I laugh when people try to barrel roll in choppers to avoid TV's.
I know where to aim.
I know where to aim.
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- Is Bunnyhopping & Barrelrolling = Bugusing/Exploiting of poor physic?
Poll
Is it exploitation of poor gamephysics to bunnyhop / barrelroll?
| bunnyhopping is bugusing | 10% | 10% - 21 | ||||
| barrelrolling is bugusing | 1% | 1% - 3 | ||||
| both are bugusing | 10% | 10% - 20 | ||||
| none is. get used to poor hitboxes & adapt your aiming | 77% | 77% - 148 | ||||
| Total: 192 | ||||||
ull find alot of newb pilots barrel roll to avoid the tv not to cause confusion with the laggy hitbox (they havent discoverd that yet)CrazeD wrote:
I laugh when people try to barrel roll in choppers to avoid TV's.
I know where to aim.
and most of time youl notice if u miss the tv on them they end up ramming right into a building / tree / mountine
The only exploiting going on in this game is the g36e use
I'd like to see you bunny hop for 300m while being shot at. It isn't physically possible even for a basketball player.nonexistentusmc wrote:
Well I think bunny hopping and dolphin diving are valid because if we were really getting shot at, we'd be doing the same thing we do in the game. It's just how our mind works. Why complain about something that nature gave you? I know I'd do more than BHing and DDing in real life combat, I sure as hell don't want to get hit by any projectiles. Same in game. Basically my answer to the above is NO, it's none. ;D
People complain about it because they are smart enough to know that no one, even a basketball player, could jump that long and that far for more than two or three jumps at the most.FrankieSpankie3388 wrote:
I don't like people who complain about jumping around and stuff. Hell, if it was real life and you were in a firefight, would you run and jump and shit to avoid their fire? I got to the point where if somebody says something like "It's not leap frog you fag" in the in-game chat I just laugh and don't even respond. The thing I just really hate is that people call it bunny hop. It's NOT bunny hopping. Bunny hopping was the original term used in Counter-Strike (before 1.4, you have to admit, it was a pretty good game at first, then 1.4 came and fucked it all up) and Quake for the idea of jumping in a certain way that allows you to move faster. You cannot technically bunny hop in this game since you don't move faster when you jump, you just slow down.
I saw one guy jump for a rebound and tip the ball 5 times before someone else actually controlled it in a pro basketball game. I haven't seen anyone come close to anything in real life like that since. And that is in a less stressful environment than combat. All you people thinking that bunny hopping can be done in real life should put on 30 lbs worth of combat gear and an assault rifle and try it. Having been a grunt I know they don't teach you to jump around like a rabbit. It is hard enough carrying all that gear and being able to run 100m as fast as you can without anything on but a pair of shorts.
The chopper barrel roll can be done by a competent pilot. That is physically possible for the chopper to do with enough altitude. I never barrel roll a chopper but then I never think about trying it while flying. I'm usually too busy looking for targets to help my gunner kill the enemy as fast as possible. I'd rather have my gunner take out 6 or 7 ground targets as opposed to a single helo that's trying to distract me from my job. On certain maps in certain areas I will engage in a helo dual, but if there are ground targets available they are my preferred targets.
A) Agreedgene_pool wrote:
A) great great post.aLi3nZ wrote:
Great post. QFT +1SargeV1.4 wrote:
let me explain to you what a decent FPS game needs.
First off, Counter-Strike. As retarded as its player base is, much like that of BF2, you can't argue that there is plenty of skill to be had all the way up to the godlike status of some of the best players.
Now, in CS, you do not need to stand still to shoot. In fact, on many guns, your first shot is completely accurate. You can run around, be moving, and still be getting headshots. In other words, players can move around while shooting, and if they want to run nothing is stopping them, other than a well aimed shot from the opposition.
In Quake, you can run (read: bounce) around, all the while firing your ultra accurate railgun/rocket/blaster/etc. the fact that you are just as accurate while bouncing around as you are standing still makes for a very fun game: it is incredibly fast paced, and it takes a LOT of skill. Extreme accuracy from the guns in the game does not make it 'noobish', but far better, as the only factor is the players skill, and not luck.
In any populair FPS game the same principle goes: you can MOVE, at any time, and have proper accuracy too.
In Battlefield 2, you have to go prone to get high accuracy fast. However, in the older versions of BF2, going prone and getting back up again was instantaneous. And you could do all kinds of movements to stay in motion while still being prone. Thus, BF2 circumvented the principle of needing to stand to fire and still retain speed, by having these so-called "exploits".
Now, imagine if in Counter-Strike, you had to stand still for a full second before being able to fire accurately. And after you've fired, you have to wait another second before being able to move again. Thus, all shoot-outs become players simply standing still hoping their gun gets luckier first.
