Pages: 1 2 3 4

 

2007-04-23 04:23:45
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|7005

lowing wrote:

Invaderzim wrote:

lowing wrote:

Hm, I didn't mention the global population, I said their society. Muslims in America are part of OUR society, not the ME, and therefore subjet to OUR justice system.
Are Muslims living in Suidi Arabia not subject to their own laws? They see fit to behead people and you see fit to inject people with a drug so they die in the majority of your states.

Back to the main topic. Have you ever met a muslim or been to a country which is predominantly Muslim? If you had then you would know that most of them are peaceful, happy and generous people who respect otherpeoples religeons.
read up 2 posts.

I am about to find out here in a week or so.
You ain't exactly going to a place of peace and tolerance lowing. You're going to a civil war zone. They ain't going to be inviting you to have picnics with their family. Try a week break in Petra, Jordan or Marrakesh, Morocco first maybe... Jordanians are the friendliest people I have ever met.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-04-23 04:26:19)

2007-04-23 04:24:02
san4
The Mas
+311|7138|NYC, a place to live

m3thod wrote:

Who's society? Islam is not a society, its a faith but you'd know this.  Your original post refers to contextually wrong Saudi textbooks yet the Japanese are world leaders at this practise.  I don't see you on a correct the Japanese textbooks crusade.  Anyway i have no idea why you have digressed to applicability of American Law to American Muslims.

IMO you are trying to use the article from the Washington Post to tar global Muslims with your hatred and intolerace brush.  Let me ask you this, just who isn't a hater and intolerant fuck?

(don't say Dali Lama)
I certainly agree, it is not fair to characterize Islam as a whole in this way, because Islam as a whole is extremely diverse. On the other hand, Saudi Arabia is pretty significant (and presumably educated a number of the Saudi 9/11 attackers), and it is not alone in having these sorts of things in textbooks. The fact that muslim kids in New Jersey or London don't learn this crap doesn't mean it's not significant.
2007-04-23 04:25:20
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|7005

theelviscerator wrote:

Without a moral code handed down from above, you wouldnt have civil affairs.

The world would be a global version of Lord of the Flies.
Religion is dated and largely irrelevant now. We live in a civilised world now with no need for fairy tales to maintain law and order. I have my own humanistic morality - I have no need for religion.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-04-23 04:29:32)

2007-04-23 04:27:57
Braddock
Agitator
+916|6740|Éire

theelviscerator wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

lowing wrote:


I did read that, We are talking about a society that holds sawing off a head as JUST, are we not?  The definition of JUST really needs to gauged. What is justice to them is certainly not justice to us.

I love out of that whole article the only thing you can pull out and turn into a defense is that one sentence, ignoring everything else. Does that one sentence really give such you warm fuzzies for their society?
LOL. I fail to see where I'm defending Wahabiism. Or can you not comprehend the sentence: "Wahabism is terrible". I think you forget sometimes that you're talking to an atheist who abhorrs the intrusion of religion into civil affairs.
Without a moral code handed down from above, you wouldnt have civil affairs.

The world would be a global version of Lord of the Flies.
By 'from above' do you mean from God? If so, give me a God damn break (no pun intended). Morals are not handed to us from a greater being, they are learned and moulded by the accepted norms of society, hence why different cultures and countries have different customs, God doesn't enter into it. Religion is just one take on right and wrong built on the dogmatic doctrines of the religion in question. Society builds concepts of right and wrong only it does it without the pretence of them being a devine set of values.
2007-04-23 04:29:16
theelviscerator
Member
+19|6738
http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/ … 685726.ece



My time in Saudi Arabia bolstered my conviction that an austere form of Islam (Wahhabism) married to a politicised Islam (Islamism) is wreaking havoc in the world. This anger-ridden ideology, an ideology I once advocated, is not only a threat to Islam and Muslims, but to the entire civilised world.
2007-04-23 04:30:00
Braddock
Agitator
+916|6740|Éire

theelviscerator wrote:

http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/books/book_extracts/article1685726.ece



