im liberal here.
oh yeah, forgot to answer the question. i don't like aligning myself with any political party but the one that most closely matches my views is the Libertarian Party. their basic belief is the same as mine: there is nothing more important in this world than individual freedom and it's always accompanied by personal responsibility
Last edited by FeloniousMonk (2005-11-28 23:24:48)
Independant sums its up for me, I guess.
Last edited by VirtuaLResistancE (2005-11-29 00:35:41)
lol, Republican
Yeah, the 2nd amendment is currently being interpreted to sell more guns. Yes, D.C. was once called "the murder capital of the world." I lived right outside in Vienna, VA during this time. And the reason for this was desperate, hopeless 13 yr olds were capping each other for drug turf or revenge. As Ice-T once remarked if this happened in your neighborhood (read white) there would be a national outcry. I believe this is true. I reference Columbine H.S. It was Columbine every weekend in D.C. We (Americans) turn a bind eye to these areas (New Orleans) of our country until they hit the front page, get international coverage and embarrass us. Until then everything is beautiful, wonderful and we're the best that ever was (and everyone else smells).
And I don't think 13 yr olds should have concealed weapons, ever (I'm a middle school social studies teacher). More guns don't make us safer. Laws and their enforcement make us safer. If you use a gun in a crime you should go away for life, no question.
I applaud the 13 yr old for an interest in politics. Hopefully, you won't be jaded, cynical and apathetic at age 18 and older as most of us are. Sorry to be the old guy, but your body and brain aren't mature enough and you just don't have the life experiences yet. You'll have to wait until you're 35 to become president. Listen to everyone (I didn't say you had to agree), read (for the U.S. start w/The Radicalism of the American Revolution - Wood) and watch everything.
Yeah, the Cold War was not bloodless, Vietnam, Korea, etc. Every third world nation who pledged their loyalty to one side or the other got armed to the teeth (How are those RPGs serving us now in Afghanistan?) and "advisors." (Growing up 20 mins from Camp David w/Reagan and the bomb over your head sucks)
But is that what makes us great? Our willingness to shed blood? I'd say it was the people who came here (the right amount of western influence/technology) our democracy (however corrupted it's become), our flexible constitution and equal treatment under the law (on paper), geographic blessings (2 oceans, large arable land, size), public education (don't get me started), higher education, etc.
And don't forget Saddam was our boy. OUR BOY. (We have pictures of him and Rumsfeld getting their groove on.) Just like the Shah was our boy in Iran (oh yeah, now I remember why the Iranians don't like us) and Noriega was in Panama, Marcos in the Phillipines, etc. (yeah, sometimes they get out of line, embarrass us, and we have b-slap them). And a lot of things we'll never know b/c the govt spends $billions to keep it classified.
You can't throw Mandela in w/MLK or Ghandi. Early on yes, but later he was strapped, literally. He was an old school C4 man. Hence, his life imprisonment.
The 2 party systems sucks. As does the electoral college. The popular vote should elect the president. Libertarians never want to pick up the tab. Never ever go drinking w/these guys.
Hopefully, we all aspire to be more than animals. Civilization, it's the way to go.
And I don't think 13 yr olds should have concealed weapons, ever (I'm a middle school social studies teacher). More guns don't make us safer. Laws and their enforcement make us safer. If you use a gun in a crime you should go away for life, no question.
I applaud the 13 yr old for an interest in politics. Hopefully, you won't be jaded, cynical and apathetic at age 18 and older as most of us are. Sorry to be the old guy, but your body and brain aren't mature enough and you just don't have the life experiences yet. You'll have to wait until you're 35 to become president. Listen to everyone (I didn't say you had to agree), read (for the U.S. start w/The Radicalism of the American Revolution - Wood) and watch everything.
Yeah, the Cold War was not bloodless, Vietnam, Korea, etc. Every third world nation who pledged their loyalty to one side or the other got armed to the teeth (How are those RPGs serving us now in Afghanistan?) and "advisors." (Growing up 20 mins from Camp David w/Reagan and the bomb over your head sucks)
But is that what makes us great? Our willingness to shed blood? I'd say it was the people who came here (the right amount of western influence/technology) our democracy (however corrupted it's become), our flexible constitution and equal treatment under the law (on paper), geographic blessings (2 oceans, large arable land, size), public education (don't get me started), higher education, etc.
And don't forget Saddam was our boy. OUR BOY. (We have pictures of him and Rumsfeld getting their groove on.) Just like the Shah was our boy in Iran (oh yeah, now I remember why the Iranians don't like us) and Noriega was in Panama, Marcos in the Phillipines, etc. (yeah, sometimes they get out of line, embarrass us, and we have b-slap them). And a lot of things we'll never know b/c the govt spends $billions to keep it classified.
