BF2S Forums Diplomacy FTW!! (British Sailors Freed)

Kmarion wrote:

usmarine2007 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

I cringe every time I see Micheal Richards now. It doesn't mean we should start painting everyone one color.

People do not kill or outcast groups in society because of Micheal Richards.

You missed (or ignored) the obvious point. They do because of race.

People kill because of race also, I know that.

You really think that I think it is possible to ban religion?  I just wish I could.

Last edited by usmarine2007 (2007-04-01 18:44:14)

Naughty_Om wrote:

Hurricane wrote:

Naughty_Om wrote:

And cat's?

And Spartan sword fodder.

And awesome Video games involving Prince's.

ya but the "Persian Mausers" suck, the German K98s were alot better...

beerface702 wrote:

SAS?

what the hell happned to special forces in this era? a  bunch of ninnies? i mean seriously

they should be able to send in some SAS and just scoop these guys up

maybe i watch to many seal movies...dunno, but a full out war is kinda of dumb over this imo

The SAS go in when their told to by the government.  Their probably itching to go but the government is trying to solve things diplomatically.  Doesn't make them ninnies, I'm sure the seals or delta don't just wonder off to hostile countries without the presidents say so.

fadedsteve wrote:

Bertster I know you have a good head on your shoulders. . . but cmon

You know as well as I do that Iran isnt going to stop until someone MAKES THEM STOP! Negotiations, sanctions, UN condemnation does nothing. . .  The Iranians flat out dont care what the west does to them, it is plainly evident. . .

Tony Blair hasnt reached Jimmy Carter status yet, but if days keep going by, the Iranians stay emboldend.  It is a sticky situation, and I am not advocating an all out invasion. However, military force needs to show the Iranians we mean business, and this type of behavior in this day in age is unacceptable. 

In regards to relations worsend as a result of sanctions, military action, etc. . . . .Ask yourself how bad are the relations between Iran and the west are right now?. . . they're terrible bordering on abysmal!

Tony Blair isn't the driving force in this incident, Margret Beckett is and she's rubbish. Jack Straw did a much better job back in 2004 (that's not really true - he took very simillar action and the captives were released after a few days, it's really the Iranian attitudes that have hardened).

What do you expect military action to do? Do you think Iran will just lie down and hand over the prisoners? Personally I doubt it, I think it far more likely that they would be executed. Not to mention the international tensions that would arise between NATO states and China/Russia (both of whom have close ties with Iran).

Last edited by Bertster7 (2007-04-02 12:58:08)

Bertster7 wrote:

fadedsteve wrote:

Bertster I know you have a good head on your shoulders. . . but cmon

You know as well as I do that Iran isnt going to stop until someone MAKES THEM STOP! Negotiations, sanctions, UN condemnation does nothing. . .  The Iranians flat out dont care what the west does to them, it is plainly evident. . .

Tony Blair hasnt reached Jimmy Carter status yet, but if days keep going by, the Iranians stay emboldend.  It is a sticky situation, and I am not advocating an all out invasion. However, military force needs to show the Iranians we mean business, and this type of behavior in this day in age is unacceptable. 

In regards to relations worsend as a result of sanctions, military action, etc. . . . .Ask yourself how bad are the relations between Iran and the west are right now?. . . they're terrible bordering on abysmal!

Tony Blair isn't the driving force in this incident, Margret Beckett is and she's rubbish. Jack Straw did a much better job back in 2004 (that's not really true - he took very simillar action and the captives were released after a few days, it's really the Iranian attitudes that have hardened).

What do you expect military action to do? Do you think Iran will just lie down and hand over the prisoners? Personally I doubt it, I think it far more likely that they would be executed. Not to mention the international tensions that would arise between NATO states and China/Russia (both of whom have close ties with Iran).

Whoever is running the show in England needs to do something. . . .

Personally, serious sanctions, the total and complete blockage of funds into Iran might make a difference.  No country wants to be shut down economically. . . .That is of course if other nations want to cooperate and put THEIR OWN ties with Iran at risk. . . I'm not so sure some Euro nations, Russia, and China want to do that!

