BF2S Forums Kamakazi punishing

dsb wrote:

i disagree....as lame as it is, it happens....I especially think the -1 for enemy passengers is especially bad.  Think about what you are saying.  Leaving aside the methodology, which is more than likely accidental, you're basically saying that I should lose a point for killing an enemy unit.

Not for nothing, but I would bet that this sort of scenario is more often than not unintentional.  If you are a good enough pilot to crash into a moving target.  Then  you are good enough to shoot it down while you are pointed straight at it.  I don't see the logic behind just crashing and killing myself if I'm capable enough to kill the chopper without dying myself.

I understand that there are people who accidentally kamakazi. I've done it before, everyone has. But I've run into many people who do it on purpose, over and over and over, because for their 1 death they get 4+ kills, and it takes virtually no skill. And I think there should be a deterrant for kamakazis, cause right now their really isnt at all.

As a side note, if I'm flying a transport filled with people and a kamakazi crashes into me, often I get 5 team kills against me.

I've flown into enemy choppers a couple of times when piloting a jet (not intentionally - i just suck at flying) and the chopper pilot was always credited for killing me, while he and his crew were just "no more". For me the fact of being killed but getting no kills in return is enough incentive to try to avoid mid-air collisions...

I think that's a bit off topic, but, I agree with Rosse Modest, whenever I kamakazee (Again, unintentionally), I usually don't get a kill point, the other dude does.

Rosse_modest wrote:

I've flown into enemy choppers a couple of times when piloting a jet (not intentionally - i just suck at flying) and the chopper pilot was always credited for killing me, while he and his crew were just "no more". For me the fact of being killed but getting no kills in return is enough incentive to try to avoid mid-air collisions...

Wierd, pretty much every time I'm the chopper pilot, I get the exact opposite. The plane who kamakizied me is "No more" and either he gets credit for all the kills in the chopper, or I get credit for all the deaths as team kills. Either way, I get no positive kills.

BB|EyeSeePeeDude wrote:

also, think about it from the "military logic" side - if we were able to take down a helo of 5 people who were about to cap a base with the loss of only one life (*the pilot of the jet*), then that was a great military achievement - we took out an advancing enemy, saved a flag from having to get recaptured, and gave re-enforcements a chance to get to that flag to protect it from further advances...    (*not to mention anyone who would have been killed by the gunners en route to the flag*)

At the expense of a highly trained pilot, and a very very expensive airplane?

If you are going to present a serious argument, at least give him the respect of a serious response.

I agree with Dizazter.  Aerial Kamikazes should not be a part of this game - its cheap and there is basically no defense for it if you are the helicopter or whatever the kamikaze is going after.  Jihad Jeeping, while I dont condone it, is a bit more respectable because at least your opponent has a CHANCE (however small) of hitting you and saving himself.

Besides, with Aerial Kamikazes, you basically have no pilot skill whatsoever and you take that plane away from someone who could use it for what it is designed for, which is to SHOOT DOWN enemy aircraft or BOMB enemy targets - not use yourself as a multi-million dollar several ton missile.

And if you don't have the skill to shoot down enemy helos and planes and whatever with missiles and guns, as the plane is designed to?  Then stay out of the plane.

DrDestruction wrote:

If you are going to present a serious argument, at least give him the respect of a serious response.

I agree with Dizazter.  Aerial Kamikazes should not be a part of this game - its cheap and there is basically no defense for it if you are the helicopter or whatever the kamikaze is going after.  Jihad Jeeping, while I dont condone it, is a bit more respectable because at least your opponent has a CHANCE (however small) of hitting you and saving himself.

Besides, with Aerial Kamikazes, you basically have no pilot skill whatsoever and you take that plane away from someone who could use it for what it is designed for, which is to SHOOT DOWN enemy aircraft or BOMB enemy targets - not use yourself as a multi-million dollar several ton missile.

And if you don't have the skill to shoot down enemy helos and planes and whatever with missiles and guns, as the plane is designed to?  Then stay out of the plane.

Thank You!
I think too many people out there enjoy kamakazing, and just try and rationalize as a "legit strategy" of getting a bunch of kills for 1 death. Fact remains, it is neither realistic (not that everything in this game has to be) nor is it fun for the 5 people who die cheap deaths.

Hakiki wrote:

Dizazter wrote:

At the expense of a highly trained pilot, and a very very expensive airplane?

the pilot just took out 5 highly trained enemies as well as the enemy chopper...
its not an ideal situation but its way better than having your entire platoon killed cause noone takes down the enemies...

Damn Devil's Advocates.

Your all wrong....