You can't throw Mandela in w/MLK or Ghandi. Early on yes, but later he was strapped, literally. He was an old school C4 man. Hence, his life imprisonment.
The 2 party systems sucks. As does the electoral college. The popular vote should elect the president. Libertarians never want to pick up the tab. Never ever go drinking w/these guys.
Hopefully, we all aspire to be more than animals. Civilization, it's the way to go.
Last edited by makeuser (2005-11-29 02:13:46)
A gun certainly makes me safer. Laws do as well but in case you forgot, criminals don't obey the law. You mentioned Columbine...now imagine if just one of the teachers in that school had been a gun owner, a responsible adult with a concealed carry license. I already know there were some but the federal "gun free school zone" once again made a school a safe haven for a murderer. If just one properly trained teacher in that school had been armed (with no one else knowing, of couse...CCW should always be on a "don't ask, don't tell" policy) then maybe a few lives would've been saved.makeuser wrote:
More guns don't make us safer. Laws and their enforcement make us safer. If you use a gun in a crime you should go away for life, no question.
Ever heard of Joel Myrick? His gun on school ground saved lives and had he not been required to keep it off the property, it could've saved the lives of the two kids that perished because some nutjob kid thought his life sucked and played too much Counterstrike.
The other day I saw a commercial for the Discovery Channel special about the 9/11 flight that fought back. Now imagine if passengers, responsible law abiding citizens, were allowed to carry on board. Do you think that maybe a few thousand lives may have been saved? One flight fought back, perhaps the others could have as well had even one person been properly armed and trained.
You're right, as a whole guns do not make us safer. Guns in the hands of law abiding citizens do. I also agree that if a gun is used in a crime the perp needs to go away for a long, long time. Just be careful how that's applied because in some states if a home owner shoots someone breaking into his house, the homeowner becomes the bigger criminal. Is that right?
I agree; I cringe when I hear the word "bipartisan". The electoral college is iffy but I've had it explained to me why we'd be worse without it...plausible but still, the popular vote should be the deciding factor. Thing is, we do not live in a democracy, we live in a representative republic.The 2 party systems sucks. As does the electoral college. The popular vote should elect the president. Libertarians never want to pick up the tab. Never ever go drinking w/these guys.
Hey now, I always offer to pay at the very least my share of the drinks. :p Then again I'm not officially aligned with the party; I vote for every politician individually regardless of party.
It was our animal instincts that allowed us to climb to the top of the food chain and create civilization in the first place. To deny that is to deny everything we have ever accomplished as a species.Hopefully, we all aspire to be more than animals. Civilization, it's the way to go.
Though it would be nice to live in a world with no violence or suffering but that's simply not life. Violence is inherent to the universe itself and suffering inherent to life as much as reproduction is. But it's a nice thought.
Does anyone have any idea of how many percent of the allowed people vote in the US? I'm kinda sure it was below 40%, near 30%. If so why are you so keen to spread democracy to everyone else?
Not to take things too off topic (sorry), but seriously, there is no reason for anyone to have a gun at a school. You need to put away all your NRA/Charles Bronson/Rambo/SWAT team/Bernhard Goetz/Falling Down fantasies. Arming every "law abiding citizen" with a gun is insane, well trained or not. Most everyone in Mogadishu has a gun, but it's definitely not a safer place. We go no where when we try to out gansta the ganstas. What's the difference between us and Somalia (rule of law) and us and other developed countries where they have fewer guns (and fewer deaths by guns)? I don't believe in an utopian existence, but I also don't believe in fear mongering and the escalation of violence in schools. Since Columbine, suburban schools aren't as naive as they used to be and every responsible school has a contingency plan if they think a gun is on campus (I've been in plenty of lockdowns). You can't live in fear (it'll drive you insane) or walk around like you're the toughest mofo on the block b/c someone will always be there to challenge you (kid nature).
And we didn't climb to the top of the food chain by using our animal instincts... It was our ability to harness our brains. I see a lot of humans walking around that wouldn't last 2 secs w/a hungry animal, but they seem to survive and prosper at the top of the food chain.
Dial down the macho and the fear and I'd buy your drink.
And we didn't climb to the top of the food chain by using our animal instincts... It was our ability to harness our brains. I see a lot of humans walking around that wouldn't last 2 secs w/a hungry animal, but they seem to survive and prosper at the top of the food chain.
Dial down the macho and the fear and I'd buy your drink.
