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Poll

Would the world be better off without atheists

Yes32%32% - 29
No. ( Yes, your just lying to yourself)67%67% - 61
Total: 90
2007-12-21 12:38:12
Drakef
Cheeseburger Logicist
+117|6799|Vancouver

dayarath wrote:

atheism goes beyond me, saying there is no god with absolute certainty. I really would like someone to explain me, because so far I see it you'd need almost an infinite amount of knowledge to justify your belief in this. Probably most people saying they're atheists actually mean they're agnostic. But anyway; No, we won't be better off without them. They counter most religions and seem to keep eachother in a reasonably friendly balance.

And cam, people that believe in something surely can be way more intelligent than you'd ever think, for one I'd say you're one of the less-intelligent bashers saying stuff like that.
Atheism is not a belief, but a lack of belief. I have no belief in my mind that there is a god. It is not that I have the absolute belief that there is no god. You misunderstand atheism.

Atheism is about reason. I reason, with all rationale and logic, that there is very little probability of a god. Therefore, I should not have a belief in one. It is as concerning the existence of unicorns. I would not be so unwise to claim with absolute certainty that there are no unicorns, but I have great reason to conclude that it is unlikely there are any.
2007-12-21 12:38:58
Mitch
16 more years
+877|6962|South Florida

SharkyMcshark wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Why do atheists hate people who actually have faith in something?

I wouldn't say 'hate', I'd say 'look down upon'...

or 'seem to be more intelligent than' if you want to be really accurate.

[Flamewar]
Because most atheists have convinced themselves that religion is not much better than the palm readings you can get down at the local shire fair for two quid. That and they blame it for every conflict in the world today.

I try not to fall into that trap
Nooooooooooooooo, its not like the towel heads flew planes into our world trade center because they believed if they died killing non-believers they would go to a heaven paradise and receive 72 virgins and 10,000 slaves.... (sarcasm)


^Thats what the Koran teaches.

Last edited by Mitch (2007-12-21 12:42:22)

15 more years! 15 more years!
2007-12-21 12:41:19
Mitch
16 more years
+877|6962|South Florida

Drakef wrote:

dayarath wrote:

atheism goes beyond me, saying there is no god with absolute certainty. I really would like someone to explain me, because so far I see it you'd need almost an infinite amount of knowledge to justify your belief in this. Probably most people saying they're atheists actually mean they're agnostic. But anyway; No, we won't be better off without them. They counter most religions and seem to keep eachother in a reasonably friendly balance.

And cam, people that believe in something surely can be way more intelligent than you'd ever think, for one I'd say you're one of the less-intelligent bashers saying stuff like that.
Atheism is not a belief, but a lack of belief. I have no belief in my mind that there is a god. It is not that I have the absolute belief that there is no god. You misunderstand atheism.

Atheism is about reason. I reason, with all rationale and logic, that there is very little probability of a god. Therefore, I should not have a belief in one. It is as concerning the existence of unicorns. I would not be so unwise to claim with absolute certainty that there are no unicorns, but I have great reason to conclude that it is unlikely there are any.
Very well said, Drakef. Unicorns was a great example. You haven't searched the whole world to see if theres unicorns, but a fairy tale tells of them.
The bible is nothing more then a fairy tale.
15 more years! 15 more years!
2007-12-21 12:41:54
Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|7127|Tampa Bay Florida

Mitch wrote:

How come Atheists are the ONLY people in the world who don't fall for your stupid fairy tale?

I'll explain this 1 last time.


God was created because there was a lack of answers.

A few thousand years ago the Aztecs worshiped a sun god. They thought he dragged it across the sky in a chariot. And they wasted sacrifices just to please him.

We now know this is false.

Christian god was created because we cant explain death, and because luck cant simply just be luck, it has to be a miracle from god.

The fairy tale god you grew up loving is equally as stupid sounding as the sun god, your just too ignorant to think those thoughts because 'god is all knowing' and your afraid even thinking those thoughts will get you sent to hell!

I'll give whoever thought up the idea of the Christian religion credit, he made a religion without any way to bust it. For example: Any scientific proof that makes god seem fake, is always a 'test of faith'...

First of all, if god wanted people to believe in him, he should just fucking prove himself. Free will, yeah right, he gives you 'free will' and then sends you to hell for making the wrong choice.

Nice, what an asshole.
/win

Thats what I've never understood.... if everything the religious say is true than god must be one hell of a dickhead.
2007-12-21 12:42:31
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7018|SE London

I don't hate religious people. I kind of pity them.