Enter 1.4
I hope you finally realise it now.
B) THE GREEN! ET BHURNZ!
B) Copying to Word and changing color make eyes happy.
I have no idea what barrelrolling is but like people already said bunny hopping in it's original definition isn't possible anymore but jumping up & down is kinda lame. I'll jump once, maybe twice if I'm trying to figure out where I'm geting shot from or reloading. If you wanna just hop around trying to avoid bullets, go right ahead, you can't shoot at me & I don't care what anyone says I'm still gonna hit you, the hitboxes don't change that much if at all. Do what you gotta do...
I think Hurricane said it best though:
I think Hurricane said it best though:
You have to adapt to whatever is going on around you.Hurricane wrote:
Players STILL bitching about it need to uninstall.
it is not about what is possible in reality. it is about what is in the GAME.DSRTurtle wrote:
I'd like to see you bunny hop for 300m while being shot at. It isn't physically possible even for a basketball player.
and enemy choppers are primary targets for a helicopter-crew. if you don´t take them out, they will
kill you. after shooting them, you have some time to take out ground targets.
but still that is not the point. the bunnyhop is no more, but people still accuse others of it.
I can accept people who go prone right away when facing an enemy but people who jump first and then go to prone is just anoying. Seems like you people have problem aiming because you need more time hitting the enemy otherwise you would lost a lot more. Don't try to bring in real life in to this game, BF2 is nerfed compared to real life.
Did u read it? he said barrel rolling in a chopper.Vub wrote:
How do you barrelroll? Honest question.
I've always thought that if the player presses "z" (ie go prone) whilst strafing left or right, it would look like they're barrelrolling to the opposition. But from the player's point of view it doesn't seem like this maneouvre gives them the same evasive advantage that is discussed here. So I'm thinking my version of barrelrolling might be different to yours.
So, again, how do you barrelroll?
There's nothing wrong with bunnyhopping it's to avoid stuff, now stfu fool.
Nice post Sarge
Nice post Sarge
I'll just post this again since I got no reply.
It also greatly oversimplifies the qualities that "make" an fps, and why competition can exist in BF2. I mean this is a BF2 forum, isn't anybody going to defend the game we play when sarge decides he's fed up with it?
It takes skill to work around BF2's difficult to predict nature. I find it easier to "get in the zone" with CS because its just much more steamlined. BF2's hundreds of bizarre timers mean that you have to do a little bit more planning before you make each move.
Its also fair to say that bf2 is biased towards any veterans, because there are countless facts you need to know about each weapon and place that ultimately determine your success. probably much moreso than CS. I admit that this is a bad aspect of bf2 for competition, however reducing BF2's faults to IO in 1.4 overlooks the fact that these "knowledge" advantages are far more pronounced when in vehicles than normal infantry (how about just where to stand in order to get a vehicle, most noobs stand around on chopper pads getting tked for 20 hours before they learn the first thing about what to do with one). vehicles also are fun and interesting, but they completely disrupt competition between infantry, so IO mode can be seen as beneficial to quality competition in BF2. i admit it is more of an accomplishment to survive out of IO, but if one team has the good tanker or pilot, then the other teams infantry can just expect to have a shit round almost no matter what. Bombs are big.
Owning somebody in BF2 is often more of an accomplishment than in other games because you know that you have to aim perfectly and continuously with most weapons to get a fast kill. In CS, one shot just grazing through the head, as in one lucky shot, due only to a lucky moment of perfect aim, is usually rewarded with a kill. In BF2 you have to go after everybody like you want to shoot them 10 times in the head. A pleasant amount of the time you get a one shot kill, but if your shooting is that fast and deliberate, you will be just as sure to get the 5 shot kill.
You are playing a probablistic game with each shot you fire. So if you set out to kill with few bullets, then you are choosing not to roll the die. Winning consistently in BF2 is about setting yourself up to roll the die against your opponent more times than they can to you.
This playing style is encouraged by BF2 teamplay. Ammo is meaningless, crates and bags abound and every kill buys you a probably full load of ammo to fall back on.
Its a finer point of BF2 infantry that few people seem to get. If the guns are intrinsically inaccurate, then you have to fire more shots. If you are just sitting there letting people roll the dice at you, then youre gonna die. It may slow down the action as you describe it, but the time is easily filled with key ideas that make the difference between living and dying.
Because everybody is playing under the same conditions there is still great potential for competition (except they arent because a person with a crap video card has next to no chance in BF2). In BF2 it has more to do with positional strategy than raw reflex talent. RTS games are fun while being pretty much completely strategic. Its ok for a game to have the FPS perspective but challenge different faculties more or less than others, right?