My time in Saudi Arabia bolstered my conviction that an austere form of Islam (Wahhabism) married to a politicised Islam (Islamism) is wreaking havoc in the world. This anger-ridden ideology, an ideology I once advocated, is not only a threat to Islam and Muslims, but to the entire civilised world.
Religion = trouble
2007-04-23 04:31:06
theelviscerator
Member
+19|6738

Braddock wrote:

theelviscerator wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:


LOL. I fail to see where I'm defending Wahabiism. Or can you not comprehend the sentence: "Wahabism is terrible". I think you forget sometimes that you're talking to an atheist who abhorrs the intrusion of religion into civil affairs.
Without a moral code handed down from above, you wouldnt have civil affairs.

The world would be a global version of Lord of the Flies.
By 'from above' do you mean from God? If so, give me a God damn break (no pun intended). Morals are not handed to us from a greater being, they are learned and moulded by the accepted norms of society, hence why different cultures and countries have different customs, God doesn't enter into it. Religion is just one take on right and wrong built on the dogmatic doctrines of the religion in question. Society builds concepts of right and wrong only it does it without the pretence of them being a devine set of values.
I guess I dreamed up the concept of Mosaic law all by myself then?

its the basis of much of Western Law.
2007-04-23 04:32:13
Sanjaya
Banned
+40|6677
If you need "God" or a religion to tell you to be a decent person, you've got problems.
2007-04-23 04:35:26
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

He he, nice one lowing.  Start a thread on how Muslims teach hate and intolerance when this entire thread could be accused of exactly the same thing.  So what are you teaching lowing if its not hate?
Yeah, I am teaching to hate terrorism, hate suicide bombings, hate the mass murder of women and children.

I also hate peas and asparagus puts me on the same level with the radical Muslims doesn't it?
2007-04-23 04:38:25
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

Sanjaya wrote:

lowing can we talk about why Bush and the neo-cons love the Saudis so much?
Absolutley start a thread on it.
2007-04-23 04:42:30
Braddock
Agitator
+916|6740|Éire

theelviscerator wrote:

Braddock wrote:

theelviscerator wrote:


Without a moral code handed down from above, you wouldnt have civil affairs.

The world would be a global version of Lord of the Flies.
By 'from above' do you mean from God? If so, give me a God damn break (no pun intended). Morals are not handed to us from a greater being, they are learned and moulded by the accepted norms of society, hence why different cultures and countries have different customs, God doesn't enter into it. Religion is just one take on right and wrong built on the dogmatic doctrines of the religion in question. Society builds concepts of right and wrong only it does it without the pretence of them being a devine set of values.
I guess I dreamed up the concept of Mosaic law all by myself then?

its the basis of much of Western Law.
Look at this from my point of view elviscerator. I believe religion is a warped man-made take on life and values in the same way that Greek myths and legends were. In the same way that Greek legends were a fancy way of telling universal stories (Freud often used Greek legends to articulate complex psycho analytical theories) the Bible does the same. Do you not think that mankind possibly got to a stage where certain norms became accepted behaviour in relation to how we treat our fellow humans and this became the basis of the old testaments' ten commandments? It is again just a matter of choosing to believe whether we as humans decided these ten values were something worth standing by or whether God himself came down from on high to impart them to us. In the old days it would have been much easier to use the idea of a God on high to instill beliefs and behaviours in people.
2007-04-23 04:42:30
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

theelviscerator wrote:

http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/books/book_extracts/article1685726.ece



My time in Saudi Arabia bolstered my conviction that an austere form of Islam (Wahhabism) married to a politicised Islam (Islamism) is wreaking havoc in the world. This anger-ridden ideology, an ideology I once advocated, is not only a threat to Islam and Muslims, but to the entire civilised world.
Oh no, not another person "generalizing" again!! sighhhhhhhhhhhhh
2007-04-23 04:46:54
Braddock
Agitator
+916|6740|Éire
Check out Serge's thread about what your buddies Israel are teaching the kids!

http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?id=71109

tisk, tisk, that sounds like teaching hatred and intolerance to me! I know Palestine are doing the same but two wrongs don't make a right.