To me, believing in a religion is like believing in the tooth fairy - pointless, but kind of quaint. I have no issue with people who believe there is some sort of higher power, but they aren't sure what it is (it's not an opinion I subscribe to, but it is at least in some way plausible). People who are gullible enough to follow a specific religion and believe that their particular religious dogma is right and everyone else's is wrong, seem exceptionally naive to me. Almost all the central theological themes at the heart of any major religion can be traced back to somewhere else, usually hijacked from another religion (typically these themes exert a level of control of people, which supports my position that all organised religions are simply established to control people) - surely if the religion was true, this wouldn't be the case.

If there were to be some sort of 'God' they would be unfathomable. Which means that none of the religions would have accurately portrayed anything about him. I have absolutely no doubt that all religions are completely wrong.

In any case, if I ever found out there was a God, I'd be awfully disappointed - it seems like a terrible cop out, such a beautiful universe working in such a wonderful harmonious balance it would be a real let down if it was all just a sham, put there by someone, instead of evolving naturally.
2007-12-21 12:49:46
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6436|...

Mitch wrote:

How come Atheists are the ONLY people in the world who don't fall for your stupid fairy tale?

I'll explain this 1 last time.


God was created because there was a lack of answers.

A few thousand years ago the Aztecs worshiped a sun god. They thought he dragged it across the sky in a chariot. And they wasted sacrifices just to please him.

We now know this is false.

Christian god was created because we cant explain death, and because luck cant simply just be luck, it has to be a miracle from god.

The fairy tale god you grew up loving is equally as stupid sounding as the sun god, your just too ignorant to think those thoughts because 'god is all knowing' and your afraid even thinking those thoughts will get you sent to hell!

I'll give whoever thought up the idea of the Christian religion credit, he made a religion without any way to bust it. For example: Any scientific proof that makes god seem fake, is always a 'test of faith'...

First of all, if god wanted people to believe in him, he should just fucking prove himself. Free will, yeah right, he gives you 'free will' and then sends you to hell for making the wrong choice.

Nice, what an asshole.
You're talking about christianity and the aztecian god at the moment, I'm talking about god in general. Yes I do believe it exists, whatever entity it may be, no I don't think it carries any resemblance to a human and neither do I think he's just there for someone to worship it.

Actually I believe in fate and not in some sort of person answering your prayers, luck and unlucky exists but hell, why I believe in god is because this universe miracoulesly fits, everything seems to be just a piece of a perfect puzzle. I wouldn't think this universe and anything around and on it is pure coincidence, it's mathematically seen just too darn perfect for that. You don't need to believe because people tell you to, I do because I choose to basing on what I've seen so far in my life.
inane little opines
2007-12-21 12:50:09
Frogfan105
Member
+18|6436|Your basement
And now an education video to show you all that god exists
2007-12-21 12:56:47
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7018|SE London

dayarath wrote:

I'm talking about god in general. Yes I do believe it exists, whatever entity it may be, no I don't think it carries any resemblance to a human and neither do I think he's just there for someone to worship it.

Actually I believe in fate and not in some sort of person answering your prayers, luck and unlucky exists but hell, why I believe in god is because this universe miracoulesly fits, everything seems to be just a piece of a perfect puzzle. I wouldn't think this universe and anything around and on it is pure coincidence, it's mathematically seen just too darn perfect for that. You don't need to believe because people tell you to, I do because I choose to basing on what I've seen so far in my life.
That is the sort of belief I have some sort of respect for. You believe in something, which is fair enough, your reasons for believing what you do seem perfectly valid. It is people who believe that 'God' is even remotely like the image/idea presented by any religion. Religion and belief/faith are two very different things.

Personally I hate to think that there was any sort of creator, it sort of cheapens the wonder of the universe.
2007-12-21 13:04:11
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark
Sure I believe in a God and I dont care a second if any others do or not-Sure people may find religious people stupid for believing in a creator, which makes the humanrace look like a dumb stone. If there is not any creator of the universe the universe means nothing and human race means nothing-Everything is nothing because its there without any meaning-This is sad-The universe is too perfect for it to be made by itself-way to complicated for everything to be made by nothing.
2007-12-21 13:07:08
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6436|...

Bertster7 wrote:

dayarath wrote:

I'm talking about god in general. Yes I do believe it exists, whatever entity it may be, no I don't think it carries any resemblance to a human and neither do I think he's just there for someone to worship it.

Actually I believe in fate and not in some sort of person answering your prayers, luck and unlucky exists but hell, why I believe in god is because this universe miracoulesly fits, everything seems to be just a piece of a perfect puzzle. I wouldn't think this universe and anything around and on it is pure coincidence, it's mathematically seen just too darn perfect for that. You don't need to believe because people tell you to, I do because I choose to basing on what I've seen so far in my life.
That is the sort of belief I have some sort of respect for. You believe in something, which is fair enough, your reasons for believing what you do seem perfectly valid. It is people who believe that 'God' is even remotely like the image/idea presented by any religion. Religion and belief/faith are two very different things.

