there is some sort of guilt in progress that is holding certain groups of people back.  if you are successful, you get labeled as a sell out by our peers (an uncle tom).  so the group is actually determining a negative destiny.  i don't buy the fact that there is a lack of opportunity since if that was the case, then wouldn't there be throngs of others without jobs and education as well?  perhaps if you are given enough to get by (through public assistance), then why work harder to progress?  this is a sad outlook if that's the case.

the teach a man to fish thing and lead a horse to water arguments are running around my mind as i write this.  perhaps since i'm type-A personality, i wouldn't be satisfied with living like that and would want to change things - irregardless of what my peers or family might think.  i'm hungry.  i want certain things out of life - like house, car, nice lifestyle.  i don't expect this to be handed to me so i'm willing to work long hours (and believe me i do this already) to get those things i want.  i also prioritize and make decisions that enable long term goals to be achieved.  these kinds of life skills are not universal and have been actually taught to me by my family.  maybe this sort of famililial teaching is not possible in the climate down there due to the breakup of the traditional family unit.  still, there are civic groups and churches and so on - but people have to want to learn this stuff too. 

ALL:  great inputs so far - thanks for contributing to the discussion

CaptainSpaulding71 wrote:

this last bit of not much has been done to bring the blacks out of poverty is an interesting point.  Honestly, i make the claim that there is some sort of guilt in progress that is holding certain groups of people back.  if you are successful, you get labeled as a sell out by our peers (an uncle tom).  so the group is actually determining a negative destiny.  i don't buy the fact that there is a lack of opportunity since if that was the case, then wouldn't there be throngs of others without jobs and education as well?  perhaps if you are given enough to get by (through public assistance), then why work harder to progress?  this is a sad outlook if that's the case.

the teach a man to fish thing and lead a horse to water arguments are running around my mind as i write this.  perhaps since i'm type-A personality, i wouldn't be satisfied with living like that and would want to change things - irregardless of what my peers or family might think.  i'm hungry.  i want certain things out of life - like house, car, nice lifestyle.  i don't expect this to be handed to me so i'm willing to work long hours (and believe me i do this already) to get those things i want.  i also prioritize and make decisions that enable long term goals to be achieved.  these kinds of life skills are not universal and have been actually taught to me by my family.  maybe this sort of famililial teaching is not possible in the climate down there due to the breakup of the traditional family unit.  still, there are civic groups and churches and so on - but people have to want to learn this stuff too. 

ALL:  great inputs so far - thanks for contributing to the discussion

Thanks again, Captain...  I pretty much agree.  Probably the strongest evidence that you can make it far in this country is the illegal immigrant experience.  Look at how these people bust their asses to make a living with little to no government help.

If THEY can make it, then so can these people.