Well, if you see the video you have your answer.
Am I talking to a brick wall?stef10 wrote:
Well, if you see the video you have your answer.
That video has nothing to do with how Muslims use the word 'Allah'.SpaceApollyon wrote:
...the guy on the video is convinced that these major religions have the same god. The God = Allah. And he rants about the issue for ten minutes. So what?stef10 wrote:
Just hear what he says and think then it will come!
...or better yet, it demonstrates my point of view, not yours.
Last edited by SpaceApollyon (2007-05-13 11:50:04)
lol, you may have a problem.SpaceApollyon wrote:
Am I talking to a brick wall?stef10 wrote:
Well, if you see the video you have your answer.That video has nothing to do with how Muslims use the word 'Allah'.SpaceApollyon wrote:
...the guy on the video is convinced that these major religions have the same god. The God = Allah. And he rants about the issue for ten minutes. So what?stef10 wrote:
Just hear what he says and think then it will come!
...or better yet, it demonstrates my point of view, not yours.
The quotes you provide are irrelevant. In the context of the Abrahamic God it goes like this:stef10 wrote:
Do you think that the following things seem logical.
Allah: Muslims, take neither Jews and Christians as your friends but as your enemies.
YHWH. Jews, you are my people, I have destroyed tribes for you.
THis is somewhat how it goes.
- Semites adopt Judaism as a religion (tribes connected with Abraham, Ismael, Isaac, etc.).
- Several thousand years later Jewish society is denounced by Jesus of Nazareth and John the Baptist who preach a newer more tolerant, more forgiving teaching of the same Abrahamic God. Jews largely reject this. Some Jews convert to Christianity. Most Christians are pulled from Pagan Europe where Saul of Tarsus preaches the word of Jesus. A lot of Christianity draws from Jewish doctrine and legend.
- Several hundred years later both Judaism and Christianity are denounced as being false/untrue (in part) with Mohammed declaring that the SAME Abrahamic God (of the Jews and Christians) has recited the true message of God to him. A lot of Islamic doctrine is drawn from Jewish & Christian doctrine and legend.
Is that too hard to understand?
I'm done with you and your great one-liners. Have a nice day.stef10 wrote:
lol, you may have a problem.
Likewise!
Thank You.CameronPoe wrote:
The quotes you provide are irrelevant. In the context of the Abrahamic God it goes like this:stef10 wrote:
Do you think that the following things seem logical.
Allah: Muslims, take neither Jews and Christians as your friends but as your enemies.
YHWH. Jews, you are my people, I have destroyed tribes for you.
THis is somewhat how it goes.
- Semites adopt Judaism as a religion (tribes connected with Abraham, Ismael, Isaac, etc.).
- Several thousand years later Jewish society is denounced by Jesus of Nazareth and John the Baptist who preach a newer more tolerant, more forgiving teaching of the same Abrahamic God. Jews largely reject this. Some Jews convert to Christianity. Most Christians are pulled from Pagan Europe where Saul of Tarsus preaches the word of Jesus. A lot of Christianity draws from Jewish doctrine and legend.
- Several hundred years later both Judaism and Christianity are denounced as being false/untrue (in part) with Mohammed declaring that the SAME Abrahamic God (of the Jews and Christians) has recited the true message of God to him. A lot of Islamic doctrine is drawn from Jewish & Christian doctrine and legend.
Is that too hard to understand?
If stef10 cannot grasp this explanation, then I feel very sorry for him.
Guys, I don't mean to alarm you, but if stef10 is right we all have multiple personality disorder and don't exist outside of these forums!
You say that these quotes are irrelevant! How in the world do they seem irrelevant.
They show that they are not the same. One hates jews the other loves jews. I am gonna find more things.
Of course I agree that Islam claims to have the same god but really do not.
They show that they are not the same. One hates jews the other loves jews. I am gonna find more things.
Of course I agree that Islam claims to have the same god but really do not.
Find away. You're hilarious. An 'everyone else in insane and I'm the only sane one' type of guy.stef10 wrote:
You say that these quotes are irrelevant! How in the world do they seem irrelevant.
They show that they are not the same. One hates jews the other loves jews. I am gonna find more things.
Of course I agree that Islam claims to have the same god but really do not.
"And do not dispute with the followers of the Book except by what is best, except those of them who act unjustly, and say: We believe in that which has been revealed to us and revealed to you, and our God and your God is One, and to Him do we submit." - Q'uran.
"Verily! Those who believe and those who are Jews and Christians, and Sabians, whoever believes in God and the Last Day and do righteous good deeds shall have their reward with their Lord, on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve." - Q'uran.
"O people of the Scripture : Come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but God, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides God." - Q'uran.
"And there are, certainly, among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), those who believe in God and in that which has been revealed to you, and in that which has been revealed to them, humbling themselves before God. They do not sell the Verses of God for a little price, for them is a reward with their Lord. Surely, God is Swift in account." - Q'uran.
Like most religious books - it's full of contradictory bullshit, much like the bible.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-05-14 06:09:36)
YHWH says that the Jews are his people.
Allah says that the Jews are enemies of Muslims and that they are greedy.
Is it so hard to see.
Allah says that the Jews are enemies of Muslims and that they are greedy.
Is it so hard to see.
Does he really now? Check my quotes in the edited post. Sound like they contradict you. Like all religious books the Q'uran contradicts itself. It's irrelevant anyway - the God is the same, the Q'uran is just saying that God has spoken to Mohammed and that those who don't believe God has relayed his message to the world through Mohammed are not true followers of God. The God is still the same, the accepted messenger is different.stef10 wrote:
YHWH says that the Jews are his people.
Allah says that the Jews are enemies of Muslims and that they are greedy.
