Genetic Tests and Abortion

2008-03-17 10:06:58

#1

sergeriver: Cowboy from Hell; +1,928|7184|Argentina

There are some prenatal tests, like the Chorionic Villus sampling, which let you know if everything is ok with a baby.

Chorionic villus sampling (CVS) is a form of prenatal diagnosis to determine chromosomal or genetic disorders in the fetus. It entails getting a sample of the chorionic villus ( placental tissue) and testing it. The advantage of CVS is that it can be carried out 10-13 weeks after the last period, earlier than amniocentesis (which is carried out at 15-18 weeks).

In the case you and your wife/girlfriend were pregnant would you take this test?

2008-03-17 12:29:27

#2

FEOS: Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate; +1,182|6838|'Murka

Yes. Might come as a shock to those of you who have labeled me as a right-wing gun nut, but it's true. I would rather roll the bones with my eternal soul than put another child through what my son has been through.

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

2008-03-17 12:32:56

#3

Flaming_Maniac: prince of insufficient light; +2,490|7134|67.222.138.85

FEOS wrote:
Yes. Might come as a shock to those of you who have labeled me as a right-wing gun nut, but it's true. I would rather roll the bones with my eternal soul than put another child through what my son has been through.

If you don't mind me asking, what is wrong with your son?

2008-03-17 12:33:15

#4

chittydog: less busy; +586|7262|Kubra, Damn it!

FEOS wrote:
Yes. Might come as a shock to those of you who have labeled me as a right-wing gun nut, but it's true. I would rather roll the bones with my eternal soul than put another child through what my son has been through.

Bravo. I have a lot of respect for someone who would sacrifice himself for his child.

2008-03-17 12:38:21

#5

..teddy..jimmy: Member; +1,393|7076

I think parents should definitely have the right to take these tests on the fetus for two reasons:

a.) Although arguably terminating human life this is ultimately better than letting a child live with some kind of genetic deformity which could make living purely miserable.
b.) This applies especially to younger parents and just how much they can handle a child with a genetic disease. I believe they have the right to take the test and eventually terminate the fetus' life if they are not prepared to put in the huge effort that is obviously required to care for such a child.

2008-03-17 13:41:40

#6

FEOS: Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate; +1,182|6838|'Murka

Flaming_Maniac wrote:
FEOS wrote:
Yes. Might come as a shock to those of you who have labeled me as a right-wing gun nut, but it's true. I would rather roll the bones with my eternal soul than put another child through what my son has been through.
If you don't mind me asking, what is wrong with your son?

An unbalanced translocation of the 7th and 18th chromosome. My wife and I have decided that since it can happen again, we will have CVS testing done for any pregnancy that reaches the requisite level. If the fetus has either combination of the unbalanced translocation, we have agreed to terminate.

And we were both vehemently anti-abortion prior to our son's birth. We still are, in most cases.

The upside is that my son has been with us for 6 1/2 years longer than we were told to expect, so every single day has been a blessing.

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

2008-03-17 14:07:02

#7

Stingray24: Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy; +1,060|6872|The Land of Scott Walker

No, I don't agree with it. Too many of the tests are inaccurate. I also don't like doctors like the one who keep pestering my wife and I about it.

2008-03-17 14:44:24

#8

Turquoise: O Canada; +1,596|6832|North Carolina

Less handicapped children = less burden on society

Genetic determinism ftw

2008-03-17 14:55:17

#9

sergeriver: Cowboy from Hell; +1,928|7184|Argentina

Stingray24 wrote:
No, I don't agree with it. Too many of the tests are inaccurate. I also don't like doctors like the one who keep pestering my wife and I about it.

The CVS is 99.9% accurate.

2008-03-17 15:07:40

#10

Stingray24: Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy; +1,060|6872|The Land of Scott Walker

Yay

2008-03-17 17:48:22

#11

KEN-JENNINGS: I am all that is MOD!; +2,991|7059|949

I agree with a legal right to choose whether or not the test is done. If you don't want it done, don't do it. If you do, fine. Either way it (your decision) personally impacts me very little, if at all.

I would never support legislation outlawing the ability to administer the test to future parents.

2008-03-18 00:05:50

#12

legionair: back to i-life; +336|7050|EU

..teddy..jimmy wrote:
I think parents should definitely have the right to take these tests on the fetus for two reasons:

a.) Although arguably terminating human life this is ultimately better than letting a child live with some kind of genetic deformity which could make living purely miserable.
b.) This applies especially to younger parents and just how much they can handle a child with a genetic disease. I believe they have the right to take the test and eventually terminate the fetus' life if they are not prepared to put in the huge effort that is obviously required to care for such a child.

couldnt say better

2008-03-18 00:15:08

#13

mtb0minime: minimember; +2,418|7081

Well, I voted "No I hope everything's ok", but I'm kind of in the middle when it comes to this. If people want to get prenatal tests that's totally fine with me. But personally I don't want to get one. I'll love and support the child no matter what, so I don't need the test. Plus I'd rather be surprised if it came up (whether that's a good thing or not).

