BF2S Forums Lets compare BF2142 to BF2 and POE2

bf2142 is still a beta you cant judge it yet until the full version is out period.

poe2 is alright but lost interest  to easy, to much armour for me.

DoctorFruitloop wrote:

Have you played it?

Nope, but i think they should wait longer and put more work in it until its release.

I hope all people who say BF2142 is a mod of BF2 sod off these forums now. All you are are annoying trolls.

Oh vengence BTW the weapons in BF2142 are not all mirror balanced, you are just a retard. The only ones which are are the Sniper rilfes, all other guns vary at least slightly in accuracy, damage, clip size, rate-of-fire, and other stuff.

Vengence = fail, quit trolling

Last edited by doctastrangelove1964 (2006-09-26 08:11:21)

4x2=8  Good math
7x3=28?  Bad math
4x2=21?  Bad math

Either that or I'm missing the point.

Apart from that good guide

*reminds self not to make guides at 3 in the morning*

fixed.

Tas3674 wrote:

um POE may be in its first stages, BUT SO IS 2142! like for instance in BF2 they added new maps so y cant they in 2142? and y do you need a large verity in heavy, light and aircraft, as long as they have 1 or 2 of each and the weps are made up for in unlocks. So 2142 wins in Nealy every thing against Bf2 and is lesser and equal to POE.

POE is in its first stages.  2142 has already gone gold, which means there isn't gonna be that much more content than was in the beta.  BF2 has 2 booster packs and an xpack that I did not include for this very reason, if I wanted to be truly bias I would have told about all the new maps and content POE will get for future versions, and added all the xpack and booster pack content to the BF2 list.  My point is, 2142 has less of everything but awards and unlocks.

Oh vengence BTW the weapons in BF2142 are not all mirror balanced, you are just a retard. The only ones which are are the Sniper rilfes, all other guns vary at least slightly in accuracy, damage, clip size, rate-of-fire, and other stuff.

Vengence = fail, quit trolling

Compared to BF2 and POE2 they are.  And yes I've played the beta extensively.  I'll wager you've never even played POE to see what true non-mirror balancing is. 

What i don't like about BF2142 is you have to unlock everything to do just about anything and that this time round unlocks = you're a better player. In BF2 it wasn't that bad and they were alternatives if anything else but when it comes to unlocking fucking shock paddles and rocket nade launchers then you have a problem.

I agree, they should have just called it Battlefield: MMOFPS.

P581 wrote:

This post is good in concept, but was written to support how the poster has emotionally perceived the games. Also the bad math, and a biased summary based on his inaccurate and terse comparisons are just completely unacceptable.

I'd say only 3 mistakes is pretty good for such a long post.

I Think all of the games you have mentioned are good for their own reasons and have unique qualities you could have touched on in your summary. You let your personal bias, and laziness get in the way of a good article. If you were to re-write this article with explanations of each statistic and how it affected each game differently this would have been a great article worthy of serious debate.

Personal bias?  Why yes, everyone has a bias.  Its impossible NOT to have a bias.  I was merely comparing the 3 games together, since they are all made on the same engine.  Now, would you explain to me how number crunching (because thats what my first post is)  became an article "written to support how the poster has emotionally perceived the games."  lol dude, gg.


For the record, I have greatly enjoyed BF2, the 2142 beta, and POE.  In no way am I saying "omg 2142 sux BOYCOT ZOMG!!!11!!11!"  I intend on buying the game and having fun before they patch fun out.  My post was merely here to show the number facts that EA and DICE are making less content and covering it up with awards and ranks.

bf2 or bf2142 is the best

Well said P581

Im so sick of 2142 whiners. :S
Sure BF2 was poorly managed.. but people learn from mistakes, the beta prooved that also the fact they are incorporating as mentioned other revenue passages means more support then BF2 and its mods.

P581 wrote:

VeNg3nCe^ wrote:

Now, would you explain to me how number crunching (because thats what my first post is)  became an article "written to support how the poster has emotionally perceived the games."  lol dude, gg.

Okay lets go over your summary.

VeNg3nCe^ wrote:

You get less maps with 2142, less weapons, less classes, less vehicles, and less armies.  And it costs the same as BF2.  POE has more than 2142 and its only in its first version.

It's pretty obvious that you wrote that statement with a bias against 2142, for whatever reason. I am not accusing you of being a troll, you just seem like you had an agenda to hurt the credibility of 2142. Those numbers could be used in many fashions, you just chose to use them in a negative way.