Last edited by Braddock (2007-04-23 04:47:06)

2007-04-23 05:03:58
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

Braddock wrote:

Check out Serge's thread about what your buddies Israel are teaching the kids!

http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?id=71109

tisk, tisk, that sounds like teaching hatred and intolerance to me! I know Palestine are doing the same but two wrongs don't make a right.
Lets see, Jews persecuted throughout history, almost wiped off the face of the earth less than a life time ago. Surrounded and continuously attacked. Chastised for acquiring land in a war they did not start. Nehhhh, I don't see any reason for them to teach about the murderous, animalistic, behavior of their neighbors.

But isn't serge just "generalizing" anyway?

Why is it such a strech to link the fact that these ME countries are teaching hate and intolerance in their schools, andthe ME is full of hate and intolerance?? Is it really that hard to put together??
2007-04-23 05:13:52
DK_Vision
Self-loathing narcissist.
+41|6820|QUT, GP.
Lawl, the first bundle of threads were just people reaming lowing. I find that very funny.
2007-04-23 05:15:50
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

DK_Vision wrote:

Lawl, the first bundle of threads were just people reaming lowing. I find that very funny.
I am used to it, If I don't get my ass reamed at least once a day on here I feel like I forgot to take my vitamins
2007-04-23 05:20:50
GorillaTicTacs
Member
+231|6823|Kyiv, Ukraine

theelviscerator wrote:

Braddock wrote:

theelviscerator wrote:


Without a moral code handed down from above, you wouldnt have civil affairs.

The world would be a global version of Lord of the Flies.
By 'from above' do you mean from God? If so, give me a God damn break (no pun intended). Morals are not handed to us from a greater being, they are learned and moulded by the accepted norms of society, hence why different cultures and countries have different customs, God doesn't enter into it. Religion is just one take on right and wrong built on the dogmatic doctrines of the religion in question. Society builds concepts of right and wrong only it does it without the pretence of them being a devine set of values.
I guess I dreamed up the concept of Mosaic law all by myself then?

its the basis of much of Western Law.
Though it belongs in another thread to debate this, I'll touch on it here.  For starters, you're more or less dead wrong.  Any similarities between the ten commandments and Western law are either common sense or coincidence.  Is there a law that says you can't covet your neighbors wife?  Is there a law about worshipping idols?

Factually, we have two types of law in the western world, Civil Law, which had its origins in classical Roman culture (before Christianity had any influence), which in turn drew upon philosophical sources and older Greek, Persian, and Babylonian roots, and Common Law, which has its origins in Dark Ages post Roman conquest.  The term "Common Law" refers to the fact that it was customary and rarely written down until it was formalized in medievel times.  Both systems developed very independently from any Christian roots.  It would be nice to believe that the entire civilized world was "Judeo-Christian" going back thousands of years, but it just isn't so.  The fact remains that civilization existed quite well before Christianity, and would easily exist without it.

Now...back to the topic.

Anyone seen that Jesus Camp movie?  Scaaaaaary shit...
2007-04-23 05:30:08
Braddock
Agitator
+916|6740|Éire

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

Check out Serge's thread about what your buddies Israel are teaching the kids!

http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?id=71109

tisk, tisk, that sounds like teaching hatred and intolerance to me! I know Palestine are doing the same but two wrongs don't make a right.
Lets see, Jews persecuted throughout history, almost wiped off the face of the earth less than a life time ago. Surrounded and continuously attacked. Chastised for acquiring land in a war they did not start. Nehhhh, I don't see any reason for them to teach about the murderous, animalistic, behavior of their neighbors.

But isn't serge just "generalizing" anyway?