Personally I hate to think that there was any sort of creator, it sort of cheapens the wonder of the universe.
Well the belief in a creator actually intrigues me of how the hell it managed to bend energy into shapes and everything, doesn't take the wonders away at all because we've maybe explored about 0.0001% of the universe's complexity so far, long road ahead. I have to agree that some people following a religion are total idiots, but some are quite reasonable too. I think it's mostly a means of interpretation of what people try to teach with the religions.

Last edited by dayarath (2007-12-21 13:07:23)

inane little opines
2007-12-21 13:07:39
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|7122|United States of America
Wow this is such a shameful display. It makes me feel bad to even identify myself as not an atheist.
2007-12-21 13:08:28
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark

dayarath wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

dayarath wrote:

I'm talking about god in general. Yes I do believe it exists, whatever entity it may be, no I don't think it carries any resemblance to a human and neither do I think he's just there for someone to worship it.

Actually I believe in fate and not in some sort of person answering your prayers, luck and unlucky exists but hell, why I believe in god is because this universe miracoulesly fits, everything seems to be just a piece of a perfect puzzle. I wouldn't think this universe and anything around and on it is pure coincidence, it's mathematically seen just too darn perfect for that. You don't need to believe because people tell you to, I do because I choose to basing on what I've seen so far in my life.
That is the sort of belief I have some sort of respect for. You believe in something, which is fair enough, your reasons for believing what you do seem perfectly valid. It is people who believe that 'God' is even remotely like the image/idea presented by any religion. Religion and belief/faith are two very different things.

Personally I hate to think that there was any sort of creator, it sort of cheapens the wonder of the universe.
Well the belief in a creator actually intrigues me of how the hell it managed to bend energy into shapes and everything, doesn't take the wonders away at all because we've maybe explored about 0.0001% of the universe's complexity so far, long road ahead. I have to agree that some people following a religion are total idiots, but some are quite reasonable too. I think it's mostly a means of interpretation of what people try to teach with the religions.
well, then you call a guy like Newton who invented Calculus for an idiot?

what have you invented?
2007-12-21 13:08:28
xRBLx
I've got lovely bunch of coconuts!!
+27|6792|England - Kent

stef10 wrote:

Sure I believe in a God and I dont care a second if any others do or not-Sure people may find religious people stupid for believing in a creator, which makes the humanrace look like a dumb stone. If there is not any creator of the universe the universe means nothing and human race means nothing-Everything is nothing because its there without any meaning-This is sad-The universe is too perfect for it to be made by itself-way to complicated for everything to be made by nothing.
I have said that so many times to people and I dont doubt it for a second.
If its true or not I bealive faith is a good thing, it gives purpose to those that have none and a reason to go on when there would be none.
Faith gave birth to the first set of laws at people abyed by and then there was order in the world.
2007-12-21 13:09:48
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark
The human race must have fear in it or else it will become too great in its mind that it will place the stones for its own destruction.
2007-12-21 13:16:21
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6436|...

stef10 wrote:

dayarath wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


That is the sort of belief I have some sort of respect for. You believe in something, which is fair enough, your reasons for believing what you do seem perfectly valid. It is people who believe that 'God' is even remotely like the image/idea presented by any religion. Religion and belief/faith are two very different things.

Personally I hate to think that there was any sort of creator, it sort of cheapens the wonder of the universe.
Well the belief in a creator actually intrigues me of how the hell it managed to bend energy into shapes and everything, doesn't take the wonders away at all because we've maybe explored about 0.0001% of the universe's complexity so far, long road ahead. I have to agree that some people following a religion are total idiots, but some are quite reasonable too. I think it's mostly a means of interpretation of what people try to teach with the religions.
well, then you call a guy like Newton who invented Calculus for an idiot?

what have you invented?
I'm sorry did I say that? surely calculus or as I call it analyse circles round the changes inbetween functions but I'm talking about energy strands as in like string theory, remember ; theory. It explains roughly what's going on with the energy strands but as logic as it looks I really want to see some proof these things exist.

and for the record, newton did WAY more than just invent calculus.
inane little opines
2007-12-21 13:18:47
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark
of course he did but since calculus is MATH.-kinda-but when thinking I see that mankind is a kinda dumb-we have not accomplished anything if you see the whole story.