Instead of saying "you get less maps with 2142" you could have said, 2142 has more map options due to the added conquest mode.

Instead of saying "2142 has less classes" you could have said "2142 has more customization options."

Instead of saying that "2142 has less vehicles" you could have written "2142 has less vehicles to  better balance the game"

Instead of saying "2142 has less armies" you could say that "DI CE eliminated a balancing complexity factor"

As was pointed out before; POE is in its first iteration, but so is 2142. POE will die a non-funded projects death over time. 2142 will be supported for years to come, especially since they will have added revenue from ingame adverts.

As you can see it is very easy to take a number and make it mean what you want it to. I do not cling to this theory that "more is better" and I wish you had taken more time to think about what your statistics really mean. This could have been more than just a bunch of people criticizing your bad math and calling each other names.

Well said, maybe your right, maybe your wrong.  All these things can be interpreted in different ways depending on your particular bias.  As you pointed out, my bias leans against 2142 while yours (or the point you were trying to make, at least) is for it. 

Yes 2142 has a new game mode but the maps will stay very similar.  Instead of flags the CPs turn into silos.... not a huge difference.  So, although there is more variety and as a consequence, more re-playability, there are still less maps in total.  In my opinion this is a bad thing. 

2142 has less classes but has customizing options.  True, but if you really look at the numbers, around 20 of those things are stuff you should start out with.... things like grenades, C4, shock paddles, and sprint enhancers all have to be unlocked.  Each class only gets 2 primary unlocks, which is the same as BF2 only there are 3 more classes in BF2, so your really getting less primary unlocks.  I realize that there are slot 5 and 6 weapons that can be customized, which is great, but when you realize that half those items are vital to your kit, then it really breaks the 'create your own solder' image that DICE has been advertising.  Instead of '1500 unique combos!' your gonna see that one assault guy may have a defibrillator, one may have a shotgun, etc.  not much customization there.  Don't get me wrong I think variety is great, but when your at a huge disadvantage without those unlocks, it removes any skill that is left in 2142 until you unlock them.  New players are gonna get slaughtered without unlocks.

2142 has less vehicles and it is much more balanced that BF2.. true.  But, the game has been stripped down to basic vehicles that hurt the re-playability.  In BF2 and POE2 you can do anything, fly choppers, fly jets, drive tanks, apcs, cars, etc.  In 2142 you only have a handful of vehicles that are basically reskinns of each other.  If this is the only way DICE can balance the game then its a good thing... but if you take a look at something like POE2 and its intricate balance system, you will realize how awful vehicular combat is.  A good example is the hover tank vs tread tank.  This is a GREAT change and adds a lot of strategy and tactics to the game... instead of 'I have a tank and I'm gonna attack your identical re skinned tank with my turret and hope I win', you have to maneuver, guard weak spots, and corner your opponent.  If DICE could add non-mirror balancing to the game like this it would be a huge success in the vehicle sector.

I could go on but I think you get my point.... 2142 is not bad, but compared to what it could be, its a crappy product.  The game play is being stripped down to core elements and much of the spice of BF is fading away.

Haven't played it myself yet but i herd that to, apparently the helijet thingamabob  actually levels itself out when you come to the ground making it a lot harder to crash taking the skill out of the game. I can remember playing BF2 and for about the 1st 3 month i didn't go anywhere near the jet because i just didn't have a clue and it was only after some practice i got it right, likewise the chopper. So Ive heard that the skill ha been taken out of things such as this but i do like infantry as well so I'm willing to give it a go as its only £20, if it had been £40 i think i would be a tad more cautious

VeNg3nCe^ wrote:

Well said, maybe your right, maybe your wrong.  All these things can be interpreted in different ways depending on your particular bias.  As you pointed out, my bias leans against 2142 while yours (or the point you were trying to make, at least) is for it.

I wasn't trying to have any bias for the game, I was merely showing that anyone could write down a number  and use it for any means they wanted to. I have at least one gripe with bf2142 that I didn't mention because I was trying to make a point in fact I am about to agree with you, stay tuned.

VeNg3nCe^ wrote:

Yes 2142 has a new game mode but the maps will stay very similar.  Instead of flags the CPs turn into silos.... not a huge difference.  So, although there is more variety and as a consequence, more re-playability, there are still less maps in total.  In my opinion this is a bad thing.

