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2006-11-08 18:23:29
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7024|SE London

kr@cker wrote:

if you want $10 an hour then get a job worth it. wow, you're 22, big deal. so the job that was worth 6 an hour is now magically worth 10, is your employer getting better performance out of the position for the sole fact that you're older now?
The point is that $6 when that was set as minimum wage was worth more. Minimum wage should rise with inflation. Everybody elses pay rises with inflation, the bottom end of the scale should too.

It has been shown that older, more experienced workers perform better, on average, than younger workers. Older workers are also more likely to have a higher cost of living.
2006-11-08 18:24:05
deeznutz1245
Connecticut: our chimps are stealin yo' faces.
+483|6935|Connecticut

jonsimon wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

jonsimon wrote:


No, he was totally right. Firms employing workers at minimum wage have slowly paid their workers less and less due to inflation, raising the minimum wage is intended only to compensate for inflation.
I did  say overall , right? Because you mentioned slowly, indicating over a sustained period of time. Which is what I said. I spoke about the "initial" impact in which I was right. I know this because I do it for a living. I am an asset protection executive and I deal with companies profit margins every day. Let the record please show I never had anything to do with Enron.
Yes, but you are casting it in poor light. You're making it seem like the employer is losing something, when the fact is that they've been slowly gaining at the worker's expense. The 'over time' or 'long term' part of the cycle is already over, the result needs to be an adjusted wage. Overall occurs as soon as the wage is increased.
Ok, agreed but why make it a federal mandate? That would be detrimental for many reasons but one in particular would be cost of living differences. I live in Connecticut where the cost of living is much higher than most parts of the country. Let the states handle it, not the feds.
Malloy must go
2006-11-08 18:24:26
kr@cker
Bringin' Sexy Back!
+581|6992|Southeastern USA
i see alot of posters on here that seem to be making min wage
2006-11-08 18:25:18
jonsimon
Member
+224|6937

deeznutz1245 wrote:

jonsimon wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:


I did  say overall , right? Because you mentioned slowly, indicating over a sustained period of time. Which is what I said. I spoke about the "initial" impact in which I was right. I know this because I do it for a living. I am an asset protection executive and I deal with companies profit margins every day. Let the record please show I never had anything to do with Enron.
Yes, but you are casting it in poor light. You're making it seem like the employer is losing something, when the fact is that they've been slowly gaining at the worker's expense. The 'over time' or 'long term' part of the cycle is already over, the result needs to be an adjusted wage. Overall occurs as soon as the wage is increased.
Ok, agreed but why make it a federal mandate? That would be detrimental for many reasons but one in particular would be cost of living differences. I live in Connecticut where the cost of living is much higher than most parts of the country. Let the states handle it, not the feds.
Yes, there is absolutely no reason to make a minimum wage increase federal.
2006-11-08 18:26:54
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|7087
currently in United States, Connecticut (state not a city)holds the highest minimum wage at $7.40 but the average is $5.15.
L.A might have the highest minimum wage for a city but not in a state.

Last edited by blademaster (2006-11-08 18:43:54)

2006-11-08 18:26:59
nlsme
Member
+48|6858|new york

kr@cker wrote:

i see alot of posters on here that seem to be making min wage
and they want $10/hr to flip burgers or whatever they do,im not gonna pay @2.50 for a friggin double cheeseburger from mcdonalds cause the kid behind at the grill wants those high priced sneakers
2006-11-08 18:27:58
deeznutz1245
Connecticut: our chimps are stealin yo' faces.
+483|6935|Connecticut

jonsimon wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

jonsimon wrote:


Yes, but you are casting it in poor light. You're making it seem like the employer is losing something, when the fact is that they've been slowly gaining at the worker's expense. The 'over time' or 'long term' part of the cycle is already over, the result needs to be an adjusted wage. Overall occurs as soon as the wage is increased.
Ok, agreed but why make it a federal mandate? That would be detrimental for many reasons but one in particular would be cost of living differences. I live in Connecticut where the cost of living is much higher than most parts of the country. Let the states handle it, not the feds.
Yes, there is absolutely no reason to make a minimum wage increase federal.
Agreed, that was what this post was implicating. Lets flame the thread author.   lol.
Malloy must go
2006-11-08 18:28:05
CC-Marley
Member
+407|7271

Harmor wrote:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe each state's ballot measure that raised the minimum wage, passed.

