BF2S Forums Pack your books...and your heat

http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?id=94077


ted nugent covered it pretty well i think.

Poseidon wrote:

Not a good idea. Even someone in the most normal state of mind can get into the heat of an argument and lose his cool.

However, as long as the requirements stay as they are, I don't really mind.

People in FL said the same thing when they passed their CCW provisions in the early 90's.

You know how many of FL's CCW holders have engaged in illegal action since the inception of the law?  0.02%

The U of U did this because they are a state university, and the local state legislature holds the purse strings.  They were basically bullied into accepting the provision.  However, BYU (Brigham Young University) being a private school, and alma mater to a great many of them, is not required to meet these same criteria.  These fruitcakes even wanted it to be legal to take guns into court houses, and this legislative round they are trying to implement a state law that says that private business owners cannot prevent gun owners from bringing guns onto business property.  It doesn't mean owners can bring their guns in the building, but would force them to allow employees to have guns in their cars in the business parking lot.

And to top that off, they want to make a state law that won't allow the Salt Lake City mayor to implement a domestic registry program.  If you aren't familiar with this concept, it basically allows any business or employer within Salt Lake City (proper) to offer things like medical insurance, if their plan offers such coverage, to domestic partners, dependent family members, etc.  This is not mandate, the registry simply makes it possible to register to qualify for such coverage if offered as part of their insurance plan.  Certain members of the legislature, and moral crusading Eagles Forum, want to kill it because there might be a small percentage of those covered but such a plan, that are same sex couples.  The state attorney has already said the way the registry is designed does not run afoul of Utah's constitutional marriage amendment, which basically says that gay marriage is not recognized, but in their homophobic hysteria are willing to cut off this availability from the majority of those who are hetero couples or those caring for family members, rather than have a minute number of gay people have anything that they feel should only be allowed to married couples.

So here is our conservative Republican legislature that wants the federal government off the back of states, now forcing their own agenda on cities over the wishes of the constituents, the mayor, and city councils that overwhelmingly approved said measures.

Stingray24 wrote:

I wouldn't be afraid of a permit holder having his/her weapon in a courthouse, my business, or their car.  And same sex marriage has what to do with the current subject?

Lol forget guns...just punching a guy wrong can kill him, or he could fall and break something...

Anyone can get guns, and If they can't, they can just get a knife, and so on and so on....

Stricter gun laws, anyone???

Stingray24 wrote:

I wouldn't be afraid of a permit holder having his/her weapon in a courthouse, my business, or their car.  And same sex marriage has what to do with the current subject?

It was just more to help those that don't live in Utah understand the utter and complete hypocrisy of the people making laws around here.

I'm one of those people that want it both ways.

I agreed that there needs to be at least an elemental form of gun control. If there were no regulations on who could and couldn't own a gun, every Crazy Uncle Tom would have a gun and our backyards would turn into a scene from Saving Private Ryan. Background checks, registration, and a few days of waiting is a little thing to ask as opposed to asking for, say, a nice pack of gauze for that bullet wound. If you can't handle those few restrictions, then maybe this club isn't for you.

However, I also see the futility of trying to restrict where guns go. Sure, a gun free campus sounds great, but wheres the practicality? A person can fit 2 pistols in a waist band and no one would know. Sure, its illegal, but only if he gets caught. No one knew the recent shooters were packing until they started shooting. Which shows that the only way to know if someone is carrying a weapon is after they've started shooting. Fat lot of good that piece of info does you.

And a little side note. If the laws were rescinded and people could carry guns, that doesn't mean they all will carry a gun. Chances are the majority of people wouldn't care in the slightest and little would change. And the people who would carry would know what to do with them, as in knowing not to go on a murderous rampage. No one is gonna start carrying their 12-gauge shotgun to math class, don't worry.

I think tasers are better for this sort of thing, but I'm still willing to support this move given today's current dangers.

Utah is actually progressive about something...  wow....

Anyone who goes to a college with a high risk of getting shot is also a fool.

I know what you're saying, but you don't want everyone firing wildly when a gunfight breaks out.  It's not as easy to identify who the gunman is when everyone has a gun drawn.