Is it so hard to see.
Sura (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."
Yeah - what he's saying here is that Jews and Christians must be shunned because they have rejected the latest message from their God (the one true God of Abraham) which was passed down to 'earthlings' through Mohammed. Understand now? Did you read any of my fucking quotes?stef10 wrote:
Sura (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abrahamic_ … ons_of_God
Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-05-14 06:18:08)
Of course, it claims that the gods are the same!
Moon-god
"If a prophet, or one who foretells by dreams, appears among you and announces to you a miraculous sign or wonder, and if the sign or wonder of which he has spoken takes place, and he says, 'Let us follow other gods' (gods you have not known) 'and let us worship them,' you must not listen to the words of that prophet or dreamer. The Lord your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul. It is the Lord your God you must follow, and him you must revere. Keep his commands and obey him; serve him and hold fast to him. That prophet or dreamer must be put to death, because he preached rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt and redeemed you from the land of slavery; he has tried to turn you from the way the Lord your God commanded you to follow. You must purge the evil from among you" (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NIV).
"But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded him to say, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, must be put to death. You may say to yourselves, 'How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD?' If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him." Deuteronomy 18:20-22
Muhammed did this so therefor you can not take his words and therefor you can not say that YHWH and Allah are the same since his telling is untrue.
Is that so hard to understand?
Moon-god
"If a prophet, or one who foretells by dreams, appears among you and announces to you a miraculous sign or wonder, and if the sign or wonder of which he has spoken takes place, and he says, 'Let us follow other gods' (gods you have not known) 'and let us worship them,' you must not listen to the words of that prophet or dreamer. The Lord your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul. It is the Lord your God you must follow, and him you must revere. Keep his commands and obey him; serve him and hold fast to him. That prophet or dreamer must be put to death, because he preached rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt and redeemed you from the land of slavery; he has tried to turn you from the way the Lord your God commanded you to follow. You must purge the evil from among you" (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NIV).
"But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded him to say, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, must be put to death. You may say to yourselves, 'How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD?' If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him." Deuteronomy 18:20-22
Muhammed did this so therefor you can not take his words and therefor you can not say that YHWH and Allah are the same since his telling is untrue.
Is that so hard to understand?
Last edited by stef10 (2007-05-14 06:37:39)
Yes it does. Why? Because that's what the whole fucking belief system is based on!!!!stef10 wrote:
Of course, it claims that the gods are the same!
Abrahamic God.
The God of Abraham.
A.B.R.A.H.A.M.
Capische?
Entiendes?
Under-fucking-stand?
Omg, you are just completely funny! You do not investigate your things as you should. It surprises me that you even went to uni.
I give up. This guy is brainwashed. Can I ask what age you are? Not meaning to be derogatory, I'm just interested.stef10 wrote:
Omg, you are just completely funny! You do not investigate your things as you should. It surprises me that you even went to uni.
Well, I just found the examples! If you read them and if you have a college education then it is not so hard.
What about my fucking examples which show you to be incorrect? Put yourself in the shoes of a Muslim - they believe that you are followers of the Abrahamic God who have not followed his true path because you have rejected the word he sent to the world through Mohammed. It's the same way that Christians think that Jews are followers of the Abrahamic God but have not followed his true path because they rejected the word he sent to the world through Jesus, whom they denounced as an impostor.stef10 wrote:
Well, I just found the examples! If you read them and if you have a college education then it is not so hard.
PS I have a 1st Class Honours Degree in Engineering and nearly 6 years experience in Electricity Transmission Network Planning.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-05-14 06:49:41)
I thought the intial rule for Jihad was not to attack Christians and Jews (Crusade era). So shouldn't Muslims love Jews and Christians?
Congrats with the education.
Well, you have just viewed the true origin of Allah.
You have viewed the false prophesies of Muhammad and SINCE they are FALSE you can not take what he says as true.
And if you truely believe in somethings make sure to investigate it so much so that you are sure that you really want top belive in it.
Well, you have just viewed the true origin of Allah.
You have viewed the false prophesies of Muhammad and SINCE they are FALSE you can not take what he says as true.
And if you truely believe in somethings make sure to investigate it so much so that you are sure that you really want top belive in it.
Last edited by stef10 (2007-05-14 06:57:11)
I don't believe in any religion. It's all bullshit. WTF are you talking about?stef10 wrote:
Congrats with the education.
Well, you have just viewed the true origin of Allah.
You have viewed the false prophesies of Muhammad and SINCE they are FALSE you can not take what he says as true.
And if you truely believe in somethings make sure to investigate it so much so that you are sure that you really want top belive in it.
Whether or not the prophesies are false is a matter of personal belief. The thing is that Moses, Jesus and Mohammed all thought they were speaking directly with God, the God of Abraham. Which one you believe doesn't matter a fuck.
all the above doesn't dispute that it's all the same God though, just depends which messanger of the same "God" you chose to side with. Is that so hard for you to grasp?stef10 wrote:
Congrats with the education.
Well, you have just viewed the true origin of Allah.
You have viewed the false prophesies of Muhammad and SINCE they are FALSE you can not take what he says as true.
And if you truely believe in somethings make sure to investigate it so much so that you are sure that you really want top belive in it.
I was talking about the " what if you were in their shoes" thing. I am just saying what God said.
And well, I just showed what the origins of Allah was.
Damn, the word" grasp" is fuc king weird.
Damn, I do not want to play anymore. Need to practise for exam tomorrow.
And well, I just showed what the origins of Allah was.
Damn, the word" grasp" is fuc king weird.
Damn, I do not want to play anymore. Need to practise for exam tomorrow.
Last edited by stef10 (2007-05-14 07:09:29)