Regardless, Iran has gone unchecked for thirty + years. . . .Their actions are illegal/criminal, and they show no signs of remorse for supporting terror, or any willingness to stop terrorist groups.  They are ACTIVELY pursuing nuke weapons, for the sole purpose of a possible strike on Israel (which they have threatend), as well as a blackmail tool.  They have no desire to contribute positively to the international community in any capacity, unless it serves Iran first.

Frankly, Russia and China would be disappointed if we(USA)/UK were to attack Iran. For the most part I dont think they would want to mess with a united Euro/USA coalition, when its obvious Iran is wrong here.  And those Euro countries who would be against a strike are always going to be against military action, regardless if evidence proves Iran is the aggressor.

Bottom line, Iran is a criminal regime who has overstepped the international boundries over and over again.  They are trying to push the west the furthest they can push them.  Its almost like they are provoking a strike!!
Britain and the USA need to do something here, not capitulate!! Iran needs to be shown who is boss, and waiting day in and day out, does nothing.  Negotiations do nothing, because its obvious this regime marches to the beat of its own drummer! They want to humiliate and discredit the west powers. . . .I say we degrade their capabilities to wage that game of blackmail and humiliation. . .i.e. launch airstrikes on obvious Iranian military facilities/units, nuke plants etc.

They (Iran) need to be sent a message, and unfortuneatly the verbal/written message doesnt work with extremist regimes. . . Just like the bully in school. . .Sometimes you just need to kick his ass for him to stop being an asshole to everybody! Iran is a bully pure and simple, they dont give a fuck, maybe they would stop if you knocked out a few of their teeth!

Last edited by fadedsteve (2007-04-02 13:54:47)

See, diplomacy works. Best possible outcome.

Ahmadinejad wrote:

I'm asking Mr Blair not to put them [the sailors] on trial for admitting they were in Iranian waters

He's quite a character that Ahmadinejad, he does make me laugh.

Bertster7 wrote:

See, diplomacy works. Best possible outcome.

Ahmadinejad wrote:

I'm asking Mr Blair not to put them [the sailors] on trial for admitting they were in Iranian waters

He's quite a character that Ahmadinejad, he does make me laugh.

lol...

fadedsteve wrote:

The troops may have been released, but at what cost. . . . ?

Britain looks weak. . . .pure and simple

They capitulated. . . .Tony Blair essentially apologized to the Iranians. . .

side note: Its flat out unbelievable that the EU turned its back on the Brits. . . .I am starting to wonder if Europe has ANY BALLS whatsoever?

The honest truth is Iran is even MORE emboldend than it was when the crisis started.  The EU backed down, in turn so did the Brits, its really fucking pathetic.  Iran looks like it mercifully gave the troops back because some how their "territorial waters" were infringed upon (so they gracefully gave the "aggressors" back to their home country). . . I am not surprized the Brits/EU pussed out. . . . .not one bit!

Iran does whatever it wants with ZERO consequences. . .lets see what happens when they get a nuke and drop it on someone. . .will Europe give them another pass? Or sack up and confront a long time criminal regime?

bottom line. . . .European politicians make me want to make a fucking bowel movement!

No one backed down, as far as I know. Unfortunately this works just as badly for us, since it just makes the Iranians look generous. I hope the British didn't secretly apologize for anything, but even then at this point nothing but diplomacy would have been useful. Perhaps if the Iranians had held them for another week or two, then we could start turning some serious pressure on them. Right now, though, it seems like the Iranians played us like a piano.

fadedsteve wrote:

UGADawgs wrote:

fadedsteve wrote:

The troops may have been released, but at what cost. . . . ?

Britain looks weak. . . .pure and simple

They capitulated. . . .Tony Blair essentially apologized to the Iranians. . .

side note: Its flat out unbelievable that the EU turned its back on the Brits. . . .I am starting to wonder if Europe has ANY BALLS whatsoever?

The honest truth is Iran is even MORE emboldend than it was when the crisis started.  The EU backed down, in turn so did the Brits, its really fucking pathetic.  Iran looks like it mercifully gave the troops back because some how their "territorial waters" were infringed upon (so they gracefully gave the "aggressors" back to their home country). . . I am not surprized the Brits/EU pussed out. . . . .not one bit!

Iran does whatever it wants with ZERO consequences. . .lets see what happens when they get a nuke and drop it on someone. . .will Europe give them another pass? Or sack up and confront a long time criminal regime?

bottom line. . . .European politicians make me want to make a fucking bowel movement!

