BF2S Forums Last Time: Debate October 15 HOFSTRA UNIVERSITY Hempstead, NY

Diesel_dyk wrote:

NOTE That ad was placed at 19:46 pacific time.... I'm not even sure that the debate was over yet... and these guys have a professional button with that quote and the date of the debate made up and ready to go????? I cry BS on this one.

You can change the information within an ebay listing provided it has not had any bids at all, or is relatively new, without the page displaying "this item listing has been altered"

Conspiracy - solved.

PekkaA wrote:

I think McCains eyerolling was pretty dignified and presidential compared to this:

http://www.hs.fi/kuvat/iso_webkuva/1135240287108.jpeg

Lots of Dem sites are currently having a caption contest for some of these pics.

They're also seriously wondering what kind of medications he was jacked up on right before the debate.  His nervous ticks, dry-mouth behavior, and general wierdness are signs of being pumped up on something.

From what I'm hearing, it looks like the outcome of this debate is like the VP debate where Palin apparently won because she didn't fail as bad as everyone thought she would.

That guy and his well off business that he wants to buy might be better off under McCain, but from what I've seen, if everyone voted based on who would give them a better break, Obama would win by a landslide...

I can't believe people are acting like he is an average American.... looks more like a rich man to me. I suppose most people think that as long as you're not in a major city than it doesn't matter how high your earning are because you're still the "average" person.


If that guy is an average Joe American, than wow. Alot of Americans must all be fucking so rich it's not even funny.

Looks like I need to move to the USA.

Last edited by Mek-Stizzle (2008-10-16 05:22:55)

Kmarion wrote:

Joe isn't actually in the tax increase bracket.

Not what McCain said. THen again, he doesn't even know what he says half the time.

Kmarion wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Joe isn't actually in the tax increase bracket.

Not what McCain said. THen again, he doesn't even know what he says half the time.

Again he was simply a symbol. Joe hasn't bought the company yet. Isn't it obvious they were speaking hypothetical? Why do people have such a hard time understanding the larger point?

Edit: Although McCain is trying to give the impression that everyone will be taxed.

McCain said "Joe the plumber would have his taxes increased under Obama". What is hypothetical about that?

McCain was being quite literal. You were watching the US Presidential debate right?

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Not what McCain said. THen again, he doesn't even know what he says half the time.

Again he was simply a symbol. Joe hasn't bought the company yet. Isn't it obvious they were speaking hypothetical? Why do people have such a hard time understanding the larger point?

Edit: Although McCain is trying to give the impression that everyone will be taxed.

McCain said "Joe the plumber would have his taxes increased under Obama". What is hypothetical about that?

McCain was being quite literal. You were watching the US Presidential debate right?

The symbolism is obviously beyond you. The hypothetical is in what Joe says he wants to do in the future (buy a company that makes more than 250k a year) and what will happen if Obama is elected. I've never seen so much petty nit picking in my life. Talk about missing the point.. sheesh.

Kmarion wrote:

Braddock wrote:

...and what was all that Joe the plumber shit about!? Does Joe live on Mainstreet USA by any chance?

Kmarion wrote:

He is Joe Wurzelbacher, an Ohio man looking to buy a plumbing business who came to symbolize the notion of spreading the wealth in Wednesday night's third and final presidential debate between Democrat Barack Obama and Republican John McCain.

Earlier this week, when Wurzelbacher got a chance to speak with Obama during a campaign appearance in Toledo, he told Obama that his tax plan would keep him from buying the business that currently employs him.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081016/ap_ … _plumber_3

You wouldn't piss in Joe the plumber's pint!

Reminds me a little of Ross Kemp!

TheAussieReaper wrote:

I loved when McCain said he didn't understand why Biden would want Iraq divided into three states.

Hasn't anybody told him yet?

He did not say he didn't understand.. I think cockamamie was the word..