The question I pose, why not just set it at $10/hour?  Wouldn't that make all the advocates happy?
Wouldn't make the small business guy happy, or the employees he had to let go to pay more to others.
2006-11-08 18:28:09
nlsme
Member
+48|6858|new york

blademaster wrote:

currently in United States Alaska holds the highest minimum wage at $7.15 but the average is $5.15.
did you know if you live in Alaska you get a check from the state of over a grand annually as well?
2006-11-08 18:28:14
kr@cker
Bringin' Sexy Back!
+581|6992|Southeastern USA
even if it is graduated by age there is still no justification that every job in america is suddenly worth more at 22
2006-11-08 18:28:46
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7024|SE London

deeznutz1245 wrote:

jonsimon wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:


I did  say overall , right? Because you mentioned slowly, indicating over a sustained period of time. Which is what I said. I spoke about the "initial" impact in which I was right. I know this because I do it for a living. I am an asset protection executive and I deal with companies profit margins every day. Let the record please show I never had anything to do with Enron.
Yes, but you are casting it in poor light. You're making it seem like the employer is losing something, when the fact is that they've been slowly gaining at the worker's expense. The 'over time' or 'long term' part of the cycle is already over, the result needs to be an adjusted wage. Overall occurs as soon as the wage is increased.
Ok, agreed but why make it a federal mandate? That would be detrimental for many reasons but one in particular would be cost of living differences. I live in Connecticut where the cost of living is much higher than most parts of the country. Let the states handle it, not the feds.
That's a good point. In London wages (all wages not just minimum wage) are increased significantly, because f higher costs of living. This seems perfectly fair to me because London subsidises the rest of the UKs economy. Localising these things does work, in general.
2006-11-08 18:29:58
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|7087

nlsme wrote:

blademaster wrote:

currently in United States Alaska holds the highest minimum wage at $7.15 but the average is $5.15.
did you know if you live in Alaska you get a check from the state of over a grand annually as well?
hehehe thx didnt know, maybe those who complain should move there?

The Connecticut's minim wage is $7.40 for the guys who is from Connecticut planning to be increased to $7.65 on January 1, 2007.

My mistake on the Alaska one its Connecticut with the highest.

Washington $7.63 {Rising to $7.93 effective January 1, 2007}

Last edited by blademaster (2006-11-08 18:34:39)

2006-11-08 18:33:16
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7024|SE London

kr@cker wrote:

even if it is graduated by age there is still no justification that every job in america is suddenly worth more at 22
More experienced workers are better. There needs to be some sort of defining line. It is not a perfect system, but it's better than nothing.

It's worked in the UK. There was a huge government study when minimum wage was introduced, fuelled by just this kind of debate. Unemployment went down, productivity went up and benefit payments went down. The economy was boosted by introducing the minimum wage.
2006-11-08 18:34:51
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|7087
State     Level     Notes
Alabama     No minimum wage.
Alaska     $7.15     Automatically adjusted to remain one dollar over federal minimum wage should that change.
Arizona     No minimum wage.     Proposal on the 2006 ballot to create a minimum wage law.
Arkansas     $6.25
California     $6.75     Increasing to $7.50 on January 1, 2007 and to $8.00 on January 1, 2008. [1]

