I see a serious hate between sunni and shia.
Why do they have such serious hatred between each other anyways? They worship the same god and read the same scripture, don't they?GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
I see a serious hate between sunni and shia.
But they interpret the scripture differently.
"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation" - Barack Obama (a freshman senator from Illinios)
Yeah...kind of like Catholics and Protestants in N. Ireland.HurricaИe wrote:
Why do they have such serious hatred between each other anyways? They worship the same god and read the same scripture, don't they?GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
I see a serious hate between sunni and shia.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
because their religion is true,, I mean nobody with any religion can feel like what a Muslim feels,, he has a strong beliefs ,, ( simply they are strong because they are true and highly accepted by human nature ) so they pay a great respect to the religion and the holy things,,David.P wrote:
Allright Sonata i'll ask ya a question but i'll pull no punches. Got it?
Why do you Muslims get so offended when someone does something even remotely "blasphimus" and get into a pissy fit. While other religions can be offended 10 times worse and yet they dont go and burn down buildings.
and if a Muslim burn down a building ,, you can't say: that is Islam,
that is "his action" this action maybe Islamic and may not. so please don't judge the religion by the behavior of some people,, even if they are Muslims, because simply they may do wrong things.
you can judge the religion by looking at what is said in Quran and what Muhammad says and do.
insulting is generally forbidden in Islam ,, but it's ok to tell people what is right and what is wrong..it is okey to make a difference between a real prophet and a myth.David.P wrote:
Also tell me why is it ok for Muslims to draw Jews, Christians, Hindu's, And Buddhists in a negative way insulting them and their core belief's while one cartoon of the Mohammed(even if it's not mean to be offensive) is not ok?
the cartoons aren't ok because they are insulting holy things.
it is not about "yours" and "mine" it is about ",, it is about obeying God,, so Muslims should not do this because this is their way,, no ,, they should do this for God.David.P wrote:
Also explain to me why it's allright for your group to tell others how to live and force it with violence sometimes but we cant do the same?
when I say "follow Islam" I don't say that because Islam is my religion,, no this is wrong ,,, I should say that because Islam is right and this is what Allah ordered me to do.
Islam is not great because it is my religion,, it is great because it is great,, I'm not great ,, Islam is great
that is right lowing
First, let me thank you for coming on here and helping us better understand your religion.
Isn't comparing man (Mohammed) to God (holy) considered sinful? While Mohammed was the prophet, he was not divine (ie, holy)...so please explain that disconnect.
Of course, I realize there are similar inconsistencies in other religions. I'm trying to better understand your explanation of Islam here.
That is no different than any other religion, yet other religions don't (generally) have these overtly violent reactions to those types of things. Why the difference with Islam?Sonata wrote:
because their religion is true,, I mean nobody with any religion can feel like what a Muslim feels,, he has a strong beliefs ,, ( simply they are strong because they are true and highly accepted by human nature ) so they pay a great respect to the religion and the holy things,,David.P wrote:
Allright Sonata i'll ask ya a question but i'll pull no punches. Got it?
Why do you Muslims get so offended when someone does something even remotely "blasphimus" and get into a pissy fit. While other religions can be offended 10 times worse and yet they dont go and burn down buildings.
and if a Muslim burn down a building ,, you can't say: that is Islam,
that is "his action" this action maybe Islamic and may not. so please don't judge the religion by the behavior of some people,, even if they are Muslims, because simply they may do wrong things.
you can judge the religion by looking at what is said in Quran and what Muhammad says and do.
Some religions would consider Mohammed's teaching to be a "myth" (as you put it). How would you, as a Muslim, respond to a non-Muslim describing your religion as a "myth"?Sonata wrote:
insulting is generally forbidden in Islam ,, but it's ok to tell people what is right and what is wrong..it is okey to make a difference between a real prophet and a myth.David.P wrote:
Also tell me why is it ok for Muslims to draw Jews, Christians, Hindu's, And Buddhists in a negative way insulting them and their core belief's while one cartoon of the Mohammed(even if it's not mean to be offensive) is not ok?
the cartoons aren't ok because they are insulting holy things.
Isn't comparing man (Mohammed) to God (holy) considered sinful? While Mohammed was the prophet, he was not divine (ie, holy)...so please explain that disconnect.
Of course, I realize there are similar inconsistencies in other religions. I'm trying to better understand your explanation of Islam here.