In Iraq, he had this cockamamie idea about dividing Iraq into three countries. We're seeing Iraq united as Iraqis, tough, hard, but we're seeing them. We're now about to have an agreement for status of forces in Iraq coming up.

Kmarion wrote:

Joe isn't actually in the tax increase bracket.

Joe MIGHT be in the tax increase bracket in Obama's proposal.

Obama's going to increase taxes on businesses, and I don't believe the offsetting tax credit he's talking about is necessarily going to offset the increase.  So if Joe the plumber buys a business - the tax question in reality involves what TYPE of business he purchases.  For instance, if he's buying a corporation, Obama's talking about increasing tax for corporations.  If he's buying a different form of business, like one that reports the income on Joe's personal return instead of a seperate corporate return, the answer depends on how profitable the business is, because then it's direct income increase to Joe instead of having the income retained within the corporate entity.

But if Joe does buy a business that requires it to be taxed seperately at the state level, then he could be increasing the tax recognized by Joe's income stream because Ohio takes a cut.  However, in any case, buying a business in most formats is termed as an investment, and if Joe was to sell his business, then he's going to be hit by Obama's capital gains tax increase, since Obama wants to repeal the 15% tax rate.

So in other words, the entire issue has been blurred by the candidates.  Because it involves the type of business, tax planning for Ohio state taxes, etc etc etc.  It's not a simple as they are presenting it.

The candidates continue to spar over tax breaks to individuals, but aren't focusing enough between the differences on the corporate tax differences in their platforms.  Ultimately, Obama's plan would provide larger refunds to all but the upper echelon of individual taxpayers, while McCain would provide refunds to all, but not as much.  But elimination of the capital tax cut we currently have would impact buy-sell conditions, what type of entity to form, most of which are types that would prevent small businesses to grow as fast as they could.

Secondly, increasing taxes on corporations will encourage companies to move overseas.  A corresponding offset credit could be applied as Obama says, but then my question is - why is he banging the "we are going to charge more tax to corporations" drum if he's going to give it back?  The answer?  He's going to raise taxes in this area, but doesn't talk about it.

The differences between Obama and McCain in this regard is Obama wants the economic growth to be organic - which will limit the growth.  McCain wants to subsidize it by providing the breaks - but this doesn't mean people won't pocket the gains instead of reinvesting it in their business.

Last night, Obama mentioned he favors "PayGo" - which means that when a tax cut is proposed, and corresponding tax increase is required.  This isn't new.  It's now law.  So when I watch all of these proposals for tax cuts, it depends on the budget proposed.  If you provide a $400B tax cut to individuals, there has to be a $400B tax increase somewhere.  Yet when questioned about this, the candidates discuss cutting programs instead.  The whole debate last night was in a gray area in this regard.

I'm ready for the election to be over.  I've sickened on how much these issues are dumbed down so everyone can understand them.

Know why Joe is Joe the plumber? Cause McCain fucked up his last name so bad he wouldn't attempt it again.

topal63 wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Know why Joe is Joe the plumber? Cause McCain fucked up his last name so bad he wouldn't attempt it again.

LOL, I think you're right.

But, seriously about being un-serious McCain stole the show. He was comical at times while Obama was like the straight man in a comedy duo.

If I were worth 100 million dollars I'd have alot to laugh about too.

DBBrinson1 wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

topal63 wrote:

LOL, I think you're right.

But, seriously about being un-serious McCain stole the show. He was comical at times while Obama was like the straight man in a comedy duo.

If I were worth 100 million dollars I'd have alot to laugh about too.

Biden is on his way.  He's straight paid his family 2 mil from campaign donations.  Pretty funny huh?
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/200 … eir-firms/

When Obama said that he was going to spread the wealth to "Joe the Plumber"  I wonder if that's what he had in mind.

"Putting family members and their companies on the political payroll is legal if the work is legitimate and charged at market rates, according to the Federal Election Commission."


As I said, if I were worth 100 (one hundred) million (000,000) dollars, I'd have a lot to laugh about too.