Anyone seen Gattaca?

2008-03-18 02:53:00

#14

B.Schuss: I'm back, baby... ( sort of ); +664|7268|Cologne, Germany

yes. People are having children for selfish reasons anyway. You owe it to yourself and your child to at least take all necessary precaution.

2008-03-18 04:03:39

#15

sergeriver: Cowboy from Hell; +1,928|7184|Argentina

I'd like to add for those who are against these tests, that you can detect other things, not just trisomies. There are several problems that can be fixed before a kid is born. When my wife and I decided to have a kid, I told her I had only one condition, and it was taking this test. She got pregnant and at week 12 we took it. Fortunately everything went ok, but you never know.

Why would you reject science if it can help you?

2008-03-18 07:28:01

#16

FEOS: Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate; +1,182|6838|'Murka

Turquoise wrote:
Less handicapped children = less burden on society

Genetic determinism ftw

You know, generally I don't take issue with what you post. But this is one of the most horrific posts I've ever seen.

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

2008-03-18 07:31:38

#17

Stingray24: Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy; +1,060|6872|The Land of Scott Walker

Which is why I reject these tests because that is precisely the mindset behind them.

2008-03-18 07:33:47

#18

sergeriver: Cowboy from Hell; +1,928|7184|Argentina

Stingray24 wrote:
Which is why I reject these tests because that is precisely the mindset behind them.

What? Detecting problems that can, in some cases be solved?

2008-03-18 07:42:55

#19

Stingray24: Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy; +1,060|6872|The Land of Scott Walker

I have never had any physician during either of my wife's pregnancies suggest anything but abortion as the "solution" if the tests they were pushing showed an abnormality.

2008-03-18 07:52:04

#20

sergeriver: Cowboy from Hell; +1,928|7184|Argentina

Stingray24 wrote:
I have never had any physician during either of my wife's pregnancies suggest anything but abortion as the "solution" if the tests they were pushing showed an abnormality.

That's in the case of trisomies or other chromosomic abnormalities, but there are several ones that can be solved, like problems in the heart of the baby.

2008-03-18 08:04:33

#21

Stingray24: Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy; +1,060|6872|The Land of Scott Walker

Of course heart issues can be detected, but the tests you mentioned in the OP (CVS and amnio) are both related to chromosomal abnormalities. As I understand it from attending my wife's appointments while pregnant, the physician does these tests only if the parents would consider termination.

2008-03-18 08:24:06

#22

sergeriver: Cowboy from Hell; +1,928|7184|Argentina

Stingray24 wrote:
Of course heart issues can be detected, but the tests you mentioned in the OP (CVS and amnio) are both related to chromosomal abnormalities. As I understand it from attending my wife's appointments while pregnant, the physician does these tests only if the parents would consider termination.

When we took the CVS the physician never mentioned that, and we did it just because I wanted. Anyway, it's obvious that most people doing the CVS would make an abortion in case the test went wrong. The CVS basically shows chromosomic abnormalities, which can include heart problems. And when you take it, even when it's ok, they make a heart scan at week 25 I think to check that everything's ok.

2008-03-18 08:51:36

#23

FEOS: Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate; +1,182|6838|'Murka

While I agree with the use of the test in certain cases, I don't necessarily believe it's right in all cases.

When you have a family history that increases the risk of catastrophic birth defects, then it is understandable. When you know what the effects of the defect are.

In our case, we had decided that if the fetus had a known syndrome (ie, Down's, Noonan's, etc), then we wouldn't terminate. Additionally, if the fetus had either unbalanced translocation (as we knew the end result of the defect), we would. Not to decrease burden on society, but to prevent our child from struggling every single day of their life, living in pain and on the edge of death. No child should have to suffer through that.

Maybe that clarifies it a bit. Don't have time right now for an entire, lengthy explanation. But perhaps later today.

Edit: Karyotyping doesn't show heart defects. All it can do is show chromosomal abnormalities, some of which can be associated with heart problems. The test itself will not show a defect in a given organ or system (unless the CF gene is there).

Last edited by FEOS (2008-03-18 14:24:11)

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

Yes, I can make a decision if anything's wrong	83%	83% - 26
Yes, only to be sure everything's ok	6%	6% - 2
No, I don't support abortion	3%	3% - 1
No, I hope everything's ok	3%	3% - 1
Other	3%	3% - 1
Total: 31

BF2S Forums Genetic Tests and Abortion

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FEOS wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

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..teddy..jimmy wrote:

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