Sarge, i realize you probably know most of what i am saying right now, but without this stuff i feel like the post comes off one-sided. I know BF2 isn't perfect but its not as bad as you make it sound.
And I really don't think CS is that cool. Its like BF2 on rollerblades or something. I keep looking for the fanny-pack button.
QFT. really good post.SargeV1.4 wrote:
let me explain to you what a decent FPS game needs.
First off, Counter-Strike. As retarded as its player base is, much like that of BF2, you can't argue that there is plenty of skill to be had all the way up to the godlike status of some of the best players.
Now, in CS, you do not need to stand still to shoot. In fact, on many guns, your first shot is completely accurate. You can run around, be moving, and still be getting headshots. In other words, players can move around while shooting, and if they want to run nothing is stopping them, other than a well aimed shot from the opposition.
In Quake, you can run (read: bounce) around, all the while firing your ultra accurate railgun/rocket/blaster/etc. the fact that you are just as accurate while bouncing around as you are standing still makes for a very fun game: it is incredibly fast paced, and it takes a LOT of skill. Extreme accuracy from the guns in the game does not make it 'noobish', but far better, as the only factor is the players skill, and not luck.
In any populair FPS game the same principle goes: you can MOVE, at any time, and have proper accuracy too.
In Battlefield 2, you have to go prone to get high accuracy fast. However, in the older versions of BF2, going prone and getting back up again was instantaneous. And you could do all kinds of movements to stay in motion while still being prone. Thus, BF2 circumvented the principle of needing to stand to fire and still retain speed, by having these so-called "exploits".
Now, imagine if in Counter-Strike, you had to stand still for a full second before being able to fire accurately. And after you've fired, you have to wait another second before being able to move again. Thus, all shoot-outs become players simply standing still hoping their gun gets luckier first.
Enter 1.4
I hope you finally realise it now.
It also greatly oversimplifies the qualities that "make" an fps, and why competition can exist in BF2. I mean this is a BF2 forum, isn't anybody going to defend the game we play when sarge decides he's fed up with it?
It takes skill to work around BF2's difficult to predict nature. I find it easier to "get in the zone" with CS because its just much more steamlined. BF2's hundreds of bizarre timers mean that you have to do a little bit more planning before you make each move.
Its also fair to say that bf2 is biased towards any veterans, because there are countless facts you need to know about each weapon and place that ultimately determine your success. probably much moreso than CS. I admit that this is a bad aspect of bf2 for competition, however reducing BF2's faults to IO in 1.4 overlooks the fact that these "knowledge" advantages are far more pronounced when in vehicles than normal infantry (how about just where to stand in order to get a vehicle, most noobs stand around on chopper pads getting tked for 20 hours before they learn the first thing about what to do with one). vehicles also are fun and interesting, but they completely disrupt competition between infantry, so IO mode can be seen as beneficial to quality competition in BF2. i admit it is more of an accomplishment to survive out of IO, but if one team has the good tanker or pilot, then the other teams infantry can just expect to have a shit round almost no matter what. Bombs are big.
Owning somebody in BF2 is often more of an accomplishment than in other games because you know that you have to aim perfectly and continuously with most weapons to get a fast kill. In CS, one shot just grazing through the head, as in one lucky shot, due only to a lucky moment of perfect aim, is usually rewarded with a kill. In BF2 you have to go after everybody like you want to shoot them 10 times in the head. A pleasant amount of the time you get a one shot kill, but if your shooting is that fast and deliberate, you will be just as sure to get the 5 shot kill.
You are playing a probablistic game with each shot you fire. So if you set out to kill with few bullets, then you are choosing not to roll the die. Winning consistently in BF2 is about setting yourself up to roll the die against your opponent more times than they can to you.
This playing style is encouraged by BF2 teamplay. Ammo is meaningless, crates and bags abound and every kill buys you a probably full load of ammo to fall back on.
Its a finer point of BF2 infantry that few people seem to get. If the guns are intrinsically inaccurate, then you have to fire more shots. If you are just sitting there letting people roll the dice at you, then youre gonna die. It may slow down the action as you describe it, but the time is easily filled with key ideas that make the difference between living and dying.
Because everybody is playing under the same conditions there is still great potential for competition (except they arent because a person with a crap video card has next to no chance in BF2). In BF2 it has more to do with positional strategy than raw reflex talent. RTS games are fun while being pretty much completely strategic. Its ok for a game to have the FPS perspective but challenge different faculties more or less than others, right?
Sarge, i realize you probably know most of what i am saying right now, but without this stuff i feel like the post comes off one-sided. I know BF2 isn't perfect but its not as bad as you make it sound.
