BF2S Forums Typical liberal hypocrisy

lowing wrote:

Spark wrote:

lowing wrote:

and do you think it is going to get any better when health care is *cough* "free".


Most hospitals are for profit operations.

It has been for me *shrugs* (by that I mean me and my parents)

No Spark, it is not free, someone is paying for it for you.

We have private insurance.

But our private insurance is decidedly cheaper than what it would have been otherwise.

In any case I would much rather taxpayer's money be spent on healthcare than on something pointless like earmarking.

AussieReaper wrote:

Healthcare should a right, not a privilege.

I see, so you have a "right" to exploit another persons education, sacrifices, experience, knowledge talent. You have a right to tell a doctor that his career is under YOUR control, that he WORKS for you. You have a right to tell this doctor what his services are worth.

you are not going to believe this, but people become doctors for the most part because it is a very lucrative profession. Doctors like money as well. Ya heard it here first folks. Doctors like money. If you are saying you are taking control over a doctors practice, you will find fewer and fewer doctors. Why spend money to learn brain surgery if it is not going to afford you a higher paycheck? Why become a cardiologist, if their is no paycheck involved? You will drive all incentive away from specializing and research.

But wait, this is where you are going to tell me that they should do it all for humanity and screw the money right?

lowing wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

Healthcare should a right, not a privilege.

I see, so you have a "right" to exploit another persons education, sacrifices, experience, knowledge talent. You have a right to tell a doctor that his career is under YOUR control, that he WORKS for you. You have a right to tell this doctor what his services are worth.

you are not going to believe this, but people become doctors for the most part because it is a very lucrative profession. Doctors like money as well. Ya heard it here first folks. Doctors like money. If you are saying you are taking control over a doctors practice, you will find fewer and fewer doctors. Why spend money to learn brain surgery if it is not going to afford you a higher paycheck? Why become a cardiologist, if their is no paycheck involved? You will drive all incentive away from specializing and research.

But wait, this is where you are going to tell me that they should do it all for humanity and screw the money right?

How many doctors do you know? As in personal friends and not the one that stick his finger up your ass during a medical?

m3thod wrote:

lowing wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

Healthcare should a right, not a privilege.

I see, so you have a "right" to exploit another persons education, sacrifices, experience, knowledge talent. You have a right to tell a doctor that his career is under YOUR control, that he WORKS for you. You have a right to tell this doctor what his services are worth.

you are not going to believe this, but people become doctors for the most part because it is a very lucrative profession. Doctors like money as well. Ya heard it here first folks. Doctors like money. If you are saying you are taking control over a doctors practice, you will find fewer and fewer doctors. Why spend money to learn brain surgery if it is not going to afford you a higher paycheck? Why become a cardiologist, if their is no paycheck involved? You will drive all incentive away from specializing and research.

But wait, this is where you are going to tell me that they should do it all for humanity and screw the money right?

How many doctors do you know? As in personal friends and not the one that stick his finger up your ass during a medical?

1, what is your point?

By the way, she doesn't do it for free. She has 3 kids and a mortgage to support.

Last edited by lowing (2009-09-03 05:45:47)

I think the Police be privatised - can't afford them hard luck.

lowing wrote:

Spark wrote:

lowing wrote:

and I would rather tax payers money be spent on what it is supposed to, infrastructure and national security.

You don't think governments should provide healthcare or education?

I thought they were the core priorities of a government.

Fuck no I don't think govt. should provide healthcare outside taking care of those that can not take care of themselves, and as far as education goes, I think it should be privatized as well, and money earmarked for govt. education be redistributed in the form of vouchers so  paraent has a choice on where to get education for their kids, instead ofthe govt. forcing kids into schools based on their location and not their quality

Umm... can I read into this and say you distinguish between emergency and elective care? For example, cosmetic surgery vs. collapsing with a freak viral infection (that was great fun that botched spinal tap FTW)?

As for the second part, expand please, I don't quite get you. How are you going to avoid certain schools collapsing under the pressure of everyone trying to enrol in them and resulting in greatly reduced enrolment rates OR much poorer education when people are forced into poorer quality schools out of natural competition?

lowing wrote:

Nice try, providing security for citizens and law enforcement is also a function of govt.

Yawn so is healthcare in many countries.

