Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6643|Winland

Yet again I'm no vegetarian.
The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6643|Winland

Sorry, I missed it. this is going fast. Anyone who know that that person (Or animal) has done something wrong deservevs death and torture more than a person(Or animal) that has never done something wrong.
The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
Jello.01
Member
+46|7055|DFW, Texas

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Sorry, I missed it. this is going fast. Anyone who know that that person (Or animal) has done something wrong deservevs death and torture more than a person(Or animal) that has never done something wrong.
Who is going to torture and kill this said person?
Because whoever does that must be killed as they have done something wrong too.

It just doesn't happen that way, most of us have learned that you can't get what you always want.
Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6643|Winland

Jello.01 wrote:

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Sorry, I missed it. this is going fast. Anyone who know that that person (Or animal) has done something wrong deservevs death and torture more than a person(Or animal) that has never done something wrong.
Who is going to torture and kill this said person?
Because whoever does that must be killed as they have done something wrong too.

It just doesn't happen that way, most of us have learned that you can't get what you always want.
Don't drag in anoher part now...
The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
Tshadow
Member
+3|7141

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Sorry, I missed it. this is going fast. Anyone who know that that person (Or animal) has done something wrong deservevs death and torture more than a person(Or animal) that has never done something wrong.
since you say that an animal cannot commit a SIN..so you basically saying that its better to kill people ( who is my eyes are still innocent) rather than killing animals..and i guess you will also choose your pet rat over your MOM ( cuz she has sinned) since you didnt reply to that arguement.

Also what SIN is a 5 year old punishable for ( BY DEATH AND TORTURE) PLEASE TELL ME..you didn't answer it yet.AND I DUNNO WHAT YOUR Neo-Dimensionist GROUP BELIEVES In..BUT BY TALKING TO YOU..I dun get attracted to yuor Neo-Dimensionist movement

Last edited by Tshadow (2007-06-09 23:50:16)

Jello.01
Member
+46|7055|DFW, Texas

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Jello.01 wrote:

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Sorry, I missed it. this is going fast. Anyone who know that that person (Or animal) has done something wrong deservevs death and torture more than a person(Or animal) that has never done something wrong.
Who is going to torture and kill this said person?
Because whoever does that must be killed as they have done something wrong too.

It just doesn't happen that way, most of us have learned that you can't get what you always want.
Don't drag in anoher part now...
I'm not, you said "that any person that has done something wrong deserves death and torture most than someone who has not done something wrong."

But who is going to torture and kill this person, I know I wouldn't want to torture and kill myself, neither does anyone else, except for those few who just hate life.

And I brought in the "you can't get what you always want" because that's what you want right?
Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6643|Winland

Jello.01 wrote:

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Jello.01 wrote:


Who is going to torture and kill this said person?
Because whoever does that must be killed as they have done something wrong too.

It just doesn't happen that way, most of us have learned that you can't get what you always want.
Don't drag in anoher part now...
I'm not, you said "that any person that has done something wrong deserves death and torture most than someone who has not done something wrong."

But who is going to torture and kill this person, I know I wouldn't want to torture and kill myself, neither does anyone else, except for those few who just hate life.

And I brought in the "you can't get what you always want" because that's what you want right?
To make it all simple: Someone that has been doing bad stuff of any kind deserves punishment more than someone who hasn't.

And you brought in "the punisher" into the picture
The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
CommieChipmunk
Member
+488|7016|Portland, OR, USA
I've been a vegetarian for 5 months now.. that's a reason why
Ridir
Semper Fi!
+48|7210
Freezer you're an idealist.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, it's actually a good thing.  But your argument sucks. End of story, flat out, it sucks.  People are what I would say, inherently evil in many ways.  Greed, glory, and God(s) (of all sorts, shapes, religions) shape the structure of mankind.  Most people are greedy and want the best for themselves and screw the rest, some are the exact opposite, and somewhere in the middle are the ones that will try and help but don't want to be left out in the cold either.  Glory and God(s) are the other two motivators but I'm not even going to start discussing them in this post.

Greed.  You have the United States as an example.  Since the introduction of the United States from WWII on it has been a global super power with its hands in every cookie jar around the world increasing its power and worth.  With that it has also increased its population to now over 300 million people.  300 million freezer, think about that.  Even if twenty percent of the population were strictly veggie that would still leave 240 million meat eaters.  Do you think there is a way to raise that much meat without the giant farms? 

Yes, there are. 