The problem is that the Planes are overpowered.  How can you tell?  They are camped and people often get tkd to get planes [easy solve would be a vehicle lock-out on you for 1 min after you tk.]  But to solve the kamikazi crap i suggest.  They change the respawn time on them to reflect more world like conditions so they would respawn about 15x slower then tanks.  ie tank respawns in 30 secs.... planes would respawn in like 5 mins...  Jeeps 10 secs.  By increasing the respawn time you would in effect make them LESS likely to kamikazi, who wants to be give up a plane for 3-5 mins. 

In Addition make 'em land and STOP to repair & reload [giving anyone who got tk'd for vehicle a chance to even the score.]  A full repair should take about 2 mins.  Heat Seakers like we use now should give off NO warning and would function as they do now with the addition of 2 more missles for a total of 4 on a launcher.  They need to add RADAR missles which could lock up accross whole visiblle map.  These Radar Missles which would be on the same launcher and SHOULD give an locked on  warning.  Only 2 preloaded radars vs 4 preloaded heats.  This would reflect the modern battlefield and balance the game a bit. 

Right now a plane can strafe me comming head-on at an AA gun before I even get a target designator on him (although i have him sighted and visible) and LONG before i get lock.  Basically any idiot pilot can bitch you out with a strafe shot at max range with no skill, and you can't do anything about it  Even if you aim straight for him the Stingers arch up long before they reach him.  Another thing why is there no bonus for a plane headshot.  If a sniper headshots me I die.  If I hit a diving plane at mach 1.2 get wacked headon with a huge missle he gets same dmg as if i nicked his wing.  Just the kinetic energy would disengrate his plane.  Finally 2 stingers to bring a plane down is a bit much but i understand why.  To make it fun for uber plane haxor wusses.  But i suggest that any damage greater than 25% should make the plane either very difficult to fly [no turns greater than 1-2gs] Another solution would be to make the plane break-up at say a 3g turn with 50% dmg.  The problem is now the planes just do donut 7g turns after you hit em until you get bored.

I'm ranked top 40 AA in the world .  My AA or Air-Defense #s are predominatly not Linebacker camping those are solid static air def #s.  In my expert opinion they weakned the AA substantially from 1942 and it's not for the better.  The game is way to kind to planes after all the flight deck for IRAQ was 15k I believe.  The Apaches had a terrible time of it.  If you observe the Ambush at Nasar when the Iraq Irregulars inflicted 90% non-flyable Apaches in just a few short mins with nothing more than a Few AA guns and some HMGs.

But there ARE 2 sides of the coin. Just like you're FORCED to tk some idiot in front of your jet when he just dashes out, not ALL pilots are kamikaze.

I've been piloting more and more nowadays (since i've got my skills down pat watch my ratio go uP! It was @ 2 KILLS and 100 deaths just yesterday). And i find it hard to avoid choppers, ESPECIALLY attack choppers when i've got a bogey on my tail. Yes, its partially my fault because I fly towards enemy choppers when i can't shake the boy off my back in homes of a nice TK for him, but i sure as hell wouldn't give up my jet for a crummy 5 kills.

But what i can't stand is the wreckage *growls* i've hit the wreckage of more than a few blackhawks already... Gah... Lol.

I never knew that people felt this way about Kamakazi's until I was on this server the other day and I was in a Zhisheng-8 transport chooper when I came across a cobra attack helicopter. He was protecting the flag what was once our airport. So I rammed him and killed him and his co-pilot. I never heard any one complain so much in all my life, he demanded that I should be ejected from the server at once! On and on he went...

I have never Kamakazied before and can say I wont do it very often but when needs must I shall do it again.

It was also a very valid tactic employed most historically by the Japanese in the WWII.

I often fly as a jet pilot and whilst trying to blow the transporter choppers out of the sky sometimes get too close and collide (they are very hard to shoot down on one pass). I would much prefer to take them down via missiles and bullets, as I'm bound to lose my slot on the plane.

Its a very arbitary rule you saying it should be band. And how do you enforce it? If I accidently fly into you, and you scream Kamakazi, and get me kicked is that fair? maybe you ran into me and still cry Kamakazi and get me kicked is that fair?

I say leave the rule making to the making to EA/DICE or your server admin within the bounds of the server config. Not these arbitary rules that are open to abuse.

Last edited by Nuisance-Value (2005-11-03 09:41:26)

I hate when I am chasing another jet (from my CFS years, I know how) and a helo suddenly goes upward into the flightpath because they hear the buzzing , but I laugh when they get mad and call me names, especially when the game before this guy had 56 kills in a jet. It's really hard to get a plane/helo/tank anymore, if you do your team is shooting you to get it.