BF2S Forums No Kosovo for You

Beats me

Russia and Serbia have long had very close ties to one another. Russia supported Serbia every step of the way since the breakup of Yugoslavia, even through its most darkest times. Do not think that its because of some high moral standards or willingness to protect territorial integrity of countries all over the world. Because while they are opposing Kosovo, they are lobbying and supporting several separatist movements in ex Soviet countries.
Long friendship, religious ties and most importantly self interest. With Russia becoming a world player again, Serbia gives it an opportunity for possible military presence. Its not as good as Cuba but it will do.

And yes Izzle even though Kosovo is not an economical center of Serbia, it does have a huge historical value. While the younger generations care more about advancing towards an EU membership, the older generations care more about history.
Also it wont be a legal precedent that will give Mexicans ability to create Mexifornia

Balkans have been pain in the ass through centuries but Yugoslavie (Serbs) always managed to keep them organized and so far it was ok. Now when  Kosovo sees that former Yugoslavie isnt that strong in political arena they are trying to gain independence, which wouldnt be wrong, but...

Who the hell wants independent such a small country with ruins and mine fields all over, where military presence is needed all the time and where they themselves are incapable to remain control over their own region, I wont even talk about economical situation. Its their national proud and a support from EU and NATO which made a thought about their own country. Maybe I shouldnt but I dont support them in any way. Just imagine what will happen if Kosovo becomes independent- religious warfare, genocide etc.

Why Russia is interested? I agree with that it is their chance to even balance in military presence in Europe agaisnt EU, NATO. Something like last fort behind enemy lines.

just my 2 cents

Ole Putin wants to strengthen the Soviet..err Russia in the world Politka game. Just like a missile defense system is a threat to Russia?

Kosovo is Serbian. Period.

SgtHeihn wrote:

Plus the political situation their is too unstable to for them to take on the west.

IMO the political situation is very stable because almost all oppostion has been eliminated by Kreml. So thats the last thing they worry about.

SgtHeihn wrote:

They are too busy selling their military hardware, so they wouldn't be able to make a Missile defense system. The Anti Ballistic missile system is to head off missiles from Iran and North Korea. With early warning systems we have now, a missile could be hit before it became a threat to the EU or US.

From North Korea? Come on, dont you think they would just transfer them over Pacific or North Pole? + I dont see any option how could EU fight these missiles with your warning system.

SgtHeihn wrote:

I can see the outrage of staging nukes that close, IE US missiles in Turkey and Russian in Cuba. But a defense? Come on lets pick a better battlefield to fight on. If they did maybe they could get the rest of the world behind them and dispute it.

Russia sees the defense system as a threat to the nuclear standoff currently in place. If you launch a shit load of nukes you will get a shit load of nukes right back at you. Of course Im not saying that USA would launch a nuclear attack on Russia, but Russia still likes to maintain the status quo. And I know the current defense system couldn't defend against the Russian arsenal, but the technology always moves forward and never back. A Russian skeptic could imagine a world in the future where USA is invulnerable.

But thats going to far off topic. Russia will politically back Serbia its just a question of how far they are willing to go. In my opinion they will go just as far to make a point that they are against it (basically talk and threat a lot), but not to far to block the Kosovo independence. Its all about self interest in the end, and independent Kosovo is in Russia's interest.

True on the Politika, but their is a pretty strong anti Putin faction. with missiles, NK can launch at EU capitals not just the US. Going over the North Pole is just as far if not farther than going over an ocean.

Do you think the US would let another country get nuked and say, "Well I know your an ally, and a major trading partner, but the missile wasn't aimed at a American city so oh well."

What is the big deal with them breaking off? Don't they hate each other?

SgtHeihn wrote:

What is the big deal with them breaking off? Don't they hate each other?

If Im not wrong, territory of Kosovo has its historical weight for Serbia. There was a battle in Kosovo when all the Serbs died till the last man in a battle against Osmans (they were outnumbered like 3:1 or more), but that sacrifice was enough to turn Turks away from Europe. They have a memorial for that event and its like pain in the ass for Kosovo albans because they are muslims and most of all would like to destroy it. Thats why EU contingent (momentaly Slovaks) guard it 24/7.

Also there are a lot of churches etc which are very close to Serbs. And if Kosovo gain independence, the minority of Serbs would be terminated just due to stupid religious confesion. Its all about religion, nothing less. I know that from our lectors and friends of mine who served or still serves in Kosovo just to keep that peace which can collaps so easily.

legionair wrote:

SgtHeihn wrote:

What is the big deal with them breaking off? Don't they hate each other?

If Im not wrong, territory of Kosovo has its historical weight for Serbia. There was a battle in Kosovo when all the Serbs died till the last man in a battle against Osmans (they were outnumbered like 3:1 or more), but that sacrifice was enough to turn Turks away from Europe. They have a memorial for that event and its like pain in the ass for Kosovo albans because they are muslims and most of all would like to destroy it. Thats why EU contingent (momentaly Slovaks) guard it 24/7.

Also there are a lot of churches etc which are very close to Serbs. And if Kosovo gain independence, the minority of Serbs would be terminated just due to stupid religious confesion. Its all about religion, nothing less. I know that from our lectors and friends of mine who served or still serves in Kosovo just to keep that peace which can collaps so easily.

I think its past the "if" stage. Kosovo has to much support for independence whether we think its morally right or not. Its just a matter of time. EU might convince them to postpone the declaration of independence to try to get Serbia to give it up, although I think no one still believes that will actually happen. Russia might try to prolong it a bit but they wont do to much to stop it since its not in their interest to stop it. So its just a matter of time and I personally have mixed feelings about it.
Also with all the international presence in Kosovo (and more soon arriving) and all the scrutiny they are under, I doubt that much will happen to Serbs living there. Some isolated incidences probably but nothing organized.

Last edited by zeidmaan (2008-02-14 16:14:32)

I'm thinking he fears the precedent it might set for a similar Chechnyian independence.

Mek-Izzle wrote:

I understand how it's bad to give independance. As it'll be a big morale boost to the thousands of seperatists out there. Even those Mexicans that want California/Texas or something.

But

Is Kosovo really that important to Serbia? Same goes for places like Chechnya/Kashmir/Pakistans NWF province etc..

These places I mentioned. They're not exactly massive contributors to the economy etc.. I'd go as far as saying that the countries would be better off without those troublesome places that waste resources and money by just trying to keep things calm.

What are you talking about? Kosovo is one of the most historic Serbian provinces. The Serbs don't need to explain to anyone why they want to hold on to it. It's theirs. End of story.

Other than that, the recognition of Kosovo's independence would mean that boarders everywhere are liable to change based on the distribution of the population.

Based on that, like you said, the United States of Mexico would be created. Turkey could gain a province within Germany. Half of London would go to India and the other half to Pakistan. Albania would own half of Athens. Part of Iraq would be in Sweden. China would expand in every major city in the world. Etc etc...

I really cannot see under what pretext the west might proceed to recognize Kosovo's independence.