But those ways cost money and no one wants to spend more money then they have to.  I go to costco and buy my meat whole sale, six pounds of ground beef, six to eight steaks, eight to twelve pork chops, sixteen to twenty-two boneless skinless chicken breast at a time.  Those range from $15-38 (US) a piece and I can only afford to buy one at a time right now because I'm not anywhere near a "comfortable" American income. 

Now if I suddenly started seeing an extra dollar or two a pound then I wouldn't be able to buy it hardly at all.  And with that problem comes what lies across the globe in other nations were meat, vegetables, even water, are hard to come by.  People in Africa eat dirt because their bodies are compelled to for the daily iron intake (which is provided by red meat and some vegatables).   Now can I play a youtube.com clip of the starving kids in Africa next to yours and see who gets more sympathy?

I'm not saying that animals are not without compassion, and I believe that they should not be treated badly or hurt. But I also believe that the needs of man, woman and child come before the needs of the animals.  Increasing the price of meat hurts people across the globe.  Including a painkiller for every animal to be branded, castrated, clipped, etc. would increase the price insanely.  Rehabilitating animals that were on their way to the slaughter house because they were in a truck accident is like having the medical kit in the death chamber at a prison incase the prisioner has a heart attack before his lethal injection, stupid and waste money.   

I could keep going but I am a little tired and a little drunk and feel like I haven't connected the dots with a perfectly straight line so please, read between the lines/dots... eh, hell... you know what I mean folks.  The usual rant from me.
Jello.01
Member
+46|7055|DFW, Texas

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Jello.01 wrote:

Freezer7Pro wrote:


Don't drag in anoher part now...
I'm not, you said "that any person that has done something wrong deserves death and torture most than someone who has not done something wrong."

But who is going to torture and kill this person, I know I wouldn't want to torture and kill myself, neither does anyone else, except for those few who just hate life.

And I brought in the "you can't get what you always want" because that's what you want right?
To make it all simple: Someone that has been doing bad stuff of any kind deserves punishment more than someone who hasn't.

And you brought in "the punisher" into the picture
Sure they deserve punishment, but who will execute this punishment?

Anyone can deserve anything, though, it may or may not happen

To those people who tortured the cows, sure it was wrong, but they are just giving themselves bad business, because as stated before, people do not want "tough" meat. Those people did it because they could.
Jello.01
Member
+46|7055|DFW, Texas

Ridir wrote:

Freezer you're an idealist.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, it's actually a good thing.  But your argument sucks. End of story, flat out, it sucks.  People are what I would say, inherently evil in many ways.  Greed, glory, and God(s) (of all sorts, shapes, religions) shape the structure of mankind.  Most people are greedy and want the best for themselves and screw the rest, some are the exact opposite, and somewhere in the middle are the ones that will try and help but don't want to be left out in the cold either.  Glory and God(s) are the other two motivators but I'm not even going to start discussing them in this post.

Greed.  You have the United States as an example.  Since the introduction of the United States from WWII on it has been a global super power with its hands in every cookie jar around the world increasing its power and worth.  With that it has also increased its population to now over 300 million people.  300 million freezer, think about that.  Even if twenty percent of the population were strictly veggie that would still leave 240 million meat eaters.  Do you think there is a way to raise that much meat without the giant farms? 

Yes, there are. 

But those ways cost money and no one wants to spend more money then they have to.  I go to costco and buy my meat whole sale, six pounds of ground beef, six to eight steaks, eight to twelve pork chops, sixteen to twenty-two boneless skinless chicken breast at a time.  Those range from $15-38 (US) a piece and I can only afford to buy one at a time right now because I'm not anywhere near a "comfortable" American income. 

Now if I suddenly started seeing an extra dollar or two a pound then I wouldn't be able to buy it hardly at all.  And with that problem comes what lies across the globe in other nations were meat, vegetables, even water, are hard to come by.  People in Africa eat dirt because their bodies are compelled to for the daily iron intake (which is provided by red meat and some vegatables).   Now can I play a youtube.com clip of the starving kids in Africa next to yours and see who gets more sympathy?

I'm not saying that animals are not without compassion, and I believe that they should not be treated badly or hurt. But I also believe that the needs of man, woman and child come before the needs of the animals.  Increasing the price of meat hurts people across the globe.  Including a painkiller for every animal to be branded, castrated, clipped, etc. would increase the price insanely.  Rehabilitating animals that were on their way to the slaughter house because they were in a truck accident is like having the medical kit in the death chamber at a prison incase the prisioner has a heart attack before his lethal injection, stupid and waste money.   