Why is it such a strech to link the fact that these ME countries are teaching hate and intolerance in their schools, andthe ME is full of hate and intolerance?? Is it really that hard to put together??
The Nazis tried to get rid of the Jews lowing, we discussed the small percentage of Arabs who helped them (along with many other countries who colluded, including many Zionists). Stop using the holocaust as an excuse for all the actions of Israel, it's like a career criminal who feels justified because he had a tough childhood.
2007-04-23 08:18:57
Masques
Black Panzer Party
+184|7172|Eastern PA

theelviscerator wrote:

Without a moral code handed down from above, you wouldnt have civil affairs.

The world would be a global version of Lord of the Flies.
And it already isn't?
2007-04-23 09:02:54
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7211

Braddock wrote:

usmarine2005 wrote:

Braddock wrote:

What's the matter lowing? This is your good buddies Saudi Arabia. Perhaps your Government should stop turning a blind eye to their terrible regime?
Try not to overlook other countries in the same bed...

Saudi Arabia, Ireland to Forge Alliances

http://www.menafn.com/qn_news_story_s.a … 1093139287
"Menafn-Arab News) RIYADH, 17 January 2007 � With bilateral trade hovering around $360 million annually, the Kingdom and Ireland have decided to revitalize the joint economic commission and forge strategic alliances in the context of the multibillion dollar economic cities to be set up in different parts of the Kingdom."



"IRELAND BACKS SAUDI WTO BID"
http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/summary_0199-148617_ITM

http://www.muslimtrade.net/tradeguideline/saudia/

http://www.saudia-online.com/direction_of_trade.html
"The ranking of the top five exporting countries to Saudi Arabia during 1990 placed the U.S. at first place with an importation value of SR15,062 million (U.S. $4,016.5 million) representing about 17 percent of the Kingdom's total imports (see table 16). Japan was in the second place (SR13,815 million, or U.S.$3,684 million), followed by England (SR10,182 million, or U.S.$2,715.2 million), Germany (SR6,645 million, or U.S.$1,772 million), and Switzerland (SR5,929 million, or U.S.$1,581.07 million).'
Nothing new to me usmarine. My Government is in bed with all sorts of terrible regimes, I mean we let US troops fly through Shannon airport FFS. I criticize my Government all the time, I disagree with a lot of what they do and with a lot of the people they do business with, I sign petitions and turn up to protests ...if I were an American I guess I'd be called unpatriotic for that! I do it because I love my country and call foul when I see it doing wrong in my name.
May not be new to you, but it may be new to some of the kids here.
2007-04-23 09:10:46
Varegg
Support fanatic :-)
+2,206|7260|Nårvei

lowing wrote:

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

He he, nice one lowing.  Start a thread on how Muslims teach hate and intolerance when this entire thread could be accused of exactly the same thing.  So what are you teaching lowing if its not hate?
Yeah, I am teaching to hate terrorism, hate suicide bombings, hate the mass murder of women and children.

I also hate peas and asparagus puts me on the same level with the radical Muslims doesn't it?
Maybe you should be teaching why does terrorism excist, why do they resort to suicide bombings ?

And i do wonder if not the socalled terrorists calls the western governments something similar !
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
2007-04-23 11:08:21
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

Check out Serge's thread about what your buddies Israel are teaching the kids!

http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?id=71109

tisk, tisk, that sounds like teaching hatred and intolerance to me! I know Palestine are doing the same but two wrongs don't make a right.
Lets see, Jews persecuted throughout history, almost wiped off the face of the earth less than a life time ago. Surrounded and continuously attacked. Chastised for acquiring land in a war they did not start. Nehhhh, I don't see any reason for them to teach about the murderous, animalistic, behavior of their neighbors.

But isn't serge just "generalizing" anyway?

