tuckergustav
...
+1,590|6330|...

kylef wrote:

tuckergustav wrote:

I thought that when officers went into a "potentially dangerous" situation they turned their safety off...it would make sense since if something DOES  happen, they need a "hot" gun...not sure but I think I had heard that and it would make sense.  But what I would be interested to know is what steps are involved in firing a taser gun.  Isn't there an extra step?
Definitely not the same in the UK as far as I know. I bet the extra step is "ensure you are firing the taser gun" - heh.
lol...that would definitely be an important step.  I wonder if that's covered in the manual.
...
san4
The Mas
+311|7104|NYC, a place to live

mcjagdflieger wrote:

I speculate he should probably end up in jail for what he did, and the lawyer should accompany him. Payoff for family? Sure, toss them .5 to 1 million bucks.  But 25 million? Who the fuck does he think the poor guy was, a CEO? Perhaps payouts for wrongful death cases should be determined by a persons average wages, abilities, their dependents etc, lets stop with throwing insane amounts of money at some people that worked at 7-11.
The lawyer filed a complaint asking for $25 million. What is wrong with asking?
Wreckognize
Member
+294|6901

mcjagdflieger wrote:

I speculate he should probably end up in jail for what he did, and the lawyer should accompany him. Payoff for family? Sure, toss them .5 to 1 million bucks.  But 25 million? Who the fuck does he think the poor guy was, a CEO? Perhaps payouts for wrongful death cases should be determined by a persons average wages, abilities, their dependents etc, lets stop with throwing insane amounts of money at some people that worked at 7-11.
So someone who works at 7-11 is somehow less of a person than someone who is a CEO?
tuckergustav
...
+1,590|6330|...

Wreckognize wrote:

mcjagdflieger wrote:

I speculate he should probably end up in jail for what he did, and the lawyer should accompany him. Payoff for family? Sure, toss them .5 to 1 million bucks.  But 25 million? Who the fuck does he think the poor guy was, a CEO? Perhaps payouts for wrongful death cases should be determined by a persons average wages, abilities, their dependents etc, lets stop with throwing insane amounts of money at some people that worked at 7-11.
So someone who works at 7-11 is somehow less of a person than someone who is a CEO?
I was initially caught off guard by this too but if you think of it in terms of potential future income...the CEO would have been able to provide more money for his family than the clerk in the long run as long as they stayed on their current paths of life. The problem is..how could you prove whether the CEO would not have lost his job or that the clerk would not have won the lotto.  There are too many unknowns for it to be a legitimate way of determining damages...which is why lawyers like this scumbag get away with digging for ridiculous amounts.  They are vultures that use the loss of others for their own monetary gain...
...
Wreckognize
Member
+294|6901
Just because a person doesn't have or will make as much money as someone else doesn't make them less of a person.  You can't measure the value of a human life in money.
tuckergustav
...
+1,590|6330|...

k...you obviously want to look at it sentimentally.
...
SgtHeihn
Should have ducked
+394|6903|Ham Lake, MN (Fucking Cold)
They are asking for that, but the settlement will probably go out of court, and be for a lot less.

What the family should do is tell the people rioting over this to stop disrespecting his memory.
TSI
Cholera in the time of love
+247|6397|Toronto

tuckergustav wrote:

Wreckognize wrote:

mcjagdflieger wrote:

I speculate he should probably end up in jail for what he did, and the lawyer should accompany him. Payoff for family? Sure, toss them .5 to 1 million bucks.  But 25 million? Who the fuck does he think the poor guy was, a CEO? Perhaps payouts for wrongful death cases should be determined by a persons average wages, abilities, their dependents etc, lets stop with throwing insane amounts of money at some people that worked at 7-11.
So someone who works at 7-11 is somehow less of a person than someone who is a CEO?
I was initially caught off guard by this too but if you think of it in terms of potential future income...the CEO would have been able to provide more money for his family than the clerk in the long run as long as they stayed on their current paths of life. The problem is..how could you prove whether the CEO would not have lost his job or that the clerk would not have won the lotto.  There are too many unknowns for it to be a legitimate way of determining damages...which is why lawyers like this scumbag get away with digging for ridiculous amounts.  They are vultures that use the loss of others for their own monetary gain...
As far as the law looks at it, the CEO's life is worth more than the store clerk. Same way that a child's life is worth less than a 55-year old's Why? Future income and net worth. They don't take into account promotions or demotions or sackings or lottery winnings. Only financial position at the time of the crime.

Hence, 25 mil is way overboard. That's what we call an ambulance chaser, and they should be banned. Gives a bad name to the entire trade.

On the other hand, there's no way the BART or the officer involved should be getting off easy. No bloody way.

Last edited by TSI (2009-01-08 14:02:50)

I like pie.
TSI
Cholera in the time of love
+247|6397|Toronto
source

(CNN) -- Protests erupted shortly after a young man killed by a subway police officer was laid to rest in Oakland on Wednesday night, according to local media and iReporters.
Oscar Grant, 22, was killed January 1 in a shooting at a subway station in California's Bay Area.