Am I the only one that finds the irony in this side splittingly hilarious? I'm sorry that you think giving up your freedoms is a better way to defend yourself than being able to defend yourself. I never suggested all citizens be armed, I just demand that the responsible ones among us who chose to be not be denied that right.makeuser wrote:
(I've been in plenty of lockdowns). You can't live in fear
Personal defense is a secondary function of our second ammendment. The main reason is to protect our liberty.
Our ability to harness our brains....brains that would've remained too small and simple to process logical thought and cognitive reasoning had our animal instincts not made our ancestors one day walk upright and thus have the ability to use weapons and hunt bigger game. Our brains weren't much before we became the dominant species. Even then we were still nearly wiped out.And we didn't climb to the top of the food chain by using our animal instincts... It was our ability to harness our brains. I see a lot of humans walking around that wouldn't last 2 secs w/a hungry animal, but they seem to survive and prosper at the top of the food chain.
Dial down the macho and the fear and I'd buy your drink.
You're right, most people wouldn't last long against a predator. Darwinism isn't about "survival of the fittest", which is an almost useless phrase to begin with. It's about adaptability. To protect those of the species that couldn't defend themselves, the strongest warded off predators while the smartest (often one in the same) developed technologies to make the job easier. The culmination of that technology: the firearm. No weapon is as easy to use, maintain, procure, create, and carry while being substantially more effective than other weapons of comparable convenience as a simple gun.
Get a couple in me and I most certainly loosen up. If you ever find yourself in Chicago I'll buy the first round.
edit: I apologize to everyone for taking this so off topic. http://www.lp.org/
Last edited by FeloniousMonk (2005-11-30 21:50:37)
That's pretty close Nehil, below 60% , I know and I am probably exaggerating, too.Nehil wrote:
Does anyone have any idea of how many percent of the allowed people vote in the US? I'm kinda sure it was below 40%, near 30%. If so why are you so keen to spread democracy to everyone else?
Who are you saying that "we" are "so keen" on "spreading"? Are we spreading democracy to Sweden (NOT SWITZERLAND), no neither. IRAQ and Afghanistan? Is that what you meant to say? Please I would like to speak more about your perception.
Since I'm only 16, I know I have much more growing to do in the world so I can get a better grasp of politics, but as of my opinions now, I really don't care about politics because from the way I see it, we can never have the perfect person or party in our country because of all the different opinions people have. Another reason why I don't really give a damn for politics is because when I graduate from high school, I'm going into the Navy and going to try and be a Navy SEAL, and whoever is the president, they're bascially going to be my "boss."
You're going to be putting your life on the line....why? If you don't care who's running the country then do you just want to be a SEAL because it's cool? I highly recommend you take a close look at what that job is about. You'll be risking your life for freedoms you don't even care enough to bother taking part in. People in the military more than anyone else should be concerned with politics, especially foreign affairs.AcEofSpadEs wrote:
Since I'm only 16, I know I have much more growing to do in the world so I can get a better grasp of politics, but as of my opinions now, I really don't care about politics because from the way I see it, we can never have the perfect person or party in our country because of all the different opinions people have. Another reason why I don't really give a damn for politics is because when I graduate from high school, I'm going into the Navy and going to try and be a Navy SEAL, and whoever is the president, they're bascially going to be my "boss."
Of course we can never have the perfect people in power which is why we have the freedom to vote in a variety of people that best serve the needs of the people. I believe it's everyone's responsiblity to take part in that. I'd one day like to see voting become required for college admission, financial aide, public healthcare, driver's licenses, or anything else that's government sponsored. In the same way that no one should be allowed to benefit from a social program they didn't put money into they should also not be allowed to benefit from ones they had no input in.
Folks tend to forget that we control the government. They are public servants chosen by the people to serve and represent the people. That does not mean that they're supposed to making all the decisions for us. You should care about politics, every citizen should. Nothing in this world is more important than liberty and voting is the epitome of that level of freedom.
Yea I know, I'm not too good with words and making myself understood on the net. But yea, by "spreading democracy" I mean't that some of the people who were (are) pro war against for example Iraq said that they wanted to spread democracy and that would be kinda of stupid when some of them don't even bother to vote. That's pretty dumb from my point of view, why bother when you don't even use your rights. Being able to vote is a huge honour. Making a choice, choosing who is going to decide your future. By not voting your spitting those who can't vote in the face.(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:
That's pretty close Nehil, below 60% , I know and I am probably exaggerating, too.Nehil wrote:
Does anyone have any idea of how many percent of the allowed people vote in the US? I'm kinda sure it was below 40%, near 30%. If so why are you so keen to spread democracy to everyone else?