I don't see how having more options at the cost of a few maps really is a bad thing, I mean how many of the maps do you actually play on bf2? Most people play like 4 or 5. I play Sharqi, Karkand, Daqing, Kubra, and sometimes Dragon valley. More maps means that the devs spread themselves thinner, and created messes like Zatar Wetlands, and the frag camping fest that is Jalalabad. I am all for 10 good maps over 14 so-so maps anyday. If anything the two modes will give us something to do when we get bored of titan (if that happens). I am sure the game plays much differently in both modes.

VeNg3nCe^ wrote:

2142 has less classes but has customizing options.  True, but if you really look at the numbers, around 20 of those things are stuff you should start out with.... things like grenades, C4, shock paddles, and sprint enhancers all have to be unlocked.  Each class only gets 2 primary unlocks, which is the same as BF2 only there are 3 more classes in BF2, so your really getting less primary unlocks.  I realize that there are slot 5 and 6 weapons that can be customized, which is great, but when you realize that half those items are vital to your kit, then it really breaks the 'create your own solder' image that DICE has been advertising.  Instead of '1500 unique combos!' your gonna see that one assault guy may have a defibrillator, one may have a shotgun, etc.  not much customization there.  Don't get me wrong I think variety is great, but when your at a huge disadvantage without those unlocks, it removes any skill that is left in 2142 until you unlock them.  New players are gonna get slaughtered without unlocks.

This is where I agree with you 100%, here is something I said in my review of 2142 beta;

p581 wrote:

"I imagine the people who are just there for the unlocks will be the first to stop playing this game. Simply because the unlocks lack any real personality. They have given the illusion of choice, but when it comes down to it, generally you are unlocking things you already had in BF2. The ability to throw grenades, the ability to run a little farther than someone else, the ability to use C4, ad naseum. On top of that you can't mix and match the kits, so you will generally end up unlocking everything in the class you like the most first. It's not like having an invisibility ability and RDX (C4) is a new idea. Already it's old and unimaginative. Perhaps the first person to unlock both of those things felt awesome, but you won't, because every other recon dude out there is gonna have both of those unlocks. Had they given the different unlocks levels of usefulness (ie, level 1 RDX does a little damage, level 2 is normal, and level 3 is hard hitting) people would have felt their efforts made their soldier more personal. I liken the unlock system to salt, I don't mind some on my hash browns, but I wouldn't just want to eat salt by itself. In the same way I would love some unlocks with my first person shooter, but don't want to play a game based solely on a slightly boring system of character advancement."

(source: http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?pid=741307#p741307)

VeNg3nCe^ wrote:

2142 has less vehicles and it is much more balanced that BF2.. true.  But, the game has been stripped down to basic vehicles that hurt the re-playability.  In BF2 and POE2 you can do anything, fly choppers, fly jets, drive tanks, apcs, cars, etc.  In 2142 you only have a handful of vehicles that are basically reskinns of each other.  If this is the only way DICE can balance the game then its a good thing... but if you take a look at something like POE2 and its intricate balance system, you will realize how awful vehicular combat is.  A good example is the hover tank vs tread tank.  This is a GREAT change and adds a lot of strategy and tactics to the game... instead of 'I have a tank and I'm gonna attack your identical re skinned tank with my turret and hope I win', you have to maneuver, guard weak spots, and corner your opponent.  If DICE could add non-mirror balancing to the game like this it would be a huge success in the vehicle sector.

This is purely a matter of opinion, I played 2142 and found that the vehicles were very much more balanced than ever before in the bf series. I am not talking about tank vs tank, I am talking about helicopter/j-10 vs all. If you've never been on a server where you can't get more than 10 points because 1 person in a jet has been killing you for 15 min then you know what I am talking about. Spawn raping in helicopters is just as bad on some servers. I never have played POE, so I am not qualified to talk about its balance issues, however I have heard that it is well balanced and fun. I am not going to debate that, or kick and scream because you like it more than a game you haven't even played the full version of yet.

VeNg3nCe^ wrote:

I could go on but I think you get my point.... 2142 is not bad, but compared to what it could be, its a crappy product.  The game play is being stripped down to core elements and much of the spice of BF is fading away.

And this is where I feel you are continuing in the vein of your first post, making a lot of insightful comments, only to add bias without logic behind your argument.

Anyway I feel like this second post is a LOT better than the first, and I am going to +1 you for continuing this debate in a rational and intelligent manner.

Last edited by P581 (2006-09-27 04:32:18)

Um...in 2142 there are two types of FAVs. Also, vengence, have you played the beta?

Superior Mind wrote:

Um...in 2142 there are two types of FAVs. Also, vengence, have you played the beta?

Screenshot?