I could keep going but I am a little tired and a little drunk and feel like I haven't connected the dots with a perfectly straight line so please, read between the lines/dots... eh, hell... you know what I mean folks.  The usual rant from me.
THANK YOU!!!

That's everything I wanted to say, I just couldn't figure out a way to express it.

Shit happens, no matter who/what it is.
Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6643|Winland

Ridir wrote:

Freezer you're an idealist.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, it's actually a good thing.  But your argument sucks. End of story, flat out, it sucks.  People are what I would say, inherently evil in many ways.  Greed, glory, and God(s) (of all sorts, shapes, religions) shape the structure of mankind.  Most people are greedy and want the best for themselves and screw the rest, some are the exact opposite, and somewhere in the middle are the ones that will try and help but don't want to be left out in the cold either.  Glory and God(s) are the other two motivators but I'm not even going to start discussing them in this post.

Greed.  You have the United States as an example.  Since the introduction of the United States from WWII on it has been a global super power with its hands in every cookie jar around the world increasing its power and worth.  With that it has also increased its population to now over 300 million people.  300 million freezer, think about that.  Even if twenty percent of the population were strictly veggie that would still leave 240 million meat eaters.  Do you think there is a way to raise that much meat without the giant farms? 

Yes, there are. 

But those ways cost money and no one wants to spend more money then they have to.  I go to costco and buy my meat whole sale, six pounds of ground beef, six to eight steaks, eight to twelve pork chops, sixteen to twenty-two boneless skinless chicken breast at a time.  Those range from $15-38 (US) a piece and I can only afford to buy one at a time right now because I'm not anywhere near a "comfortable" American income. 

Now if I suddenly started seeing an extra dollar or two a pound then I wouldn't be able to buy it hardly at all.  And with that problem comes what lies across the globe in other nations were meat, vegetables, even water, are hard to come by.  People in Africa eat dirt because their bodies are compelled to for the daily iron intake (which is provided by red meat and some vegatables).   Now can I play a youtube.com clip of the starving kids in Africa next to yours and see who gets more sympathy?

I'm not saying that animals are not without compassion, and I believe that they should not be treated badly or hurt. But I also believe that the needs of man, woman and child come before the needs of the animals.  Increasing the price of meat hurts people across the globe.  Including a painkiller for every animal to be branded, castrated, clipped, etc. would increase the price insanely.  Rehabilitating animals that were on their way to the slaughter house because they were in a truck accident is like having the medical kit in the death chamber at a prison incase the prisioner has a heart attack before his lethal injection, stupid and waste money.   

I could keep going but I am a little tired and a little drunk and feel like I haven't connected the dots with a perfectly straight line so please, read between the lines/dots... eh, hell... you know what I mean folks.  The usual rant from me.
Good point. I think you've put an end to this thread. You've made a good combination of both parts. Good job
The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
CommieChipmunk
Member
+488|7016|Portland, OR, USA

Jello.01 wrote:

Ridir wrote:

Freezer you're an idealist.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, it's actually a good thing.  But your argument sucks. End of story, flat out, it sucks.  People are what I would say, inherently evil in many ways.  Greed, glory, and God(s) (of all sorts, shapes, religions) shape the structure of mankind.  Most people are greedy and want the best for themselves and screw the rest, some are the exact opposite, and somewhere in the middle are the ones that will try and help but don't want to be left out in the cold either.  Glory and God(s) are the other two motivators but I'm not even going to start discussing them in this post.

Greed.  You have the United States as an example.  Since the introduction of the United States from WWII on it has been a global super power with its hands in every cookie jar around the world increasing its power and worth.  With that it has also increased its population to now over 300 million people.  300 million freezer, think about that.  Even if twenty percent of the population were strictly veggie that would still leave 240 million meat eaters.  Do you think there is a way to raise that much meat without the giant farms? 

Yes, there are. 

But those ways cost money and no one wants to spend more money then they have to.  I go to costco and buy my meat whole sale, six pounds of ground beef, six to eight steaks, eight to twelve pork chops, sixteen to twenty-two boneless skinless chicken breast at a time.  Those range from $15-38 (US) a piece and I can only afford to buy one at a time right now because I'm not anywhere near a "comfortable" American income. 

Now if I suddenly started seeing an extra dollar or two a pound then I wouldn't be able to buy it hardly at all.  And with that problem comes what lies across the globe in other nations were meat, vegetables, even water, are hard to come by.  People in Africa eat dirt because their bodies are compelled to for the daily iron intake (which is provided by red meat and some vegatables).   Now can I play a youtube.com clip of the starving kids in Africa next to yours and see who gets more sympathy?