The Oakland Police Department made 105 arrests, including a mass arrest of about 80 people at 11 p.m., said Officer Jeff Thomason. The charges include inciting a riot, vandalism, assault on a police officer and unlawful assembly, he said.

One officer was injured, but not seriously, Thomason said.

Footage from CNN affiliate KTVU-TV showed demonstrators rampaging through the streets of Oakland, California, protesting the death of Oscar Grant, a 22-year-old father who was killed on New Year's Day in a crowded train station.

Some protesters lay on their stomachs, saying they were showing solidarity with Grant, who was shot in the back as he was face-down on the floor at a train station.

Several witnesses caught the incident on camera, and there have been numerous demonstrations this week. The protests turned violent Wednesday night after Grant's funeral and following an announcement by authorities that Officer Johannes Mehserle, who is implicated in the shooting, had turned in his resignation.

Videos from witnesses show Mehserle shoot Grant in the back as another Bay Area Rapid Transit officer kneels on Grant. A BART spokesman has said there is more to the story than what can be seen on the grainy images.

Oakland police tried to keep protesters at bay Wednesday night as they smashed car windshields and storefront windows. KTVU footage shows one protester jumping up and down on a police car hood, while another demonstrator pushes a flaming Dumpster up against it.

"We live a life of fear, and we want them to be afraid tonight," an unnamed female protester said.

The protests began peacefully about 3:30 p.m. with about 500 people gathering at the Fruitvale station where the shooting occurred last week, Thomason said.

Soon, a group of about 150 protesters surrounded a police officer. Fearing for his safety, Thomason said, "the decision was made to use chemical agents to protect that police officer."

The crowd calmed down, but then a contingent of protesters turned violent again, smashing windows and setting cars on fire, he said. Police tried to disperse the crowd and warned five times that anyone who didn't leave would be arrested.

At about 8:30 p.m. police started making arrests. One person was arrested after carrying a firearm; another faces charges of possessing suspected crack cocaine, Thomason said.

The crowd finally dispersed about 11 p.m. after police hemmed in a crowd of rowdy protesters at the downtown intersection of 20th Street and Broadway. There, police cuffed 80 protesters, Thomason said.

"If people want to peacefully protest, we're all for that," he said. "If it's peaceful, we're all for it. We're not going to stand in the way of people saying what they want to say."

This was not the case Wednesday night, Thomason said, warning that police would be out in force again Thursday night to make sure any protests remain orderly.

David Chai, chief of staff for Oakland Mayor Ron Dellums, said Dellums was "out and about" in the streets Wednesday, urging protesters to exercise their frustration productively. Dellums also announced that the Oakland Police Department was conducting its own investigation into the matter.

"The mayor's involvement was essentially to try to calm everybody down," Chai said. "He obviously expressed some frustration with the process."

He said Oakland residents also were "rightfully" frustrated that the investigation has gone on for a week with little development.

Thomason said Oakland police will either work alongside BART in its investigation or take the probe over, but no decisions have been made.

Last edited by TSI (2009-01-08 14:47:55)

I like pie.
san4
The Mas
+311|7104|NYC, a place to live

TSI wrote:

As far as the law looks at it, the CEO's life is worth more than the store clerk. Same way that a child's life is worth less than a 55-year old's Why? Future income and net worth. They don't take into account promotions or demotions or sackings or lottery winnings. Only financial position at the time of the crime.

Hence, 25 mil is way overboard. That's what we call an ambulance chaser, and they should be banned. Gives a bad name to the entire trade.

On the other hand, there's no way the BART or the officer involved should be getting off easy. No bloody way.
First, that's not what we call an ambulance chaser. Second, what is wrong with asking for $25 million? It sounds like you've never done any adversarial bargaining. If $25 million is too much the defense counsel, the defendant, a jury, a judge or an appellate court will reduce the amount ultimately awarded. $25 million is an opening offer in a very long process.

In any case, making a big demand doesn't hurt anyone. No one in this thread has explained what is wrong with merely asking for a large amount of money. Anyone care to try?
mcjagdflieger
Champion of Dueling Rectums
+26|6727|South Jersey
Perhaps the lawyer, who is only out for personal gain(most likely), would be a more respected, reputable man if he were more realistic. Im not saying he cant ask for a shitload of money. I'm saying he is a wart on the ass of society for asking for that much dough.
mcjagdflieger
Champion of Dueling Rectums
+26|6727|South Jersey

Wreckognize wrote:

Just because a person doesn't have or will make as much money as someone else doesn't make them less of a person.  You can't measure the value of a human life in money.
I didn't say it made him less of a person, it's just the facts of life. Some people earn more money than others, therefore when they are wrongfully not there to financially support their dependents, it is owed to those people. You know what, fuck it, this isn't the god damn lottery. These are decisions that need to be carefully thought out, this money comes from somewhere for christ sake, we can't just spin the wheel and pay the fuck out.
san4
The Mas
+311|7104|NYC, a place to live

mcjagdflieger wrote:

Perhaps the lawyer, who is only out for personal gain(most likely), would be a more respected, reputable man if he were more realistic. Im not saying he cant ask for a shitload of money. I'm saying he is a wart on the ass of society for asking for that much dough.
So you don't like the fundamental basis of capitalism? Stuff gets done because people want money.