Poseidon wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Poseidon wrote:

Not a good idea. Even someone in the most normal state of mind can get into the heat of an argument and lose his cool.

What, now I can't get in an argument without shooting someone? Flawed logic.

I'm sorry, did I say that? No, I didn't. Are you really saying people don't kill other people in the heat of the moment? If so, I'd come out of that cave you've been living in. It happens ALL the time. Person A is arguing with Person B, Person A pisses Person B off to his breaking point, Person B grabs a nearby knife and stabs Person A.

gg.

But Texas has had CCW for a while now and the incidence of violent crime person on person didn't increase.

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Concealed … 0144563309

"Similarly, Glen White, the president of the Dallas Police Association, said, "I lobbied against the law in 1993 and 1995 because I thought it would lead to wholesale armed conflict. That hasn't happened. All the horror stories I thought would come to pass didn't happen. No bogeyman. I think it's worked out well, and that says good things about the citizens who have permits. I'm a convert.""

chittydog wrote:

blisteringsilence wrote:

You know how many of FL's CCW holders have engaged in illegal action since the inception of the law?  0.02%

Anyone have the statistic on what percentage of all of Florida's residents have engaged in illegal action in that same time period?

Florida enacted their shall-issue CCW permit in 1987. Since then the state has issued 1,311,747 licenses. Of those, 3,418 were revoked for the accusation of a crime being committed whilst a license holder. Of those, 497 were reinstated after the holder had been cleared of the crime.

So, 2,921 permit holders had their permit revoked for committing a crime. This represents 0.0018% of license holders, OVER THE 20 YEAR PERIOD.

For the period of July 2006 to July 2007,

• There were approximatly 480,000 valid licenses.
• Of those, 368 were revoked.
• Giving you an offender rate of .00076%Keep in mind that a simple arrest for any felony, or misdemeanor domestic abuse, is enough to revoke a license. For the calendar year 2006
• There were approximatly 18,100,000 people living in Florida.
• Of those, there were 1,110,000 felony arrests. Mind you, this doesn't account for multiple arrests. So, we'll be generous and say that everyone arrested in FL was arrested twice.
• Giving you an offender rate of 0.03%

Last edited by blisteringsilence (2008-02-21 21:35:24)

Protecus wrote:

While it is a monumental no-no everywhere else in the United States, the University of Utah has decided to buck the trend...and allowed students to bring guns onto campus.

Naturally, there are provisions. The student must own the gun legally, be 21, have a state issued permit to have a concealed weapon, be mentally competent (little nebulous, but whatev), and have no criminal record what so ever.

Nick says his gun doesn't make him feel immune from attack. "But I feel that I will be able to protect myself, and I'm confident in my training and my ability,"...  "Last year, after Virginia Tech, I thought 'I'm not going to be a victim,' " Nick said.

Considering every other campus has a no gun policy and shootings still occur, should weapons be allowed on campus to supplement the over-stretched U-PD and, possibly, balance the fight if something were to happen?

Or is this just inviting more shootings?

NO!  This is the one of the most promising pieces of news I've read in a long time!  I carry my gun wherever I can.  I was always pissed off that I couldn't at school in a post Columbine era carry and I never carried there.  Yes, I know it's only one school know.  I believe that out in public you are allowed to defend yourself just the same as you are entitled to in your own home.  Yet why is it when you are on official state (public) land or on property/buildings utilized by the general public for the general public (you et the picture yet?) -you can't carry... It makes no sense except to the criminal that can now safely assume law abiding citizens won't bring deadly force to a certain public area.  Automatically the criminal possesses a tactical advantage on everyone in his target area.  You better believe that Fuck will afford every opportunity to exploit the defenselessness position of his/her intended victims.  It is well know that our outstanding law enforcement can't be everywhere at all time.  these sickos know they've got there 15 minutes of fame.  We've been witness to several copycat spree killings on a mass murder level at college campuses. "gun free" zone are fail.

It will be interesting to see how this turns out. Granted, it's highly unlikely there'd be a shooting at a school in Utah to begin with, we'll see how this gun policy turns out. Maybe some other schools could adapt it and try it out? I think we should all give it a chance, since right now without guns there are lots of shooting anyway.