Who are you saying that "we" are "so keen" on "spreading"? Are we spreading democracy to Sweden (NOT SWITZERLAND), no neither. IRAQ and Afghanistan? Is that what you meant to say? Please I would like to speak more about your perception.
(And often when I say "you" I don't really mean everyone in the US)
I believe that the political system in the US is a joke. A good analogy would be to compare to a program originally written for Windows 3.1 that has been patched several dozen times to run on Windows XP. It just doesn't work and needs to be rewritten from the ground up (even though it'll never happen).
As far as my political preferences... I'm a registered Republican, although I do not agree with many of the parties beliefs. I side with Republicans on economical issues. There is always a need for government regulations to protect the safety of the public, but I believe that the US government has gone in way over it's head on some of the stuff that it tries to control. I can't really come up with an exact example, except that on the general level it seems that the stuff the government should control is always lost amid the countless other things they should leave alone.
I also feel that our government overspends on social benefits. Many of the things are necessary, of course, but it's way too easy in this country to take advantage of welfare. The biggest problem is that it is intended to temporarily help those down on their luck. Instead, taxpayers end up supporting the irresponsible alcoholics with 8 kids and no job (sorry for the stereotype, please don't be offended).
On the other hand, I agree more with Democrats on certain issues. I'm not religious at all. I have no issues with religion, it's just not for me. I agree wholeheartedly with separation of church and state, yet no matter how much they claim to be, Republican politicians are consistently trying to push Christian morals into federal law. I'm all for abortion, gay marriage, etc. I believe a person has a right to make those personal decisions for themselves.
I guess that's a decent overview of my view on things. I don't mind a discussion on these, but please no flames, this is just my personal opinion, I do not claim them to be 'right'.
Enjoy , when I get more time I'll go through some of the other pages, I've only read a few on here, very good reads.
As far as my political preferences... I'm a registered Republican, although I do not agree with many of the parties beliefs. I side with Republicans on economical issues. There is always a need for government regulations to protect the safety of the public, but I believe that the US government has gone in way over it's head on some of the stuff that it tries to control. I can't really come up with an exact example, except that on the general level it seems that the stuff the government should control is always lost amid the countless other things they should leave alone.
I also feel that our government overspends on social benefits. Many of the things are necessary, of course, but it's way too easy in this country to take advantage of welfare. The biggest problem is that it is intended to temporarily help those down on their luck. Instead, taxpayers end up supporting the irresponsible alcoholics with 8 kids and no job (sorry for the stereotype, please don't be offended).
On the other hand, I agree more with Democrats on certain issues. I'm not religious at all. I have no issues with religion, it's just not for me. I agree wholeheartedly with separation of church and state, yet no matter how much they claim to be, Republican politicians are consistently trying to push Christian morals into federal law. I'm all for abortion, gay marriage, etc. I believe a person has a right to make those personal decisions for themselves.
I guess that's a decent overview of my view on things. I don't mind a discussion on these, but please no flames, this is just my personal opinion, I do not claim them to be 'right'.
Enjoy , when I get more time I'll go through some of the other pages, I've only read a few on here, very good reads.
I wholeheartedly agree. I've taken part in ever state and federal election I was able to since I turned 18. I believe that people who don't vote shouldn't complain. I really wish government sponsored programs were unavailable to people that didn't vote. Don't want to vote? Fine, no financial aid.Nehil wrote:
Being able to vote is a huge honour. Making a choice, choosing who is going to decide your future. By not voting your spitting those who can't vote in the face.
http://www.lp.org/issues/issues.shtmlJodah3 wrote:
I side with Republicans on economical issues.
On the other hand, I agree more with Democrats on certain issues.
Last edited by FeloniousMonk (2005-12-01 13:43:51)
Republican on the federal level and Libertarian on the state level. It all really depends on the issue at hand as far as being liberal/conservative.
I know I'll be putting my life on the line. I want to be a SEAL to protect the freedoms of our country and hopefully be able to bring them to others around the world. As for my view on really caring who the president is, I'm not really fond of who takes that job, because I'm not from a well-off family, and I've noticed that the lower class people usually seem like they get screwed over.FeloniousMonk wrote:
You're going to be putting your life on the line....why? If you don't care who's running the country then do you just want to be a SEAL because it's cool? I highly recommend you take a close look at what that job is about. You'll be risking your life for freedoms you don't even care enough to bother taking part in. People in the military more than anyone else should be concerned with politics, especially foreign affairs.AcEofSpadEs wrote:
Since I'm only 16, I know I have much more growing to do in the world so I can get a better grasp of politics, but as of my opinions now, I really don't care about politics because from the way I see it, we can never have the perfect person or party in our country because of all the different opinions people have. Another reason why I don't really give a damn for politics is because when I graduate from high school, I'm going into the Navy and going to try and be a Navy SEAL, and whoever is the president, they're bascially going to be my "boss."
