so, no one thought the spanish-american war was futile? i mean come on, all we got was puerto rico and the phillipines, and the phillipinos hated us after the war ended.
Poll
Which was the most futile US-fought war?
| World War I | 1% | 1% - 3 | ||||
| World War II | 3% | 3% - 5 | ||||
| Gulf War I | 1% | 1% - 2 | ||||
| Iraqi Invasion | 18% | 18% - 30 | ||||
| Afghan Invasion | 0% | 0% - 1 | ||||
| Vietnam War | 47% | 47% - 78 | ||||
| Korean War | 3% | 3% - 5 | ||||
| Bay of Pigs Invasion | 15% | 15% - 25 | ||||
| Grenada Invasion | 1% | 1% - 3 | ||||
| Other | 6% | 6% - 11 | ||||
| Total: 163 | ||||||
Personally? How about the fundraisers in armerica to gather and send millions of dollars to support the IRA?CameronPoe wrote:
Which and why.
US didn't fight the Bay of Pigs, did they?
naaa I'd say we would be speaking RussianThe_Mac wrote:
You need to settle down and realize that if the United States hadn't stepped in the war, you guys would most likely all be speaking German by now.manitobapaintballa wrote:
get your facts straight buddy and once you get into 5th grade history mabie just mabie you won't have americanised history books (not bloody likley)
Would have been brilliant had US citizens not fucking invested in Nazi Germany and given them the money to build a war machine in the first place.The_Mac wrote:
You need to settle down and realize that if the United States hadn't stepped in the war, you guys would most likely all be speaking German by now.manitobapaintballa wrote:
get your facts straight buddy and once you get into 5th grade history mabie just mabie you won't have americanised history books (not bloody likley)
Vietnam was the beginning of the end for the USSR. Wasn't futile at all. Economic disaster on the Soviet front as I understand it.
Iraq... No comment. In my opinion, NATO (yes, make it a NATO mission...) should round up all the Kurds and found a new nation with 1/3 of Iraq. Kurdistan. Then let the Sunnis and Shia's sort their shit out the Islamic extremist way.
Last edited by Flecco (2007-06-20 21:56:46)
Whoa... Can't believe these forums are still kicking.
Russia didn't invest that much into Vietnam.
Not as far as I remember, then again I didn't even know that was a war, must've been an awfully short one if it was.Bubbalo wrote:
US didn't fight the Bay of Pigs, did they?
Well, it was certainly an invasion.
Of course, the US was part to those talks aswell, and at that time they probably had the military strength to dictate terms (that is, if they'd allied with Germany the war would have gone on, meaning that Germany's surrender was dependent on US support).
The War on Drugs.
[Edit:
[Edit:
shit, beat me...but at least I USED CAPS]Kmarion wrote:
The war on drugs.
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2007-06-20 22:55:01)
Actually, the British wanted to screw them over too. My point is that the US was one of the power that imposed the Versailles Treaty on Germany.rdx-fx wrote:
USA was part of those talks, yes.
Regardless of military strength, we didn't think of dictating terms.
British and Americans wanted Germany to be economically viable - French wanted revenge against Germany.
In actuality, it was a British or American dignitary attending those talks that came up with the prescient quotation, "If they go ahead with the Versailles Treaty as it is written now, they will so abuse the German people that they will be fighting another war over it in 20 years".
His prediction was off by a few weeks.
And, from 1918 to 1931, Germany borrowed money from the USA to pay off the Europeans..
QFE!rdx-fx wrote:
I'm sure I'd like Paris better if they spoke German...
Didn't completely destroy states rights, but you do have a point there. Then again, I am more of a National Unity before States Rights kind of guy.imortal wrote:
Yeah, cemeted the bonds between the states by destroying states rights and begining the buildup to the overwhelmin national goverment we have today. And it may have finished the slavery issue, but that is not what started it.Smithereener wrote:
To be honest, I wouldn't call this one futile. Sure it was bad; we were killing each other. BUT it solved the issue of slavery in territories once and for all. (I guess technically you could say it was the 13,14,15th Amendments, but without the victory, those probably would never have been passed.) It almost cemented the bonds between the states IMO.Vernedead wrote:
the civil war! nothing more futile than killing your own.
I voted Vietnam btw. Our support there was next to nil, the people kept getting lied to (Cambodia), etc.
I didn't say that the war was started due to slavery, I said implied that the war began due to the issue over slavery in territories.
Which was the most futile US-fought war? blaming the Vietnam war on France
Didn't Vietnam had to do with the containment of communism?Turquoise wrote:
Vietnam was utterly ridiculous.. It never should have been fought, and it was an even dumber move than the invasion of Iraq....
Why? Because it was an even more volatile location than Iraq, where our local support was even weaker than it is in Iraq. We lost thousands more men in Vietnam, and LBJ was even more of a tool than Bush, since his micromanagement of the war basically ruined any chance of victory whatsoever.