Then how do you explain the enforcement of Sharia law on unwilling citizens, even non-Muslims? When you have a law system taken part and parcel from a religious text, you are by default forcing others to live with your religion's mandates.Sonata wrote:
it is not about "yours" and "mine" it is about ",, it is about obeying God,, so Muslims should not do this because this is their way,, no ,, they should do this for God.David.P wrote:
Also explain to me why it's allright for your group to tell others how to live and force it with violence sometimes but we cant do the same?
when I say "follow Islam" I don't say that because Islam is my religion,, no this is wrong ,,, I should say that because Islam is right and this is what Allah ordered me to do.
Islam is not great because it is my religion,, it is great because it is great,, I'm not great ,, Islam is great
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
I want to know your opinion on the military campaigns Muhammad and the people after him waged on Asia and Africa and some of Europe. Weren't they anti-Islamic? He was spreading the faith, ok. But he was doing so using force, bloodshed and generally bad things.
For me, it's almost as if he simply wanted power over the world. And used or created Islam as a means to help his own cause.
Where are you from? Not trying to be rude, but there's a high chance you're a muslim because your ancestors were forced to convert. You know, the whole dhimmi/jizya thing.
And I know the same goes for why alot of people are Christian.
I think religion is a very evil thing, only created by people because it's an easy way to garner power.
For me, it's almost as if he simply wanted power over the world. And used or created Islam as a means to help his own cause.
Where are you from? Not trying to be rude, but there's a high chance you're a muslim because your ancestors were forced to convert. You know, the whole dhimmi/jizya thing.
And I know the same goes for why alot of people are Christian.
I think religion is a very evil thing, only created by people because it's an easy way to garner power.
Last edited by Mek-Izzle (2008-02-05 04:11:56)
Islam is proved to be right,, it wasn't created by a man,, it just came from God.FEOS wrote:
That is no different than any other religion, yet other religions don't (generally) have these overtly violent reactions to those types of things. Why the difference with Islam?
remember that there is only one truth and one true religion and "beliefs".
If you asked me about violence ,, this word isn't clear, I agree that there are violent things in Islam ,, like cutting a hand or a head ,, or fighting some people,, but they are all great and good and just.
If there is a criminal,, he murders , rapes , steals,, isn't good to kill him ?
Anyway we ( Muslims ) can't talk about Islamic teachings to judge if they are good or bad?? just when we know that Muhammed said that ,, we directly believe it and think that it is good , just,, we never argue. that what is called "believing".
Well, humans must disagree,, and in this situation we can argue ( politely ) and everyone should give some proofs of his belief. I'm sure if anyone just used his mind and think logically,, he will surly believe in Islam and say: "Muhammad is right".FEOS wrote:
Some religions would consider Mohammed's teaching to be a "myth" (as you put it). How would you, as a Muslim, respond to a non-Muslim describing your religion as a "myth"?
There are some enemies of Islam who believe that Muhammed is right. but they refused following him.
You are right,, sorry for this language mistake,, I didn't mean it,, I used "holy" and meant "respected"..FEOS wrote:
Isn't comparing man (Mohammed) to God (holy) considered sinful? While Mohammed was the prophet, he was not divine (ie, holy)...so please explain that disconnect.
As I said it is not about forcing people ,, it is not about you and me,, it is about God,, about obeying God. and doing what God wants us to do exaclty.FEOS wrote:
Then how do you explain the enforcement of Sharia law on unwilling citizens, even non-Muslims? When you have a law system taken part and parcel from a religious text, you are by default forcing others to live with your religion's mandates.
If I person did just what God ordered him to do,, can you blame him ?
Last edited by Sonata (2008-02-05 07:29:26)
Force was the last choice, ok Muhammad fought ,, but do you claim that fighting is wrong in all cases ?? well if a criminal is fighting you,, don't you have the right to fight him ??Mek-Izzle wrote:
I want to know your opinion on the military campaigns Muhammad and the people after him waged on Asia and Africa and some of Europe. Weren't they anti-Islamic? He was spreading the faith, ok. But he was doing so using force, bloodshed and generally bad things.
You have to understand the situation well,,who is Muhammed?? is he a prophet ?? how did he use force?? and against who?? and why??
