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2007-05-08 12:01:15
Lost Hope
Lurker
+20|6774|Brussels, Belgium
Good post, Turquoise, and I am sad to admit that you are right about the immigration issue.

People here don't understand that immigration is not a bad thing, even more when you look at the demography of Europe, they don't understand that the work the immigrants do are the ones that no European wants to do.
https://bf3s.com/sigs/9c9f8f6ff3579a4c711aa54bbb9e928ec0786003.png
2007-05-08 13:28:10
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6853|North Carolina
Thanks, Lost.

We have a similar situation here in America.  Mexicans, Central Americans, people from the Caribbean region, and South Americans all tend to fill the jobs that few Americans want to do.

Unfortunately, we've gone in the opposite direction.  We're TOO liberal when it comes to citizenship and labor laws.  Illegals are flooding the country, and wages are falling as a result.  We're also experiencing massive burdens on our social and healthcare systems.

So, essentially, America needs to become more conservative when it comes to border security, citizenship, and labor laws.  Europe needs to be more liberal about them.

Somewhere in the middle is a happy medium, but I don't know if we'll ever reach it....
2007-05-08 14:03:02
jonsimon
Member
+224|6943

ATG wrote:

About time somebody posted about the election. Nice job.

Thank god that weasely looking woman didn't win.
lololololo that sounds so sexist
2007-05-08 14:07:53
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6853|North Carolina
I don't know much about Royal, but she's actually kind of hot for a 50 year old...  lol

MILF!  j/k
2007-05-08 14:09:36
Doctor Strangelove
Real Battlefield Veterinarian.
+1,758|6916
I don't think France will start a new tread of conservatives in Europe. And also remember the only reason Sarkozy won was because his opponent was a Socialist.
2007-05-10 00:27:49
Harmor
Error_Name_Not_Found
+605|6996|San Diego, CA, USA

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Wait wait wait wait waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaait. Are you saying Republicans now support France? You remember those were the guys that didn't go with us to Iraq.
Its ok if a country doesn't send troops, but when they actively worked against you THEN we hold a grudge.
2007-05-10 01:14:35
PureFodder
Member
+225|6733

Kmarion wrote:

ATG wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

If it could actually be possible I think that Sarkozy is far far more of a hate figure in France than Chirac. Those that dislike him hate him with such a passion that it will spill over into violence from time to time. His bullshit speech about 'moving forward together' and 'we are united' was so patronising and such a brazen crock of shit that it almost made me barf. I can only imagine what those who didn't vote for him thought of it.

If he thinks he can change France's public sector and social welfare system then fair play to him if he can - because believe you me the left in France will NOT take it lying down. Expect strikes on a weekly basis. This could cripple France if he plays his cards wrong.
Ha/.
Civil disobedience over the majority FTL.
French people going on strike!? Never.

[/sarcasm]
2007-05-10 02:28:59
oug
Calmer than you are.
+380|6967|Πάϊ

Turquoise wrote:

In the bedroom and other aspects of personal life, Europe is more liberal than us, but when it comes to citizenship, America is MUCH more liberal.  So, to see Sarkozy as being significantly more conservative than usual is kind of misguided.  France is like many other European nations when it comes to strict citizenship and labor laws.  It's MUCH easier to find work in America as an immigrant than in most of Europe -- you don't even have to be a legal immigrant these days.

A friend of mine from Bosnia lived in Germany for a few years before moving to America.  He told me in great detail how there are different levels of citizenship in Germany.  Immigrants and even the children of immigrants who are born in Germany can never reach the level of citizenship that a native-born German has.  In America, this would be seen as blatantly racist.

So, this puts things in perspective when it comes to what is "conservative" in Europe.  They don't care what you do in your bedroom, but they do make a clear distinction between "natives" and immigrants.  Sarkozy is just more blatant about it than most, despite his own immigrant heritage.

You also have to remember that most European conservatives would be considered moderates in economic policy compared to American economic conservatives.

It's like how most social liberals here would be considered social moderates or conservatives in Europe.
There's a great difference between Europe and the US as far as immigration goes. Basically, American society is in itself a mix of many cultures and so immigrants don't make a big difference cultural-wise. On the other hand, European nations have more fragile societies. Cultural identities are at stake over here. Smaller nations could very well be completely overrun within their own country. Hence the strict measures for immigration. Its not a matter of conservatism.
ƒ³
2007-05-10 05:41:20
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|7122|Canberra, AUS
I think this is more to do with the paucity of the socialist camp than actual belief in conservatism.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman

 

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