Last edited by stef10 (2007-12-21 13:20:23)

2007-12-21 13:27:04
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6436|...

stef10 wrote:

of course he did but since calculus is MATH.-kinda-but when thinking I see that mankind is a kinda dumb-we have not accomplished anything if you see the whole story.
why on earth would you think we're a dumb-etc, I have no idea what you're on about please explain more thoroughly
inane little opines
2007-12-21 13:27:07
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7018|SE London

stef10 wrote:

Sure I believe in a God and I dont care a second if any others do or not-Sure people may find religious people stupid for believing in a creator, which makes the humanrace look like a dumb stone. If there is not any creator of the universe the universe means nothing and human race means nothing-Everything is nothing because its there without any meaning-This is sad-The universe is too perfect for it to be made by itself-way to complicated for everything to be made by nothing.
What do you base that on?
2007-12-21 13:32:28
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark
We are dumb because of our simple animalistic nature-Being arrogant and can never resort to a peaceful way out of different situations-Using excuses to do dumb things and let few men hold worlds technology back with more than hundred years.

I base it on my own opinion and basic philosophy-If a thing came out of nowhere it has no meaning because there is not a creator with an idea for a product.
2007-12-21 13:33:14
jord
Member
+2,382|7115|The North, beyond the wall.
When you call the human race dumb what are you comparing it to... Dolphins or Monkeys?
2007-12-21 13:34:46
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark

jord wrote:

When you call the human race dumb what are you comparing it to... Dolphins or Monkeys?
Im comparing it too what we could have been if we made wise decisions in critical times instead of being like animals and let our instinct and hateful nature win.
2007-12-21 13:37:40
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6436|...

stef10 wrote:

We are dumb because of our simple animalistic nature-Being arrogant and can never resort to a peaceful way out of different situations-Using excuses to do dumb things and let few men hold worlds technology back with more than hundred years.

I base it on my own opinion and basic philosophy-If a thing came out of nowhere it has no meaning because there is not a creator with an idea for a product.
well actually our scientific discoveries and improvements are kind of growing exponential in number, that we are animalistic doesn't make us barbaric at all, I mean we're animals like any other on this planet anyway, and probably related to some of them. Every aspect of our 'barbaric' behavior is usually coming forth on survival instinct, on the other side is our reasoning producing conflicts in between eachother. But hell if there's anything that speeds up technological improvement it's a massive war, which is odd.
inane little opines
2007-12-21 13:39:37
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark

dayarath wrote:

stef10 wrote:

We are dumb because of our simple animalistic nature-Being arrogant and can never resort to a peaceful way out of different situations-Using excuses to do dumb things and let few men hold worlds technology back with more than hundred years.

I base it on my own opinion and basic philosophy-If a thing came out of nowhere it has no meaning because there is not a creator with an idea for a product.
well actually our scientific discoveries and improvements are kind of growing exponential in number, that we are animalistic doesn't make us barbaric at all, I mean we're animals like any other on this planet anyway, and probably related to some of them. Every aspect of our 'barbaric' behavior is usually coming forth on survival instinct, on the other side is our reasoning producing conflicts in between eachother. But hell if there's anything that speeds up technological improvement it's a massive war, which is odd.
Its because we get filled with fear-A species which is threatening always seem to get a bit higher that they usually are-its a skill.
2007-12-21 13:42:27
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6436|...

stef10 wrote:

dayarath wrote:

stef10 wrote:

We are dumb because of our simple animalistic nature-Being arrogant and can never resort to a peaceful way out of different situations-Using excuses to do dumb things and let few men hold worlds technology back with more than hundred years.

I base it on my own opinion and basic philosophy-If a thing came out of nowhere it has no meaning because there is not a creator with an idea for a product.
well actually our scientific discoveries and improvements are kind of growing exponential in number, that we are animalistic doesn't make us barbaric at all, I mean we're animals like any other on this planet anyway, and probably related to some of them. Every aspect of our 'barbaric' behavior is usually coming forth on survival instinct, on the other side is our reasoning producing conflicts in between eachother. But hell if there's anything that speeds up technological improvement it's a massive war, which is odd.
Its because we get filled with fear-A species which is threatening always seem to get a bit higher that they usually are-its a skill.
which is why I said it because if it wasn't for those conflicts and barbaric nature we'd still probably be in the stone age.
inane little opines
2007-12-21 13:43:53
stef10
Member
+173|6919|Denmark

dayarath wrote:

stef10 wrote:

dayarath wrote:


well actually our scientific discoveries and improvements are kind of growing exponential in number, that we are animalistic doesn't make us barbaric at all, I mean we're animals like any other on this planet anyway, and probably related to some of them. Every aspect of our 'barbaric' behavior is usually coming forth on survival instinct, on the other side is our reasoning producing conflicts in between eachother. But hell if there's anything that speeds up technological improvement it's a massive war, which is odd.
Its because we get filled with fear-A species which is threatening always seem to get a bit higher that they usually are-its a skill.
which is why I said it because if it wasn't for those conflicts and barbaric nature we'd still probably be in the stone age.
Another reason why we suck?

 

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