That's totally wrong,, he did all his actions just for God,, if you look at Muhammed's life , sayings, actions. you will never say: "he wanted power".Mek-Izzle wrote:
For me, it's almost as if he simply wanted power over the world. And used or created Islam as a means to help his own cause.
I'm from Saudi Arabia,, yes this is maybe a reason but it doesn't give a proof if Islam is the right way or not.Mek-Izzle wrote:
Where are you from? Not trying to be rude, but there's a high chance you're a muslim because your ancestors were forced to convert. You know, the whole dhimmi/jizya thing.
There are some people who use a religion to garner power,that's right,, but also there is a God and there is a true religion.Mek-Izzle wrote:
I think religion is a very evil thing, only created by people because it's an easy way to garner power.
Last edited by Sonata (2008-02-05 07:31:18)
link?Sonata wrote:
Islam is proved to be right
GunSlinger I don't have a link now, It isn't easy because I'm not English,, but you can do a research with a free unleashed mind.GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
link?Sonata wrote:
Islam is proved to be right
Last edited by Sonata (2008-02-05 07:37:17)
There is no GodSonata wrote:
Islam is proved to be right,, it wasn't created by a man,, it just came from God.
sorry. Im not into the supernatural. Do you know any secular muslims?Sonata wrote:
GunSlinger I don't have a link now,, but you can do a research with a free unleashed mind.GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
link?Sonata wrote:
Islam is proved to be right
GunSlinger OIF II , there is nothing called "secular muslims"
It depends on what do you mean by "secular muslims"
we should fix these language problems first
It depends on what do you mean by "secular muslims"
we should fix these language problems first
Yes there is. Ive met hundreds. I also know why Shiites only pray 3 times a day instead of 5. You dont give me an answer except that they are heretics. Kinda throws your credibility about being a level headed muslim away.Sonata wrote:
GunSlinger OIF II , there is nothing called "secular muslims"
It depends on what do you mean by "secular muslims"
we should fix these language problems first
I gave you the right answer ,, those are not Muslims. what's wrong ?GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
Yes there is. Ive met hundreds. I also know why Shiites only pray 3 times a day instead of 5. You dont give me an answer except that they are heretics. Kinda throws your credibility about being a level headed muslim away.Sonata wrote:
GunSlinger OIF II , there is nothing called "secular muslims"
It depends on what do you mean by "secular muslims"
we should fix these language problems first
Im sure a shiite would beg to differ. Where are you from, if you dont mind me asking?Sonata wrote:
I gave you the right answer ,, those are not Muslims. what's wrong ?GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
Yes there is. Ive met hundreds. I also know why Shiites only pray 3 times a day instead of 5. You dont give me an answer except that they are heretics. Kinda throws your credibility about being a level headed muslim away.Sonata wrote:
GunSlinger OIF II , there is nothing called "secular muslims"
It depends on what do you mean by "secular muslims"
we should fix these language problems first
Last edited by GunSlinger OIF II (2008-02-05 07:52:48)
That's actually ethnic, the religion part is just a badge the two protagonists wear.FEOS wrote:
Yeah...kind of like Catholics and Protestants in N. Ireland.HurricaИe wrote:
Why do they have such serious hatred between each other anyways? They worship the same god and read the same scripture, don't they?GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
I see a serious hate between sunni and shia.
Sonata, you disgust me. Don't you think that the ancient Egyptians "knew" their religion was the right one? Don't you think the Christians "know" that their religion is the right one? How can you say that your religion, which is actually pretty new compared to the other ones, is the right one? The horrible book you call the Quran is the only "proof" you have. Why would God wait so many years to give us the true message?
What good has Islam ever done? It's caused nothing but pain and suffering. Just look at the muslim countries. Just look at your own country. Article
I don't know about you, but I don't want to live in a world where raped women are stoned for being "unfaithful" or shoplifters get their hands cut off. I don't want to live in a world where only Muslims are considered humans either. Video
But hey, if you like it then I'm not gonna stop you, even if I don't think you deserve the air you breath. When you come to our civilized countries and demand respect for your pathetic beliefs and expect us to give you special rights, or apologize because someone drew a picture of your "prophet" I get kinda pissed though. You deserve some respect for staying in Saudi Arabia, just don't move, please. I'll never respect Islam and I'll never respect your prophet, I piss on your Quran. It's not about fear, it's not about a lack of knowledge. It's about common sense, and reality, stuff you Muslims don't know anything about.