Of course we can never have the perfect people in power which is why we have the freedom to vote in a variety of people that best serve the needs of the people. I believe it's everyone's responsiblity to take part in that. I'd one day like to see voting become required for college admission, financial aide, public healthcare, driver's licenses, or anything else that's government sponsored. In the same way that no one should be allowed to benefit from a social program they didn't put money into they should also not be allowed to benefit from ones they had no input in.
Folks tend to forget that we control the government. They are public servants chosen by the people to serve and represent the people. That does not mean that they're supposed to making all the decisions for us. You should care about politics, every citizen should. Nothing in this world is more important than liberty and voting is the epitome of that level of freedom.
So you help the situation by not caring about it?AcEofSpadEs wrote:
I know I'll be putting my life on the line. I want to be a SEAL to protect the freedoms of our country and hopefully be able to bring them to others around the world. As for my view on really caring who the president is, I'm not really fond of who takes that job, because I'm not from a well-off family, and I've noticed that the lower class people usually seem like they get screwed over.
I care about the situation, but I, as a person, feel that I can't change the situation at allFeloniousMonk wrote:
So you help the situation by not caring about it?AcEofSpadEs wrote:
I know I'll be putting my life on the line. I want to be a SEAL to protect the freedoms of our country and hopefully be able to bring them to others around the world. As for my view on really caring who the president is, I'm not really fond of who takes that job, because I'm not from a well-off family, and I've noticed that the lower class people usually seem like they get screwed over.
AcEofSpadEs wrote:
I care about the situation, but I, as a person, feel that I can't change the situation at all
What are those freedoms?AcEofSpadEs wrote:
I want to be a SEAL to protect the freedoms of our country
Those freedoms are the ones that the people in the United States enjoy everyday.FeloniousMonk wrote:
AcEofSpadEs wrote:
I care about the situation, but I, as a person, feel that I can't change the situation at allWhat are those freedoms?AcEofSpadEs wrote:
I want to be a SEAL to protect the freedoms of our country
Examples?AcEofSpadEs wrote:
Those freedoms are the ones that the people in the United States enjoy everyday.
Driving your SUV downtown, drinking Coke and use your Gatling gun for hunting?
To myself it doesnt matter anymore .. We havent had a great president since NIXON ..
They all cheat, lie and steal from us . . .As we have seen a few times in the past it doesnt matter who you vote for anymore. Your vote doesnt matter. they will put whoever has the most money and backing from the rich into office.
With all the technology we have now days, why is it we still use punch cards.Why is it not each year when we buy our tags for are veichals at the DMV, Secretary of State or whatever your state uses you to get our car registerd. Have a computer there the year we vote on, to punch who you want into office or whatever BS new law they want.
Again would it really matter they all lie cheat and steal.
They all cheat, lie and steal from us . . .As we have seen a few times in the past it doesnt matter who you vote for anymore. Your vote doesnt matter. they will put whoever has the most money and backing from the rich into office.
With all the technology we have now days, why is it we still use punch cards.Why is it not each year when we buy our tags for are veichals at the DMV, Secretary of State or whatever your state uses you to get our car registerd. Have a computer there the year we vote on, to punch who you want into office or whatever BS new law they want.
Again would it really matter they all lie cheat and steal.
I don't blame the President, he is there a short while and anything of significance that he tries to pass is just stonewalled by the crying kids in Congress, who care more about their next reelection than they do about passing anything worthwhile.CreepingDeath wrote:
To myself it doesnt matter anymore .. We havent had a great president since NIXON ..
They all cheat, lie and steal from us . . .As we have seen a few times in the past it doesnt matter who you vote for anymore. Your vote doesnt matter. they will put whoever has the most money and backing from the rich into office.
With all the technology we have now days, why is it we still use punch cards.Why is it not each year when we buy our tags for are veichals at the DMV, Secretary of State or whatever your state uses you to get our car registerd. Have a computer there the year we vote on, to punch who you want into office or whatever BS new law they want.
Again would it really matter they all lie cheat and steal.
I believe that most Presidents go into office with good intentions and quickly find themselves overwhelmed by the joke of a beauracracy(sp?) that we have.
And yes, it is a joke that it's 2005 and we still use punch cards.