I'm not saying that animals are not without compassion, and I believe that they should not be treated badly or hurt. But I also believe that the needs of man, woman and child come before the needs of the animals.  Increasing the price of meat hurts people across the globe.  Including a painkiller for every animal to be branded, castrated, clipped, etc. would increase the price insanely.  Rehabilitating animals that were on their way to the slaughter house because they were in a truck accident is like having the medical kit in the death chamber at a prison incase the prisioner has a heart attack before his lethal injection, stupid and waste money.   

I could keep going but I am a little tired and a little drunk and feel like I haven't connected the dots with a perfectly straight line so please, read between the lines/dots... eh, hell... you know what I mean folks.  The usual rant from me.
THANK YOU!!!

That's everything I wanted to say, I just couldn't figure out a way to express it.

Shit happens, no matter who/what it is.
and you just live with it right? there's nothing you can do...

great way to live life
Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6643|Winland

I now unsubscrive from here never to return again... Great discussion, four pages
The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
Jello.01
Member
+46|7055|DFW, Texas

CommieChipmunk wrote:

Jello.01 wrote:

Ridir wrote:

Freezer you're an idealist.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, it's actually a good thing.  But your argument sucks. End of story, flat out, it sucks.  People are what I would say, inherently evil in many ways.  Greed, glory, and God(s) (of all sorts, shapes, religions) shape the structure of mankind.  Most people are greedy and want the best for themselves and screw the rest, some are the exact opposite, and somewhere in the middle are the ones that will try and help but don't want to be left out in the cold either.  Glory and God(s) are the other two motivators but I'm not even going to start discussing them in this post.

Greed.  You have the United States as an example.  Since the introduction of the United States from WWII on it has been a global super power with its hands in every cookie jar around the world increasing its power and worth.  With that it has also increased its population to now over 300 million people.  300 million freezer, think about that.  Even if twenty percent of the population were strictly veggie that would still leave 240 million meat eaters.  Do you think there is a way to raise that much meat without the giant farms? 

Yes, there are. 

But those ways cost money and no one wants to spend more money then they have to.  I go to costco and buy my meat whole sale, six pounds of ground beef, six to eight steaks, eight to twelve pork chops, sixteen to twenty-two boneless skinless chicken breast at a time.  Those range from $15-38 (US) a piece and I can only afford to buy one at a time right now because I'm not anywhere near a "comfortable" American income. 

Now if I suddenly started seeing an extra dollar or two a pound then I wouldn't be able to buy it hardly at all.  And with that problem comes what lies across the globe in other nations were meat, vegetables, even water, are hard to come by.  People in Africa eat dirt because their bodies are compelled to for the daily iron intake (which is provided by red meat and some vegatables).   Now can I play a youtube.com clip of the starving kids in Africa next to yours and see who gets more sympathy?

I'm not saying that animals are not without compassion, and I believe that they should not be treated badly or hurt. But I also believe that the needs of man, woman and child come before the needs of the animals.  Increasing the price of meat hurts people across the globe.  Including a painkiller for every animal to be branded, castrated, clipped, etc. would increase the price insanely.  Rehabilitating animals that were on their way to the slaughter house because they were in a truck accident is like having the medical kit in the death chamber at a prison incase the prisioner has a heart attack before his lethal injection, stupid and waste money.   

I could keep going but I am a little tired and a little drunk and feel like I haven't connected the dots with a perfectly straight line so please, read between the lines/dots... eh, hell... you know what I mean folks.  The usual rant from me.
THANK YOU!!!

That's everything I wanted to say, I just couldn't figure out a way to express it.

Shit happens, no matter who/what it is.
and you just live with it right? there's nothing you can do...

great way to live life
I never said you can't do anything about it, I just said, shit happens.
link52787
Member
+29|6968
Doesn't stop me from eating meat.


Troubling video but still doesn't deter my appetite for meat.

Putting torture aside.

What do you think would be the best way to kill an animal for food?

They would still have to go through some pain.
CommieChipmunk
Member
+488|7016|Portland, OR, USA

link52787 wrote:

Doesn't stop me from eating meat.


Troubling video but still doesn't deter my appetite for meat.

Putting torture aside.

What do you think would be the best way to kill an animal for food?

