Pages: 1 2

 

2006-11-30 13:52:44
UON
Junglist Massive
+223|7109
For the sake of debate, let's ignore the advantage DX10 brings to games which, let's face it, are largely an advance in hardware technology, not software... was it worth the alleged 10,000 people and the long overrun from original deadlines to produce the product we have on our screens today?

https://img46.imageshack.us/img46/3985/vistaqt5.th.jpg

Is the massive pricetag on the Ultimate edition (pictured) worth the pricetag, or are Microsoft just selling snakeoil that could just as easily have been provided as a low cost modification to the XP core?

I mean, they've moved a few folders around, created a few new libraries, added a few new annoying 'security' prompts, and spend alot of time on eye candy and implementation of 'convenience' features most of which have standalone app equivalents already.  It feels a bit like a 'redecoration' rather than a totally new experience.  Views?
2006-11-30 13:55:12
Jenspm
penis
+1,716|7188|St. Andrews / Oslo

wrong section...

btw, Vista looks awesome
https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/26774/flickricon.png https://twitter.com/phoenix/favicon.ico
2006-11-30 13:56:17
Mekstizzle
WALKER
+3,611|7077|London, England
I don't think it's worth it, like you said everything seems to be purely cosmetic. And that means that it'll actually hurt your gaming as the OS is likely to take up even more resources than XP. So basically, the only thing that this thing is useful for is DX10 gaming. For me, that's probably 5-10 years from now.

And don't even get me started about businesses even needing vista a little bit.

Last edited by Mekstizzle (2006-11-30 13:58:06)

2006-11-30 13:57:12
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7037|SE London

It looks good. Will probably take a while to properly take off, due to excessive hardware requirements.

DX10 should be available for XP through SP3 after Vista is launched. So that shouldn't really come into it.
Can't wait to start playing some DX10 games on my 8800.....
2006-11-30 13:59:23
UON
Junglist Massive
+223|7109

Jenspm wrote:

wrong section...

btw, Vista looks awesome
I've posed as a economics/politics/ethics debate type question, not a straightforward tech thread

(or at least, tried to)
2006-11-30 13:59:27
Jbrar
rawr
+86|6997|Winterpeg, Canada
two clocks? wtf. Anyways, I feel it does look like a redecoration, but I haven't explored it, only spent about 2 min. on a vista system.
2006-11-30 13:59:51
evilcartman99
The Octagon
+18|6868|da ville, va
Just a quick Q, is DX10 only on new cards like the 8800 or can it be put on old cards?
2006-11-30 14:00:09
=Karma-Kills=
"Don't post while intoxicated."
+356|7040|England
Looks pretty... thats about it.

I want my WINFS....
2006-11-30 14:00:51
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7037|SE London

evilcartman99 wrote:

Just a quick Q, is DX10 only on new cards like the 8800 or can it be put on old cards?
8800 (GTS and GTX) is the only card out at the moment that'll run DX10.
2006-11-30 14:02:13
UON
Junglist Massive
+223|7109

Bertster7 wrote:

It looks good. Will probably take a while to properly take off, due to excessive hardware requirements.

DX10 should be available for XP through SP3 after Vista is launched. So that shouldn't really come into it.
Can't wait to start playing some DX10 games on my 8800.....
The hardware requirements are pretty minimal on the final release.  Something like 800Mhz processor and any SVGA card, I believe.  You just don't get the effects.  You can even switch back to 'classic' mode.
2006-11-30 14:03:27
=Karma-Kills=
"Don't post while intoxicated."
+356|7040|England

evilcartman99 wrote:

Just a quick Q, is DX10 only on new cards like the 8800 or can it be put on old cards?
Yes. DX10 is implemented at the HARDWARE level, its not like DX9c where you just download it from the MS webiste, it is fundamentally different and only new generation cards (G80 / R600) are DX10 atm.

Last edited by =Karma-Kills= (2006-11-30 14:04:15)

2006-11-30 14:09:22
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7037|SE London

UnOriginalNuttah wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

It looks good. Will probably take a while to properly take off, due to excessive hardware requirements.

DX10 should be available for XP through SP3 after Vista is launched. So that shouldn't really come into it.
Can't wait to start playing some DX10 games on my 8800.....
The hardware requirements are pretty minimal on the final release.  Something like 800Mhz processor and any SVGA card, I believe.  You just don't get the effects.  You can even switch back to 'classic' mode.
It eats RAM for breakfast though. Just like XP did, but on a larger scale.
2006-11-30 14:18:31
TheEternalPessimist
Wibble
+412|7076|Mhz

I'll keep it short. DX10 aside, no, Vista seems to me to be a waste of time, money, effort and energy, but simply coz of DX10 it'll sell in its millions and be pirated in its billions.
2006-11-30 14:20:01
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7037|SE London

TheEternalPessimist wrote:

I'll keep it short. DX10 aside, no, Vista seems to me to be a waste of time, money, effort and energy, but simply coz of DX10 it'll sell in its millions and be pirated in its billions.
Why? Why won't people just download SP3 for XP?

That's got DX10 in it.
2006-11-30 14:20:17
Bell
Frosties > Cornflakes
+362|7005|UK

Jbrar wrote:

two clocks? wtf.
He must be kinky that way

Martyn
2006-11-30 14:26:46
[TUF]Whiskey_Oktober
mmmm...Toasty!
+91|7178|Oregon
1: by the time vista comes out, dx10 will have been updated = no point in buying a dx10 card now (imo)
2: vista will have a lot of bugs. a lot. just as base xp (you know, back in 2001) did.

i had the RC2 installed for a bit. closer to 2 hours. it didnt like my mic, mouse, joystick, and ati drivers (yes, the vista ones).

so ill install it on another partition and see if it works. and if not, i will wait for sp1. at least.
2006-11-30 14:33:36
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7057|132 and Bush

Esd stuff will be cool. Being able to plug a flash usb drive in and use it as system memory.

