Pages: 1 2

 

2008-03-03 07:16:24
Pug
UR father's brother's nephew's former roommate
+652|6969|Texas - Bigger than France
I know this is unbelievable, but it seems that Hillary and Obama have made another political promise.  They intent to make electricity free for everyone in the United States.  Socialized electricity.

Also, I saw that Hillary and Obama have decided to reduce the cost of gas to $zero per gallon.  Yes, free gas!

Now what would you do now that you have free gas?  What will you do differently now that you have free electricity?


Ok, not really happening...but seriously, what if?  Would your behavior change?  What would happen to all of the electric & oil companies?  Would the companies continue to try to be cutting edge or would they waste away on the government dime?

And lastly - apply the above to what's really happening - free healthcare.
2008-03-03 07:18:55
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|7071
I dont really spend a lot on utilities.   Gas is a bitch though.
2008-03-03 07:22:27
sNaKe_StInG
SexiestSnake
+4|6998|The Netherlands
=_='' i hate political promises... everyone knows what will happen, EXACTLY! nothing.

but you want to know what happens if. OK, everyone will use electricity and gas as the motherfuck...
then 5 years later we will be sitting in the dark without gas... am i close?
2008-03-03 07:24:38
Mekstizzle
WALKER
+3,611|7048|London, England
Well it's not really free, it just goes through tax. And as long as super corporations don't get tax breaks, it would be alright. Although I doubt America would ever accept that much socialism.

I don't even see why things like electricity needs to be private/for profit etc..

I actually wouldn't mind if utilities were "free" and not by companies who just want profit, it would probably be cheaper for everyone overall. And it's not like these companies even need profit except for greed, although I don't like how Gazprom, the Russian state-owned gas company has such a strong hold on things.

I'd be torn on the issue, but free petrol is stretching it too much.

Actually, I like the way it is now. Pay depending on how much you use it, that's how everything should be. Including healthcare (damn the NHS)
2008-03-03 07:25:00
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6558|North Tonawanda, NY

Pug wrote:

I know this is unbelievable, but it seems that Hillary and Obama have made another political promise.  They intent to make electricity free for everyone in the United States.  Socialized electricity.

Also, I saw that Hillary and Obama have decided to reduce the cost of gas to $zero per gallon.  Yes, free gas!

Now what would you do now that you have free gas?  What will you do differently now that you have free electricity?


Ok, not really happening...but seriously, what if?  Would your behavior change?  What would happen to all of the electric & oil companies?  Would the companies continue to try to be cutting edge or would they waste away on the government dime?

And lastly - apply the above to what's really happening - free healthcare.
Included in the cost of my rent is free heat and hot water. 

Does that mean I am incredibly inefficient because I pay the same amount no matter how much I use?  You bet your ass.  I am betting that a lot of people would become really wasteful and it would ultimately be a waste of resources.  People care more when they have to foot the bill directly.
2008-03-03 07:27:21
..teddy..jimmy
Member
+1,393|7077
Yeah-fucking-right.

I smell bullshit a mile away and this type smells like black man and old skanky women.
2008-03-03 08:08:01
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6983
It's obviously not that great an analogy because socialised healthcare seems to work relatively well over here in Europe. Sorry. Socialised healthcare is nothing like giving people infinte fuel and electricity because it runs into the same problems as would occur in the other situations: clogged demand and waiting lists, which prompt those with sufficient cash to go private....

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-03-03 08:09:15)

2008-03-03 08:14:35
Pug
UR father's brother's nephew's former roommate
+652|6969|Texas - Bigger than France

CameronPoe wrote:

It's obviously not that great an analogy because socialised healthcare seems to work relatively well over here in Europe. Sorry. Socialised healthcare is nothing like giving people infinte fuel and electricity because it runs into the same problems as would occur in the other situations: clogged demand and waiting lists, which prompt those with sufficient cash to go private....
Why not?

Everyone needs gas & electricity.  Everyone needs healthcare.
2008-03-03 09:28:23
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6983

Pug wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

It's obviously not that great an analogy because socialised healthcare seems to work relatively well over here in Europe. Sorry. Socialised healthcare is nothing like giving people infinte fuel and electricity because it runs into the same problems as would occur in the other situations: clogged demand and waiting lists, which prompt those with sufficient cash to go private....
Why not?

Everyone needs gas & electricity.  Everyone needs healthcare.
Because when one entitles everyone to something they have to get in line as it cannot be readily dished out instananeously. Demand outstrips supply. Not enough hospitals/doctors. When that happens black markets usually develop. Unless of course a legal alternative - private healthcare - is provided in tandem with public healthcare: a vastly superior instantaneous service for those who can afford not to slum it with the plebs.

You can't have a waiting list for something like electricity.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-03-03 09:31:12)

2008-03-03 09:55:33
PureFodder
Member
+225|6713
I can't see any obvious problem with socialising things like natural gas/electricity/water to the extent where the governent owned powerplants creates elctricity and the populace pay for it in the same way with private suppliers. That way I don't have to pay for advertising/profits/CEOs and you get more efficient centalied admin.

The difference between that and socialised healthcare is people don't often attempt to get extra unnecessary surgeries. 'I'm bored, let's go get a free biopsy'? In the US there's a serious amount of the populace that won't seek medical attention due to the costs associated with it. That's a serious prblem.
2008-03-03 09:56:27
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|7071
doesnt the gov't run the nation's electric grid?
2008-03-03 10:38:00
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6956|Global Command
The oil companies have proven themselves to be greedy immoral bastards, so why not let the greedy immoral bastards in washington have a go at it?