No one backed down, as far as I know. Unfortunately this works just as badly for us, since it just makes the Iranians look generous. I hope the British didn't secretly apologize for anything, but even then at this point nothing but diplomacy would have been useful. Perhaps if the Iranians had held them for another week or two, then we could start turning some serious pressure on them. Right now, though, it seems like the Iranians played us like a piano.

Played us like a piano?? Umm not quite. . .Maybe played Jimmy Carter like a piano?

They played the fucking UK/EU like a piano. . . .The US military was ready on the border and in the Gulf waiting for the call to attack immediately!  We had two carrier groups (loaded with air to ground fighter jets!), and marine expiditionary force waiting btw!

Diplomacy. . . .lets see. . .Diplomacy isnt the word I would use to describe what happend.  Capitulation, and a fear of confrontation is what happend. . . .pure and simple!

It would have been better the Iranians killing the prisoners and UK/US attacking Iran and wasting thousands of lives.  It does not sound good at all.  Does it sound good for you?

fadedsteve wrote:

UGADawgs wrote:

fadedsteve wrote:

The troops may have been released, but at what cost. . . . ?

Britain looks weak. . . .pure and simple

They capitulated. . . .Tony Blair essentially apologized to the Iranians. . .

side note: Its flat out unbelievable that the EU turned its back on the Brits. . . .I am starting to wonder if Europe has ANY BALLS whatsoever?

The honest truth is Iran is even MORE emboldend than it was when the crisis started.  The EU backed down, in turn so did the Brits, its really fucking pathetic.  Iran looks like it mercifully gave the troops back because some how their "territorial waters" were infringed upon (so they gracefully gave the "aggressors" back to their home country). . . I am not surprized the Brits/EU pussed out. . . . .not one bit!

Iran does whatever it wants with ZERO consequences. . .lets see what happens when they get a nuke and drop it on someone. . .will Europe give them another pass? Or sack up and confront a long time criminal regime?

bottom line. . . .European politicians make me want to make a fucking bowel movement!

No one backed down, as far as I know. Unfortunately this works just as badly for us, since it just makes the Iranians look generous. I hope the British didn't secretly apologize for anything, but even then at this point nothing but diplomacy would have been useful. Perhaps if the Iranians had held them for another week or two, then we could start turning some serious pressure on them. Right now, though, it seems like the Iranians played us like a piano.

Played us like a piano?? Umm not quite. . .Maybe played Jimmy Carter like a piano?

They played the fucking UK/EU like a piano. . . .The US military was ready on the border and in the Gulf waiting for the call to attack immediately!  We had two carrier groups (loaded with air to ground fighter jets!), and marine expiditionary force waiting btw!

Diplomacy. . . .lets see. . .Diplomacy isnt the word I would use to describe what happend.  Capitulation, and a fear of confrontation is what happend. . . .pure and simple!

Stupid Gunho mentalty, yep its work really well for us in Iraq.

fadedsteve wrote:

No it wouldnt have been better if they killed the troops. . . .obviously

What sounds good to me is we (USA/UK/EU) stop putting up with Irans bullshit!! Essentially apologizing, and capitulating to the Iranians just gives em' another "get out of jail" free card.  They look strong and assertive, while we look unorganized and weak.

I am not scared of Iran, I see what they really are, and thats just a bully.  A bully that needs to get taught a lesson!

BN your right, Iran is not scared at all. . . .thats why they took the hostages KNOWING that the EU/UK would do NOTHING to challenge them!!! The Iranians are laughing their asses off at how big of pussies they are! Not too mention continuing the building of nukes without any hinderance. . .

Europe/UK are a joke, sorry!! They are. . . .

My buddy in England said, "You Yanks must be laughing and shaking your heads at what just happend". . .He is right I am shaking my head, but I am not laughing. . . .I am pissed that our "allies" have no balls to confront a criminal regime that has no plans on contributing positively to the world community at large.

My mentality is you either STAND FOR SOMETHING, OR FALL FOR EVERYTHING!!! Right now our "allies" are falling all over themselves. . . .

Blair didn't apologize.

BBC:
He did not thank or address the Iranian president, but said to the Iranian people: "We bear you no ill will. On the contrary, we respect Iran as an ancient civilisation, as a nation with a proud and dignified history."