pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario
Fri. Apr. 16/10                                Pace51

Real World War 2 Facts about the Messerschmitt Me262

Maiden Flight: July 18, 1942
Max. Speed: 870 KpH
Powered By: Dual Junkers 900 Kg thrust Jumo 004B-1 Turbojets.
Armament: Four 30mm nose mounted cannon, and 12 air-to-air rockets under the wings.
Country: Germany

https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/52201/800px-Messerschmitt_Me_262_Schwable.jpg

     This was the aircraft your history teacher used to mention when they talked about Germany having phenomenally advanced weaponry that could have won the war. The V2 rocket, Frankfurters (tasty), and this. It was the world first operational jetfighter. Many Germans, and historians today, believed it was a war winner. However, extensive allied bombing campaigns ravaged the plants where these were being manufactured.

     In late 1938, design work started on this aircraft. It looked great on paper, but it wouldn’t be flown until the prototype came out, 4 years later, and even then, it wouldn’t be frequently used. Messerschmitt’s incredibly famous and deadly Bf109 would control the skies until then. It had amazing revolutionary gas turbines, manufactured by BMW.

     The piston engine remained in the nose of this aircraft, and the aircraft was forced to take off using all three engines, for safety. Now, this was the best aircraft of the Third Reich, and when Germany’s even more advanced Me163 Komet came along, this mean, green(It carried a camouflage similar to that of certain focke-wulfe FW-190D’s, will research technicalities.) Fighting machine was actively taking on the allies. It was the first Jetfighter to fight in combat, when engaged a British Mosquito fly recon over Munich.

     One major problem of the Me262 was this. It was too fast. Now, speed is good and all, but put in to mind that Germany did what Windows did with Vista, and released early because they were pressured. Also keep in mind that speeding up its production means scientist’s are bound to overlook important details. Well, here’s the problem. Well, both problems. One, its speed meant that taking this aircraft too far, which happened a lot in dogfight’s, meant that its wings had a tendency to COME RIGHT OFF. That is very bad. You lose complete control. Try flying with your tailfin and elevator. Secondly, the engines? They were ridiculously unreliable, shutting down mid-dogfight. Sure, you can glide a bit, and then parachute out… if the Spitfire who’s pals you killed decides to let you go. The undercarriage? Collapse prone. The guns? Jamfestival.

     However, the main reason these weren’t able to turn the tide of the war, and they were very close to doing this, was that a lack of resource and vicious Allied bombing campaigns blew the manufacturing plants off the face of the Earth. 1400 were produced by VE (Victory in Europe) day. Only 300 saw combat action. The allies bombed hundreds of them out of commission. However, when I say it couldv’e one the war, I’m not panic-mongering. It was superior to every other aircraft in every way. Even when Britain’s Gloster company produced the Meteor jetfighter, the Me-262 was the king of the skies… if it was up there, with its wings still attached.

     However, as the war wore on, even though Hitler bragged about this aircraft, Germany focused on improving the already active Bf109 and BF110 aircraft. However, ace Adolf Galland managed to speed up aircraft production after flying it and proclaiming it remarkable. But Germany was short on fuel, resources, supplies, manpower, and aces. As many of you military strategists reading this article will recognize, having a nifty new weapon doesn’t always mean you can use it.

     No Me262 ever fought a Gloster meteor. In March 18-21, 1945, more than 40 campaigns were flown by Me262’s. It was far too late to salvage the German War Machine, so these caused damaged, but only slowed the inevitable. Two seater radar-equipped night fighters and new engine improvements rolled off the production lines.
I will post and F-14 guide, and hopefully an F-16 and Mig-29 guide in the furture. Aand maybe an A6M zero guide.

Me-262. Discuss.