Last edited by Kmarion (2006-11-30 14:33:47)

Xbone Stormsurgezz
2006-11-30 14:33:47
TheEternalPessimist
Wibble
+412|7076|Mhz

Bertster7 wrote:

TheEternalPessimist wrote:

I'll keep it short. DX10 aside, no, Vista seems to me to be a waste of time, money, effort and energy, but simply coz of DX10 it'll sell in its millions and be pirated in its billions.
Why? Why won't people just download SP3 for XP?

That's got DX10 in it.
AFAIK, DX10 is Vista only and there is no SP3 for XP. You got an article about this coz everything I'm reading says what I said but, I'd dearly like you to be right, it'd save me a few hundred quid lol.
2006-11-30 14:43:11
Agent_Dung_Bomb
Member
+302|7192|Salt Lake City

TheEternalPessimist wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

TheEternalPessimist wrote:

I'll keep it short. DX10 aside, no, Vista seems to me to be a waste of time, money, effort and energy, but simply coz of DX10 it'll sell in its millions and be pirated in its billions.
Why? Why won't people just download SP3 for XP?

That's got DX10 in it.
AFAIK, DX10 is Vista only and there is no SP3 for XP. You got an article about this coz everything I'm reading says what I said but, I'd dearly like you to be right, it'd save me a few hundred quid lol.
Exactly.  From what Microsoft has said about DX10 is that it is a whole new way of interfacing with the drivers and the kernel.  You can't just patch XP to support it.
2006-11-30 14:50:14
TheEternalPessimist
Wibble
+412|7076|Mhz

Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:

TheEternalPessimist wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


Why? Why won't people just download SP3 for XP?

That's got DX10 in it.
AFAIK, DX10 is Vista only and there is no SP3 for XP. You got an article about this coz everything I'm reading says what I said but, I'd dearly like you to be right, it'd save me a few hundred quid lol.
Exactly.  From what Microsoft has said about DX10 is that it is a whole new way of interfacing with the drivers and the kernel.  You can't just patch XP to support it.
Thats what i thaught.


"DX10 is going to be Vista-only. It relies on the new driver model, so don't expect some sort of eventual back-port to Windows XP."

From: http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1 … 918,00.asp
2006-11-30 14:56:14
Cheez
Herman is a warmaphrodite
+1,027|6895|King Of The Islands

=Karma-Kills= wrote:

Looks pretty... thats about it.

I want my WINFS....
Haven't heard much about this. What advantages?
My state was founded by Batman. Your opinion is invalid.
2006-11-30 15:04:44
JT_001
Member
+17|6876|Canada

TheEternalPessimist wrote:

I'll keep it short. DX10 aside, no, Vista seems to me to be a waste of time, money, effort and energy, but simply coz of DX10 it'll sell in its millions and be pirated in its billions.
2006-11-30 15:09:09
stryyker
bad touch
+1,682|7176|California

lolvista.

wont be awesome until March
2006-11-30 15:18:08
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7037|SE London

TheEternalPessimist wrote:

Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:

TheEternalPessimist wrote:


AFAIK, DX10 is Vista only and there is no SP3 for XP. You got an article about this coz everything I'm reading says what I said but, I'd dearly like you to be right, it'd save me a few hundred quid lol.
Exactly.  From what Microsoft has said about DX10 is that it is a whole new way of interfacing with the drivers and the kernel.  You can't just patch XP to support it.
Thats what i thaught.


"DX10 is going to be Vista-only. It relies on the new driver model, so don't expect some sort of eventual back-port to Windows XP."

From: http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1 … 918,00.asp
Yup. Checked into it more and SP3, probably won't have it in. There were some articles up recently claiming it would (it's not out for ages anyway, slated for 2008 I think).

There is no reason DX10 could not be implemented in XP though. The main difference is the removal of capability bits from the API, which eliminates any sort of backwards compatibility, either you card is DX10 capable or not, no middle ground. This is why Vista uses DX9EX (previously DX9L) for non DX10 graphics. There is no reason that the unified resource structure of DX10 could not work through the existing Windows XP executive block.

The hardware features of DX10, ie SM4 are already implementable through XP using OpenGL.

Here are the OpenGL extensions if any of you fancy making some shiny new games using SM4.
2006-11-30 15:24:05
kylef
Gone
+1,352|6949|N. Ireland

UnOriginalNuttah wrote:

I mean, they've moved a few folders around, created a few new libraries, added a few new annoying 'security' prompts, and spend alot of time on eye candy and implementation of 'convenience' features most of which have standalone app equivalents already.  It feels a bit like a 'redecoration' rather than a totally new experience.  Views?
The "huge" pricetag is for the business version. the "Home" version costs less than £90 and if you buy Windows Media Centre within the next 2 weeks or so (costing £50) you get an upgrade to vista PREMIUM for free.

Vista has a lot more to offer than that. Just like Windows 98, XP will die down and fast. Certainly all new games released (as quoted from several gaming magazines) "...perform much better on Vista".

I'll be switching, because the future of computing is yet another step forward. We are now at the ability where once we install one thing, we have thousands of applications AT HAND.

Also, I had the RC2 Build 5803 version which was fantastic. The layout is so much simpler, and the details given on files is extraordinary, not to mention Dx10 utilization.

So, you might think that Vista is just "a mod" but it is a lot more than that. You, like millions of others (and please note, this is in no way an insult - certainly my family will do the same) will not utilize Vista to its full capabilities.

 

Pages: 1 2

Board footer

Privacy Policy - © 2025 Jeff Minard