You must be shitting me serge.
Let me check...no.David.P wrote:
You must be shitting me serge.
3 & 4 are a rehash, so I'm going to just focus on these.sergeriver wrote:
1 and 2 - Not false claims. The Vatican announces the new 7 mortal sins, and they don't include pedophilia. If you think about it, they should let Catholic priests to get married. Half of the problem solved. And I'm sure a lot of cases don't get to the public opinion.Pug wrote:
#1 - your main point is that the church does not care about molesting or abusing children. this is a false claim.sergeriver wrote:
These are a few things I find kinda hypocrite about some Christians, not all.
1-The Vatican speaks of the 7 new mortal sins, yet they don't mention child abuse. I guess being concerned about the environment is PC and gives the Catholic Church good PR. But priests molesting and/or abusing children is not a concern for them.
2-Many Catholic Christians constantly point their fingers at Islam and claim that moderate Muslims should speak out against the extremists. I wonder how many of them speak out against these priests. I guess it wouldn't look ok for their Church to admit such thing.
3-Almost everyMany Christians out there are against homosexuality. Isn't this behaviour the opposite to the teachings of Jesus? If I'm not wrong Jesus advocated to be tolerant to others and yet most Christians are against gays having the same rights than us because "it's not natural".
4--Almost everyMany Christians around the World are against abortion, that's a fact. In the US many Evangelical Conservatives support the death penalty and the war in Iraq. Isn't this a double standard?
Edit: fixed points 3 and 4, words almost every replaced by many. My apologies for generalizing there.
#2 - your main point is that their is no punishment for pedophiles who are priests. this is a false claim.
#3 - Yes, but as you can see free will is involved with everyone. You can't force someone to not be gay, you can just encourage them not to participate. From my POV - I could care less.
#4 - We covered this in a topic titled by you before...I'm not up to rehashing.
Seriously, if you want to learn about the philosophy or argue these points, there's classes where its an open discussion. I've been to one and listened to them talk about the death penalty.
If you read the article, you will see quotes where the guy says the original seven are still in effect. And I don't need to cite the numerous punishments and excommunications and jail time that are reported. You are aware of them because you are aware of this very issue. So to claim they "don't care" is just absurd and false.
You are a proponent of innocent until proven guilty, based on your stances on many topics you cover. Yet in this case I would bet you believe the priest is guilty whether the charges are accurate or are not, based on the fact that no one should ever participate in such a despicable act.
But I believe that frequency of child abuse isn't higher with priests when compared with the rest of society. I think it's at maximum equal to the rest of the public. However, it's even worse when a priest commits these types of acts because of their position within the community. Whenever a person of authority commits a terrible act like this, it's also an abuse of power. I feel the same way about students & teacher incidents.
I also believe why these crimes seem more prevalent has to do with the fact its likely to have a longer and wider news cycle then other stories. In other words, you are more likely to read about a priest molesting a kid in Detroit then a gang member shooting another gang member in Detroit.
But as far as the fact you believe there is leniency, you are completely wrong.
I guess there will always be some level of hypocrisy involved when it comes to religions, mainly because in our modern, secular society even those who consider themselves "religious" to some degree don't follow the Bible word by word.
I mean, we all lie, we all have premarital sex ( I know I do ), we all swear, some crazy wackos even disregard the "classical" deadly sins. I know I have from time to time.
And yet, we still call ourselves christians. Is that hypocrisy ? Sure is. But, you know, I try to be the best christian I can be.
Not my mistake that religion has set up rules that no sane person can ever live up to in the first place. No sane, secular, western person with a decent lifestyle anyway.
I mean, we all lie, we all have premarital sex ( I know I do ), we all swear, some crazy wackos even disregard the "classical" deadly sins. I know I have from time to time.
And yet, we still call ourselves christians. Is that hypocrisy ? Sure is. But, you know, I try to be the best christian I can be.
Not my mistake that religion has set up rules that no sane person can ever live up to in the first place. No sane, secular, western person with a decent lifestyle anyway.
There will always be some level of hypocrisy because no human has the capacity to live a perfect life. Hence our need for salvation. But neither our inability to be perfect, nor salvation justify us deciding to just do what we want.
B.Schuss wrote:
I guess there will always be some level of hypocrisy involved when it comes to religions, mainly because in our modern, secular society even those who consider themselves "religious" to some degree don't follow the Bible word by word.
I mean, we all lie, we all have premarital sex ( I know I do ), we all swear, some crazy wackos even disregard the "classical" deadly sins. I know I have from time to time.