Last edited by pace51 (2010-04-16 14:19:21)

loubot
O' HAL naw!
+470|6985|Columbus, OH
PICS!!11!!!   /headslam
pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario
In The Afternoon
I Promise
-Sh1fty-
plundering yee booty
+510|5880|Ventura, California
Sort of reminds me of J10 whores on wake. Sure they were devastating, but they would never get off the ground if a good F35B pilot was up.
And above your tomb, the stars will belong to us.
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|7082|Canberra, AUS
so as with much late-war german technology, technologically superb and extremely advanced... but somewhat useless because of cost?
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario
Yes.
RTHKI
mmmf mmmf mmmf
+1,746|7144|Cinncinatti
I never knew the Me262 had so many problems lol

since i cant karma you pace ill say it here

Spark wrote:

so as with much late-war german technology, technologically superb and extremely advanced... but somewhat useless because of cost?
this makes me want real world facts about some of the nazi designs from ww2 that never got off the ground because of cost, resources, time. i have heard of some but dont know much about them.. i think one was a vtol prototype.


also, tbh. by reading these guides/comments i learn stuff about planes i never would have bothered googleing.
https://i.imgur.com/tMvdWFG.png
-Sh1fty-
plundering yee booty
+510|5880|Ventura, California
I want a Ratte 1000 guide
And above your tomb, the stars will belong to us.
pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario

RTHKI wrote:

I never knew the Me262 had so many problems lol

since i cant karma you pace ill say it here

Spark wrote:

so as with much late-war german technology, technologically superb and extremely advanced... but somewhat useless because of cost?
this makes me want real world facts about some of the nazi designs from ww2 that never got off the ground because of cost, resources, time. i have heard of some but dont know much about them.. i think one was a vtol prototype.


also, tbh. by reading these guides/comments i learn stuff about planes i never would have bothered googleing.
I'll do a guide to the ME163 Komet.
And the V2 and V1 rockets.
Aand germany's Jetcopter. This thing existed.
And maybe a guide on the "Dornier do Pfiel"
nukchebi0
Пушкин, наше всё
+387|6731|New Haven, CT
You forgot the part about Hitler delaying production for two years because he wanted it to drop bombs.
pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario
i DID! yEAH... LOL And it ended up... not dropping bombs.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,822|6513|eXtreme to the maX
The piston engine remained in the nose of this aircraft, and the aircraft was forced to take off using all three engines, for safety.
Wut?
Fuck Israel
Stubbee
Religions Hate Facts, Questions and Doubts
+223|7150|Reality

Dilbert_X wrote:

The piston engine remained in the nose of this aircraft, and the aircraft was forced to take off using all three engines, for safety.
Wut?
another great example of the thorough research of pace51 or perhaps his writing is unclear.
the prototype had a piston engine to first test the airframe and once jet engines were fitted kept as a safety during testing.

you say it was superior in every way, (which is total bullshit!) and yet your post points out all its problems. so which is it?

it had level flight speed and excellent armament but it was a terrible dogfighter as it could not turn very tightly. Putting the engines in the wings dramatically slowed its roll capability, It was essentially a boom and zoom fighter. Any other fight/flight profile lead to heavy losses. Pity the pilot who tried to dive away from combat for his plane would generally shed its wings or enemy fighters (P47, P51) could easily match their speed in the dive.

It was also very short range which let the Allies to ambush may Me262 as they landed.

It did lead to the design of the F86 Sabre which IS a fantastic dogfighting airframe as well as the MiG 15, 17 and 19 airframes. Therefore the Me262 had great potential.

Why do you persist on providing poorly written/researched posts inferior in every way to Wiki?

Last edited by Stubbee (2010-04-16 07:20:08)

The US economy is a giant Ponzi scheme. And 'to big to fail' is code speak for 'niahnahniahniahnah 99 percenters'
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,822|6513|eXtreme to the maX
It also had terrible acceleration so if attacked on takeoff or landing it was a dead duck.
IIRC In a dogfight a P47 could catch them, since their speed bled off and they couldn't regain it easily.
Fuck Israel
SonderKommando
Eat, Lift, Grow, Repeat....
+564|7066|The darkside of Denver
Pace.  I actually like your guides, but PLEASE stop making them without pics.
TSI
Cholera in the time of love
+247|6388|Toronto
I don't think the 163 was more advanced. In fact, I'd say the opposite.
I like pie.
pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario
The 163 was newer. Not more advanced necessarily, but newer.
pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario

Stubbee wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

The piston engine remained in the nose of this aircraft, and the aircraft was forced to take off using all three engines, for safety.
Wut?
another great example of the thorough research of pace51 or perhaps his writing is unclear.
the prototype had a piston engine to first test the airframe and once jet engines were fitted kept as a safety during testing.

you say it was superior in every way, (which is total bullshit!) and yet your post points out all its problems. so which is it?

it had level flight speed and excellent armament but it was a terrible dogfighter as it could not turn very tightly. Putting the engines in the wings dramatically slowed its roll capability, It was essentially a boom and zoom fighter. Any other fight/flight profile lead to heavy losses. Pity the pilot who tried to dive away from combat for his plane would generally shed its wings or enemy fighters (P47, P51) could easily match their speed in the dive.

It was also very short range which let the Allies to ambush may Me262 as they landed.

It did lead to the design of the F86 Sabre which IS a fantastic dogfighting airframe as well as the MiG 15, 17 and 19 airframes. Therefore the Me262 had great potential.

Why do you persist on providing poorly written/researched posts inferior in every way to Wiki?
Because I enjoy writing these. Feed back is appreciated.
Pancho
Rebmem
+6|5535|England
can you not indent? as a personal preference of mine i only like indented paragraphs when its hand written.  entirely up to you though, keep up the good work!!
pace51
Boom?
+194|5580|Markham, Ontario
Sorry, are you referring to stubbee or me?
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6818|'Murka

pace51 wrote:

Stubbee wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:


Wut?
another great example of the thorough research of pace51 or perhaps his writing is unclear.
the prototype had a piston engine to first test the airframe and once jet engines were fitted kept as a safety during testing.

you say it was superior in every way, (which is total bullshit!) and yet your post points out all its problems. so which is it?

it had level flight speed and excellent armament but it was a terrible dogfighter as it could not turn very tightly. Putting the engines in the wings dramatically slowed its roll capability, It was essentially a boom and zoom fighter. Any other fight/flight profile lead to heavy losses. Pity the pilot who tried to dive away from combat for his plane would generally shed its wings or enemy fighters (P47, P51) could easily match their speed in the dive.

It was also very short range which let the Allies to ambush may Me262 as they landed.

It did lead to the design of the F86 Sabre which IS a fantastic dogfighting airframe as well as the MiG 15, 17 and 19 airframes. Therefore the Me262 had great potential.

Why do you persist on providing poorly written/researched posts inferior in every way to Wiki?
Because I enjoy writing these. Feed back is appreciated.
Not the best dogfighter, but it wreaked havoc with bomber formations...once Hitler allowed it to be used for that. That was what prevented it from being a game-changer, not the other crap listed: Hitler's poor decision-making. He initially forced the Luftwaffe to use it as another "V" weapon (ie, a bomber), for which it was ill-suited (range, payload, reliability). In the numbers it was produced, had it been completely devoted to bomber interception/defense, it would have made the daylight bombing campaign nearly unsustainable, even with its shortfalls in dogfighting (escort fighters couldn't very well dogfight in the bomber formations). Fortunately (or unfortunately, depending on which side of the war you were on), Hitler changed his mind too late for the 262 to be employed correctly and make enough of a difference--and it gave the Allies time to develop tactics to defeat it.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Eagle
Togs8896 is my evil alter ego
+567|7038|New Hampshire, USA
Its actually a fiarly pretty airplane imo

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/82/Messerschmitt_Me_262_Schwable.jpg

https://www.militaryaircraft.de/pictures/military/aircraft/Me-262/Me-262_2007-09-WTD61_0136_800.jpg

https://www.dlr.de/en/Portaldata/1/Resources/standorte/goettingen/Messerschmitt_Me_262A_at_the_National_Museum_of_the_USAF.jpg

https://www.zap16.com/ILA2006/ILA06-Me262-replica-01.jpg

Last edited by -=]NS[=-Eagle (2010-04-16 09:50:18)

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