Why is it such a stretch to link the fact that these ME countries are teaching hate and intolerance in their schools, and the ME is full of hate and intolerance?? Is it really that hard to put together??
The Nazis tried to get rid of the Jews lowing, we discussed the small percentage of Arabs who helped them (along with many other countries who colluded, including many Zionists). Stop using the holocaust as an excuse for all the actions of Israel, it's like a career criminal who feels justified because he had a tough childhood.
The Jews were hated and persecuted BEFORE there was even an Israel. Stop claiming that we would all be living in Never Never Land if only Israel didn't exist. The Jews would still be hated and persecuted, the strife in the ME would still exist.  The problems in the ME stem from being raised from little children to hate anyone who does not follow Islam.
2007-04-23 11:10:00
Braddock
Agitator
+916|6740|Éire

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Lets see, Jews persecuted throughout history, almost wiped off the face of the earth less than a life time ago. Surrounded and continuously attacked. Chastised for acquiring land in a war they did not start. Nehhhh, I don't see any reason for them to teach about the murderous, animalistic, behavior of their neighbors.

But isn't serge just "generalizing" anyway?

Why is it such a stretch to link the fact that these ME countries are teaching hate and intolerance in their schools, and the ME is full of hate and intolerance?? Is it really that hard to put together??
The Nazis tried to get rid of the Jews lowing, we discussed the small percentage of Arabs who helped them (along with many other countries who colluded, including many Zionists). Stop using the holocaust as an excuse for all the actions of Israel, it's like a career criminal who feels justified because he had a tough childhood.
The Jews were hated and persecuted BEFORE there was even an Israel. Stop claiming that we would all be living in Never Never Land if only Israel didn't exist. The Jews would still be hated and persecuted, the strife in the ME would still exist.  The problems in the ME stem from being raised from little children to hate anyone who does not follow Islam.
...and, as Serge points out in the OP of his similar thread, from raising children to hate anyone who is an Arab.

Last edited by Braddock (2007-04-23 11:11:33)

2007-04-23 11:12:57
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

Varegg wrote:

lowing wrote:

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

He he, nice one lowing.  Start a thread on how Muslims teach hate and intolerance when this entire thread could be accused of exactly the same thing.  So what are you teaching lowing if its not hate?
Yeah, I am teaching to hate terrorism, hate suicide bombings, hate the mass murder of women and children.

I also hate peas and asparagus puts me on the same level with the radical Muslims doesn't it?
Maybe you should be teaching why does terrorism excist, why do they resort to suicide bombings ?

And i do wonder if not the socalled terrorists calls the western governments something similar !
Reall??!!, the terrorists accuse us of strapping on suicide vests and blowing up buildings full of women and children??

FOr you to wonder this is seeking a rational excuse for it. There is no such excuse for this behavior. None at all. But I will indulge you. Give me one GOOD REASON why someone would hate AMERICA so much that they will destroy their OWN PEOPLE and murder women and children. But I gotta tell ya, it really needs to be a good one.

Then explain why if the terrorists want nothing but the best for there people , why undermine every effort to improve the lives in the ME by the west?
2007-04-23 11:14:39
lowing
Banned
+1,662|7101|USA

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:


The Nazis tried to get rid of the Jews lowing, we discussed the small percentage of Arabs who helped them (along with many other countries who colluded, including many Zionists). Stop using the holocaust as an excuse for all the actions of Israel, it's like a career criminal who feels justified because he had a tough childhood.
The Jews were hated and persecuted BEFORE there was even an Israel. Stop claiming that we would all be living in Never Never Land if only Israel didn't exist. The Jews would still be hated and persecuted, the strife in the ME would still exist.  The problems in the ME stem from being raised from little children to hate anyone who does not follow Islam.
...and, as Serge points out in the OP of his similar thread, from raising children to hate anyone who is an Arab.
nope, to DEFEND themselves against Arabs. History would deem such teachings prudent. After all, who are the worlds agressors? Israel??, not hardly.

 

Pages: 1 2 3 4

Board footer

Privacy Policy - © 2025 Jeff Minard