And I really don't think CS is that cool. Its like BF2 on rollerblades or something. I keep looking for the fanny-pack button.
I love you so hard...-[Silver.Inc* wrote:
The only exploiting going on in this game is the g36e use
And when I read 'barrel rolling exploit' I though the threadstarter was referring to the animation that occurs when you strafe while proned. I've had a few people ask me "how do you do that barrel roll thing when you're on the ground".
And that guy in this thread what talked about how smart he is... ooooh, you sound like me when I first got flamed on a forum many many years ago. Intelligence gets you no-where in a forum argument. You need to drop some more 'nife u in da face, goatrooter''s and 'stfu noob i kn pwn u''s if you want to avoid being ridiculed.
win.MagikTrik wrote:
I have no idea what barrelrolling is but like people already said bunny hopping in it's original definition isn't possible anymore but jumping up & down is kinda lame. I'll jump once, maybe twice if I'm trying to figure out where I'm geting shot from or reloading. If you wanna just hop around trying to avoid bullets, go right ahead, you can't shoot at me & I don't care what anyone says I'm still gonna hit you, the hitboxes don't change that much if at all. Do what you gotta do...
I think Hurricane said it best though:
You have to adapt to whatever is going on around you.Hurricane wrote:
Players STILL bitching about it need to uninstall.
Add me on Origin for Battlefield 4 fun: DesKmal
Well said!Skorpy-chan wrote:
Bunnyhopping just looks dumb. Seriously, it doesen't work, it just confirms that yes, that dark lump IS a dude dressed as a bush over on that roof, and no, he hasn't spotted me yet. (burst burst burst dead reload rearm)
You're also too busy bouncing madly to shoot straight or escape, like the enemy commander I cornered in a bunker on Wake last night. Bouncing around like he had a spring up his arse, and actually prolonged his life by a second or two while his death caught up with him. (I emptied a DAO12 clip into him in the course of a couple of seconds, like you do. He continued bouncing, stopped, then dropped dead with an 'Urk!'.)
Barrelrolling... Ambivalent. Can actually be countered if you've got good enough aim. And really, if you're chopper duelling, you ain't doing yer damn job as a chopper-whore, which is to convert enemy armour into explosion.
That has overlaps with the jet-whore job, but they are primarily to stop other jet-whores from shrapnelling armour, stop chopper whores from raping everything that moves, knock flag-capping transport chopper squads out the sky, and taking out lone snipers/AT troops. In that order.
How does one equate someones ability to play a game like BF2 to their intelligence or lack there of (If you have a formula for doing so, send me the math please)? I haven't heard of a BF2 idiot savant but it would not surprise me if one existed. This "idiot" would be the best at BF2 but still be an "idiot". So, good at BF2 yes, smart, ahh no. And i bet if you put Einstein (RIP) in front of a pc and made him play BF2 he'd suck ass! Smart, oh ya but good at BF2, not so much.
Last edited by masculata (2007-01-12 20:36:41)
It fucks me off when people roll on the floor / prone cos no matter how much you are firing at them, it seems to have a delay. That's not the persons fault, it's the fuckin game engine.
In the little delay that seems non existant when people hop to the floor I have shot several bullets into the person's head as it's the only thing I can see as they're lying down, yet they can seem to one shot me after the non existant delay stops.
It's a pity really, it's one of the most annoying things in BF along with the C4 bug which I still get. Especially in 2142.
In the little delay that seems non existant when people hop to the floor I have shot several bullets into the person's head as it's the only thing I can see as they're lying down, yet they can seem to one shot me after the non existant delay stops.
It's a pity really, it's one of the most annoying things in BF along with the C4 bug which I still get. Especially in 2142.
funny that the people who complain about bunny hopping are a minority
in response to skorpy chans intellegence, and excluding the fact that he is prolly lying about his IQ.
I have taken a IQ test from a real doctor and it IS 135-145.
I have taken a IQ test from a real doctor and it IS 135-145.
Mekstizzle was right.
WTF is wrong with you people???!!! IT IS NOT A GLITCH: they coded it that way. This is buggy software, but hopping and rolling are part of how they intend the game to play. Rolling isn't even an action that the player can see. So that just leaves hopping. Hopping is stupid, stupid because only those with no real skills do it, and it looks pathetic. Nothing better than a squad of hoppers getting slaughtered.
WTF is wrong with you people???!!! IT IS NOT A GLITCH: they coded it that way. This is buggy software, but hopping and rolling are part of how they intend the game to play. Rolling isn't even an action that the player can see. So that just leaves hopping. Hopping is stupid, stupid because only those with no real skills do it, and it looks pathetic. Nothing better than a squad of hoppers getting slaughtered.
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