And you have no evidence the lawyer is only out for personal gain. In fact it looks like he's trying to get justice for a poor family that was totally fucked over by the cops. I don't know if that motivates him, but it's reasonable to believe it does, given that he's chosen this line of work. In any case, it's a good thing for society when lawyers fight for people who can't fight for themselves.

And finally, asking for a large amount is part of the process. The lawyer is being totally realistic because he knows how the process works. He'd have to be in a dreamworld to ask for a low number at the start and expect to end up with that amount. Starting with too low a demand could mean the lawyers' clients would get almost nothing.

Even if the amount is too high, you still haven't explained who gets hurt when a lawyer says "my client deserves $25 million."
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7017|132 and Bush





Xbone Stormsurgezz
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6821|North Carolina
It's Oakland....  California's Detroit.  What do you expect?...
Hurricane2k9
Pendulous Sweaty Balls
+1,538|6118|College Park, MD
I like how people are smashing innocent people's businesses and homes to protest this thing. Fucking morons, go torch the BART headquarters if you've got real balls. Then again, this IS the city where there were riots when THEIR OWN football team WON the Super Bowl. Oakland should be second on Russia's list of places to nuke in WW3, right after Hollywood.
https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/36793/marylandsig.jpg
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7178

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Oakland should be second on Russia's list of places to nuke in WW3, right after Hollywood.
agree...and san fran
Hurricane2k9
Pendulous Sweaty Balls
+1,538|6118|College Park, MD

usmarine wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Oakland should be second on Russia's list of places to nuke in WW3, right after Hollywood.
agree...and san fran
Once you get past the fact that 90% of the city are hardcore ultra-leftists (where I would look like a neo-con and lowing, well, lowing would be the second coming of the fuhrer) it's pretty nice.
https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/36793/marylandsig.jpg
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7067|USA

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

usmarine wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Oakland should be second on Russia's list of places to nuke in WW3, right after Hollywood.
agree...and san fran
Once you get past the fact that 90% of the city are hardcore ultra-leftists (where I would look like a neo-con and lowing, well, lowing would be the second coming of the fuhrer) it's pretty nice.
Sighhhhhh, I am so misunderstood.
Diesel_dyk
Object in mirror will feel larger than it appears
+178|6410|Truthistan
Wow that was a snuff flick... that cop murdered that kid

What's with all the whining about $25 million.
What would be justice would be for that cop to get the death penalty and the family to get the entire PD budget for the year, and all the cops should be given food stamps and forced to work for free for one year. The tax payers shouldn't have to pay a cent more than they already do.

All I can say is thank god for video cameras... I can only imagine all the shit that cops have pulled over the years and then lied their murdering asses off to cover it up.
Wreckognize
Member
+294|6901
The officer has been arrested.

source

(CNN)  -- The former police officer accused of shooting an unarmed man at a northern California commuter train station was arrested Tuesday in Nevada, authorities said.
Former transit officer Johannes Mehserle is charged with homicide in connection with the death of Oscar Grant.
Former Bay Area Rapid Transit Officer Johannes Mehserle has waived extradition and should return soon to California, said Undersheriff Paul Howell of the Douglas County Sheriff's Office.
tuckergustav
...
+1,590|6330|...

Wreckognize wrote:

The officer has been arrested.

source
Good...I feel bad for all involved...you can tell by the tape that as soon as the gun went off all the cops(even the shooter) stood straight up like "WTF?".  As I have already said...whether he did it out of malice or not...his job requires that he be in control of his weapon at all times...so he is responsible for it's discharge no matter what.
...
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7017|132 and Bush

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c … 15A08A.DTL
Arrested for murder?
California laws are screwy.. I don't know what will happen.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,991|7048|949

Kmarion wrote:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2009/01/14/MNM615A08A.DTL
Arrested for murder?
California laws are screwy.. I don't know what will happen.
It will be a highly publicized trial and he will be acquitted.  Probably get fired and a decent severance package.  California Uber Alles!
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7017|132 and Bush

tuckergustav wrote:

Wreckognize wrote:

The officer has been arrested.

source
Good...I feel bad for all involved...you can tell by the tape that as soon as the gun went off all the cops(even the shooter) stood straight up like "WTF?".  As I have already said...whether he did it out of malice or not...his job requires that he be in control of his weapon at all times...so he is responsible for it's discharge no matter what.
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/ex-cop-arr … -shooting/
..malice aforethought In other words, for Mehserle to be convicted of murder, prosecutors must prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he decided, in front of several of his colleagues and scores of witnesses, that he had had enough of this guy he was trying to handcuff and chose to end the struggle by killing him.
Xbone Stormsurgezz

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