Even though, I vote Iraq.
I wanted to vote for Bosnia/Former Yugoslavia but it's not on this list... I wonder why?
1812
The capital of Vietnam, Hanoi, was decimated by US bombing during the war. What ROE's were there? The ones that stopped the USA having a 'bombing zone' near Ho Chi Minh City where all unused bombs could be dropped?PsychoKillers wrote:
The only reason Vietnam went down faster then a lead titanic was that there were so many ROEs and the U.S. couldnt use its military to its full extent. If we were able to bomb North Vietnam more and do something about Cambodia then we may have won.Turquoise wrote:
Vietnam was utterly ridiculous.. It never should have been fought, and it was an even dumber move than the invasion of Iraq....
Why? Because it was an even more volatile location than Iraq, where our local support was even weaker than it is in Iraq. We lost thousands more men in Vietnam, and LBJ was even more of a tool than Bush, since his micromanagement of the war basically ruined any chance of victory whatsoever.
I have a sneaking suspicion that you are getting confused with Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge.The_Mac wrote:
The Communist Vietnamese obliterated their cities pretty much, and deported everyone to the countryside to work in labor camps, similar to Kim Il Jom's today. The country was brain wiped and washed or else purged.
I've been to Vietnam. Spent 3 weeks there (and then a week in Cambodia). It's a great place now, but the 'American War' really fucked it up for the average joe. It was a total waste of lives.
Mcminty.
No. We just funded a bunch of Cubans and the CIA trained them for the op.Bubbalo wrote:
US didn't fight the Bay of Pigs, did they?
no war is completely without purpose (except mabye the war of jenkins ear) but you got to admit as far as protecting slavery goes, it kind of sucked. and for the union side, well you only need to unify it because you fragmented it anyway.Smithereener wrote:
Didn't completely destroy states rights, but you do have a point there. Then again, I am more of a National Unity before States Rights kind of guy.imortal wrote:
Yeah, cemeted the bonds between the states by destroying states rights and begining the buildup to the overwhelmin national goverment we have today. And it may have finished the slavery issue, but that is not what started it.Smithereener wrote:
To be honest, I wouldn't call this one futile. Sure it was bad; we were killing each other. BUT it solved the issue of slavery in territories once and for all. (I guess technically you could say it was the 13,14,15th Amendments, but without the victory, those probably would never have been passed.) It almost cemented the bonds between the states IMO.
I voted Vietnam btw. Our support there was next to nil, the people kept getting lied to (Cambodia), etc.
I didn't say that the war was started due to slavery, I said implied that the war began due to the issue over slavery in territories.
Vietnam.
They got absolutely nothing out of Vietnam, apart from a lot of scarred people, corpses and a very disgruntled public.
They got absolutely nothing out of Vietnam, apart from a lot of scarred people, corpses and a very disgruntled public.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
Yeah, but my point is more that the government changed and didn't go ahead with the plan. Bay of Pigs was basically disposal from your perspective.acEofspadEs6313 wrote:
No. We just funded a bunch of Cubans and the CIA trained them for the op.
The war was lost when the split the Corps up and every General and Colonel was going for freaking medals all the time. Read the book "Steel My Soldiers Hearts" about the Hardcore 4/39th. Very interesting on some of the childish behavior the higher ups would try to pull. Plus, LBJ was a retard to sign the peace accords for bombing Hanoi.The_Mac wrote:
I'm glad you realize LBJ messed it up with his crap ideas, but know also that when the NVA came storming through, every single son of em south vietnamese immediately wished they had their American allies. It was an ironic war, because the US was always telling the SV what would happen if invaded, and then when that actually happened, other countries saw it, and they knew to steer clear of communism or else.Turquoise wrote:
Why? Because it was an even more volatile location than Iraq, where our local support was even weaker than it is in Iraq. We lost thousands more men in Vietnam, and LBJ was even more of a tool than Bush, since his micromanagement of the war basically ruined any chance of victory whatsoever.
The Vietnamese were vicious buggers. One eyewitness reports a tank rolling a Church and blowing the refugees inside up until the church was a bloody mess.
The Communist Vietnamese obliterated their cities pretty much, and deported everyone to the countryside to work in labor camps, similar to Kim Il Jom's today. The country was brain wiped and washed or else purged.
The war did prove something else : democrats are shit at defending the United States/waging any sort of war.
If we were able to wage total war like the NVA and VC we surely would have won. Democrats truely suck at waging war. If we didnt have war, this planet would be completly overrun by humans. BF2142 shows what could happen in the late future if we continue on our path of exponential reproducing when the next ice age hits.
Iraqi Invasion. All it did was get the very man they put into power killed and turn Baghdad into a terrorist hub. Along with an impending civil war.
Vietnam. it was pointless for america as it wasnt even their fight, it was just a way for america to fight russia without as many losses by each taking a side