$8.82 in San Francisco. $9.08 with health benefits in Los Angeles, $10.33 without. [2]
Colorado     $5.15     Proposal on the 2006 ballot to raise the minimum wage.
Connecticut     $7.40     Increasing to $7.65 on January 1, 2007.
Delaware     $6.15     $6.65 increase in 2007, $7.15 increase in 2008. [3]
District of Columbia     $7.00     Increased on January 1, 2006.
Florida     $6.67     Rises with inflation.
Georgia     $5.15
Hawaii     $6.75     Rising to $7.25 effective January 1, 2007
Idaho     $5.15
Illinois     $6.50     $6.00 for employees under the age of 18
Indiana     $5.15
Iowa     $5.15
Kansas     $2.65     For employees over the age of 18 (applies only when the federal Fair Labor Standards Act does not)
Kentucky     $5.15
Louisiana     No minimum wage.
Maine     $6.75     Will rise to $7.00 in October, 2007
Maryland     $6.15
Massachusetts     $6.75     ($2.63 for service (tipped) employees, $1.60 for agricultural employees; legislature passed increase to $7.50 starting January 1, 2007 and to $8.00 January 1, 2008)[4]
Michigan     $6.95     Increasing to $7.15 July 1, 2007 and to $7.40 July 1, 2008
Minnesota     $6.15
Mississippi     No minimum wage.
Missouri     $5.15     Proposal on the 2006 ballot to raise the minimum wage.
Montana     $5.15
Nebraska     $5.15
Nevada     $5.15     2004 referendum approved to create $6.15 minimum wage; requires reapproval in 2006 to become law
New Hampshire     $5.15
New Jersey     $7.15
New Mexico     $5.15     $9.50 in Santa Fe, as of 2006
New York     $6.75     Rising to $7.15 on January 1, 2007
North Carolina     $5.15     Rising to $6.15 on January 1, 2007
North Dakota     $5.15
Ohio     $5.15     Proposal on the 2006 ballot to raise the minimum wage.
Oklahoma     $5.15     $2.00 for work not covered by federal minimum wage OK Statutes 40-197.5
Oregon     $7.50     Future Increases based on the inflation rate
Pennsylvania     $5.15     (Per act signed into law July 10, 2006, this will increase to $6.25 on January 1, 2007 and to $7.15 on July 1, 2007. For companies with ten or fewer employees: $5.65 by January 1, 2007, $6.65 by July 1, 2007, and $7.15 by July 1, 2008.)
Rhode Island     $7.10
South Carolina     $5.15
South Dakota     $5.15
Tennessee     No minimum wage.
Texas     $5.15
Utah     $5.15
Vermont     $7.25
Virginia     $5.15
Washington     $7.63     Rising to $7.93 effective January 1, 2007 with future increases linked to inflation, as per Revised Code of Washington Sec. 49.46.020)[5]
West Virginia     $5.85     Increasing to $6.55 effective 7/1/07 and $7.25 effective 7/1/08
Wisconsin     $6.50
Wyoming     $5.15
2006-11-08 18:35:09
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7024|SE London

blademaster wrote:

currently in United States Alaska holds the highest minimum wage at $7.15 but the average is $5.15.
Not the case. Minimum wage in LA is $10.33 or $9.08 with health benefits.
2006-11-08 18:37:13
SexyCabbage
One Shot, One Kill ... Always
+68|6922|Kentucky
10 bucks an hour minimum  that would be "heaven on a bun"
2006-11-08 18:37:25
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|7087

Bertster7 wrote:

blademaster wrote:

currently in United States Alaska holds the highest minimum wage at $7.15 but the average is $5.15.
Not the case. Minimum wage in LA is $10.33 or $9.08 with health benefits.
I know Look at the chart its on page 2 I said i made an error when looking at states average certain cities have higher but national is $5.15 where from state to state it varies.

Last edited by blademaster (2006-11-08 18:38:50)

2006-11-08 18:40:23
mcgid1
Meh...
+129|7159|Austin, TX/San Antonio, TX
Congratz to the forums, you beat reuters to this topic by a few hours...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061108/us_ … economy_dc
Don't think it will be $10.00 an hour though.
2006-11-08 18:40:31
kr@cker
Bringin' Sexy Back!
+581|6992|Southeastern USA

Bertster7 wrote:

kr@cker wrote:

even if it is graduated by age there is still no justification that every job in america is suddenly worth more at 22
More experienced workers are better. There needs to be some sort of defining line. It is not a perfect system, but it's better than nothing.