Reaper wrote:

You are not going to believe this, but most doctors aren't in it for the money. They are in it to help people. You ever heard of the hippocratic oath?

I know a good number who are in it solely for the money.

AussieReaper wrote:

lowing wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

Healthcare should a right, not a privilege.

I see, so you have a "right" to exploit another persons education, sacrifices, experience, knowledge talent. You have a right to tell a doctor that his career is under YOUR control, that he WORKS for you. You have a right to tell this doctor what his services are worth.

you are not going to believe this, but people become doctors for the most part because it is a very lucrative profession. Doctors like money as well. Ya heard it here first folks. Doctors like money. If you are saying you are taking control over a doctors practice, you will find fewer and fewer doctors. Why spend money to learn brain surgery if it is not going to afford you a higher paycheck? Why become a cardiologist, if their is no paycheck involved? You will drive all incentive away from specializing and research.

But wait, this is where you are going to tell me that they should do it all for humanity and screw the money right?

Yeah because people get sick and require medical attention just so they can exploit the system on purpose.

Of course you have the right to tell a doctor what his services are worth. Every consumer of any good or service controls the price, otherwise that business sees no customers. Supply and demand. However, with health care, you don't have a choice on the demand side. It's not that you want health care. You need it.

You are not going to believe this, but most doctors aren't in it for the money. They are in it to help people. You ever heard of the hippocratic oath?

One of the basic principals is that the patients welfare is first and foremost the concern of the doctor. Not whether or not that patient has a fat enough wallet to be treated first.

And if the doctors want money, that's what universal health care offers. Tax payer funded services. Doctors get money. Patients get treated.

Really? So you think you are in control of a doctors worth? Tell ya what, start negotiating with your doctor when you are diagnosed with cancer and tell me how you much YOU stick HIM for.

You are naive, if the profession did not pay you would not have a fraction of the doctors you have now, nor the advancements in R AND D.

Yeah and if a doctor wants more money and is worth more money UHC is NOT the way to go.


UNC yeah no thanks

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healt … e-NHS.html

Anyone who wants to put "Core Services" like Health & Education in private hands is certifiable and deserves neither.

lowing wrote:

BN wrote:

Anyone who wants to put "Core Services" like Health & Education in private hands is certifiable and deserves neither.

Health care is not a core service. Education can be better served through competition and not by the govt.

I disagree.

lowing wrote:

Or did you ever wonder why even home schooled kids fair better than govt. educated kids. Probably not. Govt., apparently is your answer to everything.

Source of your claim?

Government is the answer to solutions that cannot and should not be provide by public enterprise.

Companies cannot be trusted. They are run to make profit for their shareholders. Companies bring in CEO's with such short sightedness that all they seems focused on is share price and profits, not things like customer service.

BN wrote:

lowing wrote:

BN wrote:

Anyone who wants to put "Core Services" like Health & Education in private hands is certifiable and deserves neither.

Health care is not a core service. Education can be better served through competition and not by the govt.

I disagree.

lowing wrote:

Or did you ever wonder why even home schooled kids fair better than govt. educated kids. Probably not. Govt., apparently is your answer to everything.

Source of your claim?

Government is the answer to solutions that cannot and should not be provide by public enterprise.

Companies cannot be trusted. They are run to make profit for their shareholders. Companies bring in CEO's with such short sightedness that all they seems focused on is share price and profits, not things like customer service.

What a revalation, companies are in business to make a profit, HOW dare they!!! and in doing so they grow and provide jobs for the rest of us.

you are in control of customer service, if you do not like they way you were treated go somewhere else and increase their profits. Oh wait, can't be making profits I guess.


A post like this is what I would expect from Aussie

lowing wrote:

Then maybe you can explain why Canadan doctors come to the US to practice medicine.

A change in lifestyle. More demand - US has a greater population. They want to taste Budweiser. They have family in the states.


Let's just try a hypothetical, who should pay for a man that is in the lowest bracket of income earners, say a janitor at a school, when he contracts cancer? No family to turn to, he hasn't been able to save much because he is in the low percentile of earners. Should he be told he can't foot the bill and should die quietly?

Where does your user pay system find the justice in that?

Thanks for answering, that is really insightful in to how your system is obviously so great.