And, can somebody tell me why it is again that nuclear power plants are not being built but coal fired electricity plants exist in almost every state when air pollution has become the new holy Grail?
2008-03-03 10:44:47
Pug
UR father's brother's nephew's former roommate
+652|6969|Texas - Bigger than France

CameronPoe wrote:

Pug wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

It's obviously not that great an analogy because socialised healthcare seems to work relatively well over here in Europe. Sorry. Socialised healthcare is nothing like giving people infinte fuel and electricity because it runs into the same problems as would occur in the other situations: clogged demand and waiting lists, which prompt those with sufficient cash to go private....
Why not?

Everyone needs gas & electricity.  Everyone needs healthcare.
Because when one entitles everyone to something they have to get in line as it cannot be readily dished out instananeously. Demand outstrips supply. Not enough hospitals/doctors. When that happens black markets usually develop. Unless of course a legal alternative - private healthcare - is provided in tandem with public healthcare: a vastly superior instantaneous service for those who can afford not to slum it with the plebs.

You can't have a waiting list for something like electricity.
Well, I don't feel that waiting is enough to justify the differences.  The needs in either case exist.

I think national healthcare is great, but am worried about the quality.  I can tell you here in Texas, some doctors now won't see medicare patients because of the additional burdens the gov and the state have put on doctors with regards to reporting medicare related costs and income.

But isn't socialized healthcare in your country at a standard level and you can buy in to get other coverage?  Couldn't the same apply to energy consumption?
2008-03-03 11:02:16
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6558|North Tonawanda, NY

ATG wrote:

And, can somebody tell me why it is again that nuclear power plants are not being built but coal fired electricity plants exist in almost every state when air pollution has become the new holy Grail?
NIMBY

Not In My BackYard.


Personally, I wouldn't have any problem living near a nuclear power plant.  Then again, I understand how it works...
2008-03-03 11:11:52
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6983

Pug wrote:

Well, I don't feel that waiting is enough to justify the differences.  The needs in either case exist.

I think national healthcare is great, but am worried about the quality.  I can tell you here in Texas, some doctors now won't see medicare patients because of the additional burdens the gov and the state have put on doctors with regards to reporting medicare related costs and income.

But isn't socialized healthcare in your country at a standard level and you can buy in to get other coverage?  Couldn't the same apply to energy consumption?
Motorised transport and electricity are luxuries - the argument is that healthcare is not a luxury but a necessity in a compassionate society working together.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-03-03 11:15:07)

2008-03-03 11:21:46
Pug
UR father's brother's nephew's former roommate
+652|6969|Texas - Bigger than France
90% of Americans own a car
I wasn't able to google this but I would say we are well above 90% in terms of having electricity
84% of Americans have health care

It seems that in the US health care is more of a luxury than the other two.
2008-03-03 11:23:59
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6983

Pug wrote:

90% of Americans own a car
I wasn't able to google this but I would say we are well above 90% in terms of having electricity
84% of Americans have health care

It seems that in the US health care is more of a luxury than the other two.
You don't need gas or electricity to live. You do need medical services to do so. 100% of people should have ready access to healthcare. This is a Europe/US philosophical split I'm afraid to say.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-03-03 11:24:38)

2008-03-03 11:28:18
Pug
UR father's brother's nephew's former roommate
+652|6969|Texas - Bigger than France
sounds good.

ps. I saw the recent Clinton/Obama debate.  Hillary stated she's a better candidate because of all of her foreign affairs work.  She cited her role in Ireland's independence.  Is this true?

Any chance of a statue?
2008-03-03 11:29:26
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6983

Pug wrote:

sounds good.

ps. I saw the recent Clinton/Obama debate.  Hillary stated she's a better candidate because of all of her foreign affairs work.  She cited her role in Ireland's independence.  Is this true?

Any chance of a statue?
lol. I hope you misheard what she said, because if she said that then she has foreign affairs issues....

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-03-03 11:29:39)

2008-03-03 11:36:26
Pug
UR father's brother's nephew's former roommate
+652|6969|Texas - Bigger than France

CameronPoe wrote:

Pug wrote:

sounds good.

ps. I saw the recent Clinton/Obama debate.  Hillary stated she's a better candidate because of all of her foreign affairs work.  She cited her role in Ireland's independence.  Is this true?

Any chance of a statue?
lol. I hope you misheard what she said, because if she said that then she has foreign affairs issues....
yep.  she said she applied the political pressure in the right places so that independence could prevail.  politics...yay
2008-03-03 11:40:13
iNeedUrFace4Soup
fuck it
+348|6973
If I had free healthcare, I would break my arms every day. Just for fun.
https://i.imgur.com/jM2Yp.gif
2008-03-03 17:22:47
Harmor
Error_Name_Not_Found
+605|6976|San Diego, CA, USA
Anyone realize that all these 'corporate taxes' that these big-bad corporations pay just go to raise the cost of your iPod?  The costs get passed right to whatever we buy.

Not to change the subject, but that's also the reason why protectionism doesn't work.
2008-03-03 17:27:44
mtb0minime
minimember
+2,418|7082

I'd use all that free gas to blow shit up and cause mayhem! muahahaha
2008-03-03 18:56:30
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,072|7199|PNW

Technology like that shouldn't be socialized. What next? AMD and Intel?
2008-03-04 17:27:11
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6832|North Carolina

Pug wrote:

Ok, not really happening...but seriously, what if?  Would your behavior change?  What would happen to all of the electric & oil companies?  Would the companies continue to try to be cutting edge or would they waste away on the government dime?

And lastly - apply the above to what's really happening - free healthcare.
Ok, nevermind...  should've read the whole thing...  lol

Healthcare is different.  We've proven how badly corporations (mainly insurance companies) have run healthcare here.  It's time for a change.

As for electricity, we already have local governments that subsidize monopolies on electrical service.  We also subsidize oil exploration through tax breaks.

Last edited by Turquoise (2008-03-04 17:30:50)

 

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