And yet, we still call ourselves christians. Is that hypocrisy ? Sure is. But, you know, I try to be the best christian I can be.
Not my mistake that religion has set up rules that no sane person can ever live up to in the first place. No sane, secular, western person with a decent lifestyle anyway.
Agree. Two simple commands:Stingray24 wrote:
There will always be some level of hypocrisy because no human has the capacity to live a perfect life. Hence our need for salvation. But neither our inability to be perfect, nor salvation justify us deciding to just do what we want.
1 Love God
2 Love your Neighbor.
The rest can mean shit. (however, if you follow these two you cover all the rest!)
Last edited by Morpheus1229 (2008-03-11 08:10:56)
EE (hats
The bible leaves plenty of room for your own personal interpretations.
To be honest I'd say that most Christians are hypocritical in the fact that they only give a shit about god and morals for 2 hours a week while the rest of the week like act like assholes with the idea that god will forgive their sins. That part is what pissed me off the most about church.
To be honest I'd say that most Christians are hypocritical in the fact that they only give a shit about god and morals for 2 hours a week while the rest of the week like act like assholes with the idea that god will forgive their sins. That part is what pissed me off the most about church.
to the O.P.
your post is as productive as me saying, "all Atheists are ignorant fools."
both are equally debatable. The issue comes when you make blanket generalizations cross out blanket generalizations but leave them there for us to see and change the word to ALMOST a blanket generalization.
And you think that makes a lot of difference.
You do not create an intellectually honest argument. You just typed a load of crap to get e-props from equally ignorant fools disgruntled and jaded Atheists.
your post is as productive as me saying, "all Atheists are ignorant fools."
both are equally debatable. The issue comes when you make blanket generalizations cross out blanket generalizations but leave them there for us to see and change the word to ALMOST a blanket generalization.
And you think that makes a lot of difference.
You do not create an intellectually honest argument. You just typed a load of crap to get e-props from equally ignorant fools disgruntled and jaded Atheists.
Damn it Serge, you have too much time on your hands typing crap that is poorly supported. Gtfo and go back to looking after your triplets ---> http://uk.news.yahoo.com/itn/20080222/t … 1e0_1.html
Last edited by {HMS}_Sir_Del_Boy (2008-03-11 10:07:12)
And how do you know that? I'm sure most any molester does it because they're mentally flawed, not because any god told them to but you instantly assume a load of crap. Stop reading the newspapers, they've had their affect on you. The war in Iraq is not a jihad or crusade for any side, that was just a really stupid thing to say by Bush or Osama and they both had their part in that.Tehremos wrote:
2. You should ask a priest, they don't see and nor do I see priests molesting children like Islam jihad's, you are comparing two very different things. When a priest molests, he/she isn't doing it because of their faith. Whereas a jihad believes his/her god wants them to do it. You are comparing two very different things, to show you this I will use an example. If I was to compare Pepsi Max with a Blue tit(A blue tit is a bird) this would be along the same logical sense as yours.
They're "jihading" because we're "crusading" and we're fighting a "war on terror" because they're "jihading" because of a dumb speech and a worse response.
Slight digression aside, it's still to the point as how in cold hell do you know that a islamic rapist is doing is because their god told them to rape a small child?
Edit: As far as that last analogy, I think "comparing apples and oranges" is a bit less off the wall. They're not, it's all just sociopaths who happen to read different books at different times of the week.
Last edited by Defiance (2008-03-11 08:58:14)
I don't blame religion... I blame those that twist and distort it to suit their own desires, cruelty, greed, and ambition.
Mind you I find it almost laughable that after 1000's of years we have new "deadly sins" for the Catholics.
Mind you I find it almost laughable that after 1000's of years we have new "deadly sins" for the Catholics.
Who here is not guilty of being a hypocrite for at least once in their life? Passing judgement is probably one of the worst things to do.
you anti-christianite
Irony ftw.mikeshw wrote:
Passing judgement is probably one of the worst things to do.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
I'm agnostic.G3|Genius wrote:
to the O.P.
your post is as productive as me saying, "all Atheists are ignorant fools."
both are equally debatable. The issue comes when you make blanket generalizations cross out blanket generalizations but leave them there for us to see and change the word to ALMOST a blanket generalization.
And you think that makes a lot of difference.
You do not create an intellectually honest argument. You just typed a load of crap to get e-props from equally ignorant fools disgruntled and jaded Atheists.
