182|dunc wrote:
lol.....My point is that a tottaly natural phenomenom on a planet not too far away,that is deffinately not caused by humans or CO2,triggered by "noone knows ",has caused a temprature increase over the last 20 years simmilar to that recorded on the earth..
coincidence????
well yes maybe so
but then maybe the CO2 correlation with climate change is coincedence too,it is only the scientist best quess (performing a lab experiment using a dynamic earth model is impossible),and maybe they are correct in there quesswork ,or maybe there is some other reason that hasnt been explored yet.
As our collective goverments seem reluctant to forge ahead with nuclear/hydroelectric/wind/solar/hydrogen alternatives to coal/gas/oil for us and the developing world,perhaps they dont really believe the doom scenario they give out when they raise our taxes in the name of saving the planet.
no doubt we will find out who is wrong and who is right in due course
Not true.
There is no science period - regarding Mars warming up & correlation disproving the anthropogenic effect on Global Climate Change (Global Warming), there is only the sensational headlines that appear in Science Magazines to get you interested in an article about observed events.
National Geographic News: February 28, 2007
Mars Melt Hints at Solar, Not Human, Cause for Warming, Scientist Sayshttp://news.nationalgeographic.com/news … rming.htmlOoooh, sensational - no?
"In 2005 data from NASA's Mars Global Surveyor and Odyssey missions revealed that the carbon dioxide "ice caps" near Mars's south pole had been diminishing for three summers in a row."
But read the article, and therein you will find this direct contradiction:
Planets' Wobbles
The conventional theory is that climate changes on Mars can be explained primarily by small alterations in the planet's orbit and tilt, not by changes in the sun.
"Wobbles in the orbit of Mars are the main cause of its climate change in the current era," Oxford's Wilson explained. (Related: "Don't Blame Sun for Global Warming, Study Says" [September 13, 2006].)
All planets experience a few wobbles as they make their journey around the sun. Earth's wobbles are known as Milankovitch cycles and occur on time scales of between 20,000 and 100,000 years.
These fluctuations change the tilt of Earth's axis and its distance from the sun and are thought to be responsible for the waxing and waning of ice ages on Earth.
Mars and Earth wobble in different ways, and most scientists think it is pure coincidence that both planets are between ice ages right now. "Mars has no [large] moon, which makes its wobbles much larger, and hence the swings in climate are greater too," Wilson said.
Mars is meltinghttp://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2003 … thpole.htmThe south polar cap is vaporizing now, which means CO2 is rushing back into the atmosphere. "Remember, though," adds Smith, "there are two polar caps on Mars--north and south. While the south polar cap is vaporizing the north polar cap is growing. It's a balancing act. Overall air pressure will be greatest when there's the least amount of CO2 on the ground." The next such peak is due in early October--that is, early southern summer on Mars.
From:
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/ar … g-on-mars/Globally, the mean temperature of the Martian atmosphere is particularly sensitive to the strength and duration of hemispheric dust storms, (... ). Large scale dust storms change the atmospheric opacity and convection; as always when comparing mean temperatures, the altitude at which the measurement is made matters, but to the extent it is sensible to speak of a mean temperature for Mars, the evidence is for significant cooling from the 1970's, when Viking made measurements, compared to current temperatures. However, this is essentially due to large scale dust storms that were common back then, compared to a lower level of storminess now. The mean temperature on Mars, averaged over the Martian year can change by many degrees from year to year, depending on how active large scale dust storms are.
In short you have a different cycle; different event causes. Mars is about 2 earth years long as a cycle with some of the South polar cap being seasonally absorbed by the North & vice versa, and sensitivity to strength and duration of hemispheric dust storms. There is no correlation of Mars seasonal changes with that of the Earth. Nor is this evidence that suggests a contrary proof - to the very well established correlation of anthropogenic additions of CO2 into the atmosphere (are driving an increase in the warming trend) here on Earth.
Last edited by topal63 (2007-05-17 12:51:44)