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2007-05-07 11:57:10
RAIMIUS
You with the face!
+244|6960|US
Some people don't know what they are talking about...here we see a prime example.

On topic:
It was a sad occurrance, but I doubt it was the pilot's fault.  If you are told there are no friendlies nearby, you usually run with that assumption.  In short, the system failed.  The problem with joint operations is that the communication systems fail more frequently.  That is something the US is trying very hard to fix.
2007-05-07 12:52:58
ELITE-UK
Scratching my back
+170|6719|SHEFFIELD, ENGLAND
70% the pilots fault, 30% the communication between the american ground communications and pilots.

No british here should be blamed at all!
2007-05-07 13:13:15
agent146
Member
+127|6632|Jesus Land aka Canada

sergeriver wrote:

I know sometimes it ends like this, but FF OFF is so gay.
indeed, its not a game, civilians pop up out of now where, shit happens its RL, its not like "i am going to pwn this friendly because i feel like it"
2007-05-07 16:31:31
blisteringsilence
I'd rather hunt with Cheney than ride with Kennedy
+83|6947|Little Rock, Arkansas

ELITE-UK wrote:

70% the pilots fault, 30% the communication between the american ground communications and pilots.

No british here should be blamed at all!
First rule of operating in a war zone. Know where the enemy is, know where your friends are. If you're operating with another army, you need to know where they are too, and you need to tell them where you are.

The British are indeed also at fault. The ground control said there weren't any friendlies operating in that area. Had the brits passed along the info that they were, in fact, operating in that area, authorization would never have been given.

Notice that the planes didn't just see and fire. They called in to be sure that there weren't any friendlies in the area. There isn't an IFF transponder for vehicles. They got permission, and they fired.
2007-05-07 17:07:27
CannonFodder11b
Purple Heart Recipient
+73|6935|Fort Lewis WA

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

kilgoretrout wrote:

=EXP= TMMTAKEN wrote:

It wasn't an accident... they should have flown lower and checked it out.
So, you're saying the US forces deliberately attacked a British convoy?
If I drunk 8 pints of beer, got in my car and ran someone over, would you as a judge let me off because I didn't "mean" to run anyone over?  Not comparing just making a point that just because something's not deliberate, doesn't make it a lawful accident.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/manslaughter
So the pilot was drunk?  Oh dear then that would not be an accident.  BUT, the pilot was not drunk and following guidance from the ground... Keywords: GUIDANCE FROM THE GROUND  walking him onto the target.
Maybe those cats just need to learn how to do some better terrain association, or how to call for air support. As for the use of VF17 panels.... There are tons of houses in Baghdad alone that have mock VF17's on the roofs.  They see what we use and they use it too.  They are not a dumb enemy.  Hence why we have stopped using just VF17 panels. 
I know of a lot of units that use CAS a lot. And Iron hits target not friendlies.  (Tal Afar = Specter Gunship 12 hours, 4 f16's, and 2 f14's.  Baghdad, Haifa Street 2 f15's, 4 Apaches, Shua'la Several Apaches,  and a Specter for 6 hours of ground pounding.) Not one Blue on blue hit, and most of it was marked as "DANGER CLOSE"
2007-05-07 17:09:35
m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6916|UK

CannonFodder11b wrote:

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

kilgoretrout wrote:


So, you're saying the US forces deliberately attacked a British convoy?
If I drunk 8 pints of beer, got in my car and ran someone over, would you as a judge let me off because I didn't "mean" to run anyone over?  Not comparing just making a point that just because something's not deliberate, doesn't make it a lawful accident.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/manslaughter
So the pilot was drunk?  Oh dear then that would not be an accident.  BUT, the pilot was not drunk and following guidance from the ground... Keywords: GUIDANCE FROM THE GROUND  walking him onto the target.
Maybe those cats just need to learn how to do some better terrain association, or how to call for air support. As for the use of VF17 panels.... There are tons of houses in Baghdad alone that have mock VF17's on the roofs.  They see what we use and they use it too.  They are not a dumb enemy.  Hence why we have stopped using just VF17 panels. 
I know of a lot of units that use CAS a lot. And Iron hits target not friendlies.  (Tal Afar = Specter Gunship 12 hours, 4 f16's, and 2 f14's.  Baghdad, Haifa Street 2 f15's, 4 Apaches, Shua'la Several Apaches,  and a Specter for 6 hours of ground pounding.) Not one Blue on blue hit, and most of it was marked as "DANGER CLOSE"
Dude you have so gotta so using that army lingo.  I haven't got a clue what half of it means.

GorillaTicTics is another one that loses me.
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
2007-05-07 17:12:08
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7007

BBC is just like FOX.  No mention at all of the British FAC calling in the strike and clearing the pilots hot.

/fail BBC
2007-05-07 17:16:26
CannonFodder11b
Purple Heart Recipient
+73|6935|Fort Lewis WA

m3thod wrote:

CannonFodder11b wrote:

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:


If I drunk 8 pints of beer, got in my car and ran someone over, would you as a judge let me off because I didn't "mean" to run anyone over?  Not comparing just making a point that just because something's not deliberate, doesn't make it a lawful accident.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/manslaughter
So the pilot was drunk?  Oh dear then that would not be an accident.  BUT, the pilot was not drunk and following guidance from the ground... Keywords: GUIDANCE FROM THE GROUND  walking him onto the target.
Maybe those cats just need to learn how to do some better terrain association, or how to call for air support. As for the use of VF17 panels.... There are tons of houses in Baghdad alone that have mock VF17's on the roofs.  They see what we use and they use it too.  They are not a dumb enemy.  Hence why we have stopped using just VF17 panels. 
I know of a lot of units that use CAS a lot. And Iron hits target not friendlies.  (Tal Afar = Specter Gunship 12 hours, 4 f16's, and 2 f14's.  Baghdad, Haifa Street 2 f15's, 4 Apaches, Shua'la Several Apaches,  and a Specter for 6 hours of ground pounding.) Not one Blue on blue hit, and most of it was marked as "DANGER CLOSE"
Dude you have so gotta so using that army lingo.  I haven't got a clue what half of it means.

GorillaTicTics is another one that loses me.
Thats cause im here with a 20 ton 8 wheeled vehicle fighting. www.strykernews.com
2007-05-07 17:19:02
CannonFodder11b
Purple Heart Recipient
+73|6935|Fort Lewis WA

usmarine2005 wrote:

BBC is just like FOX.  No mention at all of the British FAC calling in the strike and clearing the pilots hot.

/fail BBC
Yeah that video when origionally posted had american JTAC relaying for the brits troops in contact call.
there was mention of a orange marking panel. but they were walked into that with a danger close call.  When theres a call of troops in contact, and danger close (for an A10 gun run I believe Danger close is 200 meters)

Edit: for the most part when danger is close, units have the CAS drop a flare to verify that the target they are seeing at 200 +MPH is the actual target, sometimes though there is no time for that type of tactic.

Last edited by CannonFodder11b (2007-05-07 17:21:17)

 

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