They would still have to go through some pain.
The only way that I will ever be able to justify eating meat again would be for me to raise and kill the animal.
xBlackPantherx
Grow up, or die
+142|6789|California

CommieChipmunk wrote:

link52787 wrote:

Doesn't stop me from eating meat.


Troubling video but still doesn't deter my appetite for meat.

Putting torture aside.

What do you think would be the best way to kill an animal for food?

They would still have to go through some pain.
The only way that I will ever be able to justify eating meat again would be for me to raise and kill the animal.
And how the FUCK would that justify it again?!?!?!?!
CommieChipmunk
Member
+488|7016|Portland, OR, USA

xBlackPantherx wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

link52787 wrote:

Doesn't stop me from eating meat.


Troubling video but still doesn't deter my appetite for meat.

Putting torture aside.

What do you think would be the best way to kill an animal for food?

They would still have to go through some pain.
The only way that I will ever be able to justify eating meat again would be for me to raise and kill the animal.
And how the FUCK would that justify it again?!?!?!?!
because I would know it wasn't tortured, it lived a decent life, and I don't have to rely on morons who torture the animal or pump it full of shit I really don't want to eat before they kill it to give me my food.
SmkenRez
Member
+10|6811|The other side of world
hell yeah i like dead sht live shit all of it. get over it and eat a steak or pork chop, chicken anyone ill kill you cook it.
xBlackPantherx
Grow up, or die
+142|6789|California

SmkenRez wrote:

hell yeah i like dead sht live shit all of it. get over it and eat a steak or pork chop, chicken anyone ill kill you cook it.
Just go.
Ridir
Semper Fi!
+48|7210

CommieChipmunk wrote:

and you just live with it right? there's nothing you can do...

great way to live life
No there are things you can do about it, but the first one isn't senselessly repeating your argument over and over and over .... and over again.  The most successful way to do something about it is to recommend to your local government, be it a city council, county board, state senator, federal senator or representative (these are from the US, every country has their own uniques and I am not researching them just for this post) and ask for them to have the local farms inspected or observed.  Sure the FDA has it's inspections but few of them are random enough for it to matter.  Suggesting that it help bolster the politicians appearance with rights activitist might motivate them enough to inspect it.  Also local news crews are wonderful at uncovering bad news so if you suspect a local farm of being out of line giving a helpful hint to the TV station or paper and having a large article about the farm could prove extremely useful.

Of course, most farms in the United States and 1st world countries will pass random inspections as will slaughter houses because they are kept to certain levels (I lived next to a chicken farm for four years and it looked nothing like what was shown in the video).  Oh, and I am sorry that something has to die for me to live, but thats how life is and humans are not always at the top of the food chain.
CommieChipmunk
Member
+488|7016|Portland, OR, USA

Ridir wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

and you just live with it right? there's nothing you can do...

great way to live life
No there are things you can do about it, but the first one isn't senselessly repeating your argument over and over and over .... and over again.  The most successful way to do something about it is to recommend to your local government, be it a city council, county board, state senator, federal senator or representative (these are from the US, every country has their own uniques and I am not researching them just for this post) and ask for them to have the local farms inspected or observed.  Sure the FDA has it's inspections but few of them are random enough for it to matter.  Suggesting that it help bolster the politicians appearance with rights activitist might motivate them enough to inspect it.  Also local news crews are wonderful at uncovering bad news so if you suspect a local farm of being out of line giving a helpful hint to the TV station or paper and having a large article about the farm could prove extremely useful.

Of course, most farms in the United States and 1st world countries will pass random inspections as will slaughter houses because they are kept to certain levels (I lived next to a chicken farm for four years and it looked nothing like what was shown in the video).  Oh, and I am sorry that something has to die for me to live, but thats how life is and humans are not always at the top of the food chain.
Fair enough, I'm not trying to impose my beliefs on anyone or anything; if you want to eat meat, by all means go ahead.  And, the aforementioned suggestions are great, but as a 16 year old kid, I highly doubt I'd get a lot of attention.. and really I don't want to.

Other people can live how they want - I just choose to stay out of it.
Ridir
Semper Fi!
+48|7210
You'd be surprised who can get what type of attention.  People that take a stand for what they believe in get attention no matter their age.  Just if they are in the wrong country and if its against the mob they tend to be found dead.
CommieChipmunk
Member
+488|7016|Portland, OR, USA

Ridir wrote:

You'd be surprised who can get what type of attention.  People that take a stand for what they believe in get attention no matter their age.  Just if they are in the wrong country and if its against the mob they tend to be found dead.
lol, them be fightin' words

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