What good has Islam ever done? It's caused nothing but pain and suffering. Just look at the muslim countries. Just look at your own country. Article
I don't know about you, but I don't want to live in a world where raped women are stoned for being "unfaithful" or shoplifters get their hands cut off. I don't want to live in a world where only Muslims are considered humans either. Video
But hey, if you like it then I'm not gonna stop you, even if I don't think you deserve the air you breath. When you come to our civilized countries and demand respect for your pathetic beliefs and expect us to give you special rights, or apologize because someone drew a picture of your "prophet" I get kinda pissed though. You deserve some respect for staying in Saudi Arabia, just don't move, please. I'll never respect Islam and I'll never respect your prophet, I piss on your Quran. It's not about fear, it's not about a lack of knowledge. It's about common sense, and reality, stuff you Muslims don't know anything about.
Last edited by Nomiss (2008-02-05 07:58:37)
difference between sunni and shia. Shiites believe in the 12th imam waiting to return. Sunnis believe muhummad chose some other dude to carry on and there is no 12th imam.
You're just as bad as the type of people you're describing. Here's a newsflash for you: all religion is bullshit irrespective of 'how old they are'. There ye go.Nomiss wrote:
Sonata, you disgust me. Don't you think that the ancient Egyptians "knew" their religion was the right one? Don't you think the Christians "know" that their religion is the right one? How can you say that your religion, which is actually pretty new compared to the other ones, is the right one? The horrible book you call the Quran is the only "proof" you have. Why would God wait so many years to give us the true message?
What good has Islam ever done? It's caused nothing but pain and suffering. Just look at the muslim countries. Just look at your own country. Article
I don't know about you, but I don't want to live in a world where raped women are stoned for being "unfaithful" or shoplifters get their hands cut off. I don't want to live in a world where only Muslims are considered humans either. Video
But hey, if you like it then I'm not gonna stop you, even if I don't think you deserve the air you breath. When you come to our civilized countries and demand respect for your pathetic beliefs and expect us to give you special rights, or apologize because someone drew a picture of your "prophet" I get kinda pissed though. You deserve some respect for staying in Saudi Arabia, just don't move, please. I'll never respect Islam and I'll never respect your prophet, I piss on your Quran. It's not about fear, it's not about a lack of knowledge. It's about common sense, and reality, stuff you Muslims don't know anything about.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-02-05 08:00:00)
I'm against all religions, but we were talking about Islam now, weren't we?CameronPoe wrote:
You're just as bad as the type of people you're describing. Here's a newsflash for you: all religion is bullshit irrespective of 'how old they are'. There ye go.
you also disgust me very much,, you are hurting my mind.Nomiss wrote:
Sonata, you disgust me. Don't you think that the ancient Egyptians "knew" their religion was the right one? Don't you think the Christians "know" that their religion is the right one? How can you say that your religion, which is actually pretty new compared to the other ones, is the right one? The horrible book you call the Quran is the only "proof" you have. Why would God wait so many years to give us the true message?
What good has Islam ever done? It's caused nothing but pain and suffering. Just look at the muslim countries. Just look at your own country. Article
I don't know about you, but I don't want to live in a world where raped women are stoned for being "unfaithful" or shoplifters get their hands cut off. I don't want to live in a world where only Muslims are considered humans either. Video
But hey, if you like it then I'm not gonna stop you, even if I don't think you deserve the air you breath. When you come to our civilized countries and demand respect for your pathetic beliefs and expect us to give you special rights, or apologize because someone drew a picture of your "prophet" I get kinda pissed though. You deserve some respect for staying in Saudi Arabia, just don't move, please. I'll never respect Islam and I'll never respect your prophet, I piss on your Quran. It's not about fear, it's not about a lack of knowledge. It's about common sense, and reality, stuff you Muslims don't know anything about.
Ignorance is very ugly.
Not a big fan of 'live and let live'? What the fuck did Sonata ever do to you, eh? Everybody is entitled to hold their own opinions and viewpoints as long as they don't hurt anyone else in so doing.Nomiss wrote:
I'm against all religions, but we were talking about Islam now, weren't we?CameronPoe wrote:
You're just as bad as the type of people you're describing. Here's a newsflash for you: all religion is bullshit irrespective of 'how old they are'. There ye go.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-02-05 08:05:13)