Maybe it's poorly supported coz I don't have much time at work, so forgive me. And those aren't mine, with one kid I'm done.{HMS}_Sir_Del_Boy wrote:
Damn it Serge, you have too much time on your hands typing crap that is poorly supported. Gtfo and go back to looking after your triplets ---> http://uk.news.yahoo.com/itn/20080222/t … 1e0_1.html
Soddom and Gamorra....sp? these to cities were destroyed due to rampant whoring of hetros and homossergeriver wrote:
I base my opinion on what I see, don't need a wiki link for this. Post an evidence where Jesus condemned homosexuality. And being against abortion and supporting death penalty is a double standard IMO. You can't say this life is more valuable than this other because you are not God. Isn't God the only one who can take a life?d4rkph03n1x wrote:
Okay, first point is pretty hard hitting, but where are your opinions founded from? Watercooler chat? Homosexuality is frowned upon and I don't believe Jesus supported/would have supported homosexuality. I'm not against abortion, but i'm not the most devoted christian either. How is it a double standard? Abortion and the death penalty are not related in anyway or in any situation. I'm sorry, but most of your argument is flawed.sergeriver wrote:
These are a few things I find kinda hypocrite about some Christians, not all.
1-The Vatican speaks of the 7 new mortal sins, yet they don't mention child abuse. I guess being concerned about the environment is PC and gives the Catholic Church good PR. But priests molesting and/or abusing children is not a concern for them.
2-Many Catholic Christians constantly point their fingers at Islam and claim that moderate Muslims should speak out against the extremists. I wonder how many of them speak out against these priests. I guess it wouldn't look ok for their Church to admit such thing.
3-Almost every Christian out there is against homosexuality. Isn't this behaviour the opposite to the teachings of Jesus? If I'm not wrong Jesus advocated to be tolerant to others and yet most Christians are against gays having the same rights than us because "it's not natural".
4-Almost every Christian around the World is against abortion, that's a fact. In the US many Evangelical Conservatives support the death penalty and the war in Iraq. Isn't this a double standard?
Edit: spelling.
Every major empire in the history of the world has fallen because of homosexuals.
Greece and Rome anyone?
If that doesnt tell you something then nothing will.
Greece and Rome anyone?
If that doesnt tell you something then nothing will.
Last edited by Dragonclaw (2008-03-11 10:28:04)
Alexander was gay.Dragonclaw wrote:
Every major empire in the history of the world has fallen because of homosexuals.
Greece and Rome anyone?
If that doesnt tell you something then nothing will.
This is an exercise in satire, correct? It would have to be. No one could take this seriously.Dragonclaw wrote:
Every major empire in the history of the world has fallen because of homosexuals.
Greece and Rome anyone?
If that doesnt tell you something then nothing will.
Conservatives in general are morons. Jesus supposedly taught about tolerance, yet for the past two thousand years Christians have persecuted Jews, Muslims, homosexuals, and women.
The only difference between Christian bashing and Islam bashing threads is that there are quite a few people that are here to "defend" Christianity. Saying that, I think both religions are bollocks. And serge is right.
And I don't give a shit if it's Catholic, or whatever the fuck. Like I don't give a shit if it's Shia/Sunni if we're talking about Islam.
And I don't give a shit if it's Catholic, or whatever the fuck. Like I don't give a shit if it's Shia/Sunni if we're talking about Islam.
Last edited by Mek-Izzle (2008-03-11 14:23:58)
I hope you're joking, lmaoDragonclaw wrote:
Every major empire in the history of the world has fallen because of homosexuals.
Greece and Rome anyone?
If that doesnt tell you something then nothing will.
I'm not surprised you don't give a toss about the Christianity or Islam debate cos none of them apply to you.Mek-Izzle wrote:
The only difference between Christian bashing and Islam bashing threads is that there are quite a few people that are here to "defend" Christianity. Saying that, I think both religions are bollocks. And serge is right.
And I don't give a shit if it's Catholic, or whatever the fuck. Like I don't give a shit if it's Shia/Sunni if we're talking about Islam.
You're a rehabilitated Hindu or Sikh, or something along those lines cos you're of Indian origin, aren't you?
Last edited by {HMS}_Sir_Del_Boy (2008-03-11 14:49:31)
You guys all all damned. Good luck finding a good girl now that 1 in 4 has atleast one STD.FallenMorgan wrote:
Conservatives in general are morons. Jesus supposedly taught about tolerance, yet for the past two thousand years Christians have persecuted Jews, Muslims, homosexuals, and women.