It's worked in the UK. There was a huge government study when minimum wage was introduced, fuelled by just this kind of debate. Unemployment went down, productivity went up and benefit payments went down. The economy was boosted by introducing the minimum wage.
that's why you have yearly reviews and get your pay grade boosted every year, if you're worth it. your argument fails in that you can go and take a job you have never done before (have no experience with) and miraculously become worth ten an hour. thank god i live in georgia, see above list (though i thought we had gone to 5.75?)
2006-11-08 18:41:34
kr@cker
Bringin' Sexy Back!
+581|6992|Southeastern USA

Bertster7 wrote:

blademaster wrote:

currently in United States Alaska holds the highest minimum wage at $7.15 but the average is $5.15.
Not the case. Minimum wage in LA is $10.33 or $9.08 with health benefits.
holy christ, health benefits?!?!?! oh wait, it's LA, explains alot.
2006-11-08 18:57:16
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7024|SE London

kr@cker wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

blademaster wrote:

currently in United States Alaska holds the highest minimum wage at $7.15 but the average is $5.15.
Not the case. Minimum wage in LA is $10.33 or $9.08 with health benefits.
holy christ, health benefits?!?!?! oh wait, it's LA, explains alot.
In the UK we get $10.19 AND free health care. Our economy doesn't suffer from it.

(Well, maybe it does - but our economy is still doing extremely well)
2006-11-08 18:58:52
kr@cker
Bringin' Sexy Back!
+581|6992|Southeastern USA
yeah but you get soaked on those taxes, i like keeping the money i earn to pay for my own stupid choices (87% chance i'll be dead of a liver related disease), not someone else's stupid choices
2006-11-08 18:58:58
Towelly
It's A State Of Mind
+399|7033|Your attic
Despite knowing only the basics of economics I can tell you that a massive raise (near enough 100% on the average) is a very bad idea for an economy.

Raise of minimum wage should be determined by the inflation of a countries economy and also in relation to the cost of living in said country. If such a raise was implemented then you would see;

1) A raise in general prices as legitimate companies are forced to keep their profit margins up so as to appease shareholders/brokers, this would cause the general cost of living to rise and therefore partly negate the benefit of the initial pay rise.
2) A large quantity of smaller town run shops will close down. This is because of the basic principle that makes large chains of shops so profitable, the prices are lower but the total quantity of goods sold will be much higher, so now the smaller shops (who are most likely already running on lower incomes) will be much harder pressed to make money as people will be put off by the large price increase and will be somewhat forced (see cost of living) to go to the larger shops that offer the same goods for now far less money.
3) Yes there would also be a large influx of immigrants, now this however can be seen in two ways, the first being that they will take the jobs of citizens and do no better of a job for less money. But the way I often seem to come to looking at it is that immigrants tend to fill in the void of workers for jobs that few people wish to do. The point on immigration is near enough moot, while the ones who feel that they can mooch of a system should be deported immediately as they server no purpose to the country of which they have chosen to move, the ones who fill in the above void are the perfect example of how immigration can benefit both the immigrant and the country.
4) Lastly as mentioned before this would further stretch the divide between the rich and the poor (both words used for want of better terms). If you currently earn $12 an hour you will see only a very small if any increase in your wage, but will see a much larger cost of living. Where as the guy/girl who earns $50 an hour will probobly receive no increase, but is already earning enough that the percentage increase in cost of living is much less, so is therefore a problem, but a manageable one.

In short, sudden increase of a minimum wage is bad, slow and steady increase which relates to a countries economic state is good.
2006-11-08 19:00:26
Elamdri
The New Johnnie Cochran
+134|7089|Peoria

Bertster7 wrote:

kr@cker wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


Not the case. Minimum wage in LA is $10.33 or $9.08 with health benefits.
holy christ, health benefits?!?!?! oh wait, it's LA, explains alot.
In the UK we get $10.19 AND free health care. Our economy doesn't suffer from it.

(Well, maybe it does - but our economy is still doing extremely well)
Yeah, but you guys have a progressive tax.
2006-11-08 19:01:31
kr@cker
Bringin' Sexy Back!
+581|6992|Southeastern USA
progressive taxation is the worst evil committed by one man upon another

"that'll teach you for working harder than everyone else!!"

Last edited by kr@cker (2006-11-08 19:02:06)

 

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