Personally, I have no problem with Israel's existence. The only thing that miffs me is that they continue to expand their borders by force. Isn't the land they were allocated at the end of WW2 enough?
Thanks guys!
Go...
Go...
it's not a rule, I'd say it's a lesson learned from the cold war. The more militarily equal two countries are, the more likely it will be that they treat each other respectfully, and as equals, and negotiate on the same level.M.O.A.B. wrote:
Since when was there a rule stating two countries need to be militarily equal?
If one country is significantly weaker militarily, it is more likely that the stronger country will try to superimnpose its will on the weaker country, bully it, and enforce its own interests unilaterally. This is bound to spark confrontation.
Which brings us back to Iran and the bomb, I guess.
By bottom line is, as long as the palestinians are not viewed as having the same right to the land, and don't have the strength to be heard, they will never be treated as equals by the Jews.
The palestinians don't have a real good lobby, they don't have the funds, and don't have the military strength to hold their own. Is it any wonder Israel doesn't listen to their demands ?
Palestinians are perceived as being weak, hence they are bullied.
antisemitism doesn't have to have anything to do with Israel. You can be neutral or even positive towards Jews and still disagree with Israel. Hell, loads of Jews don't like Israel.Kmarion wrote:
The antisemite will act as if it is normal for countries to fight and win wars only to give the land back. The rest of us know our history a little better than that.
If I say I disagree with the politics of Iran, that doesn't mean I hate Muslims and want to kill them all.
once upon a midnight dreary, while i pron surfed, weak and weary, over many a strange and spurious site of ' hot xxx galore'. While i clicked my fav'rite bookmark, suddenly there came a warning, and my heart was filled with mourning, mourning for my dear amour, " 'Tis not possible!", i muttered, " give me back my free hardcore!"..... quoth the server, 404.
Ummmm...I wouldn't say that. No one hates Israel because they are anti-Semites? I find that a little hard to believe.max wrote:
antisemitism doesn't have to have anything to do with Israel.Kmarion wrote:
The antisemite will act as if it is normal for countries to fight and win wars only to give the land back. The rest of us know our history a little better than that.
I recommend that from this point forward in the thread, we refer to the Palestinians as "the muslims" since so many seem to think it's proper to refer to the Israelis as "the jews".
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
aHHH, The "if you question Israeli your antisemitic" card. Only took 4 pages this time.Kmarion wrote:
The antisemitic will act as if it is normal for countries to fight and win wars only to give the land back. The rest of us know our history a little better than that.
You got your knickers in quite a twist when Saddam invaded Kuwait. He took that land using military force. By your rational he should have been allowed to keep it. Also GTFO out of Korea too then, it was taken by force. Your not getting over that one in a hurry. I suppose its different rules when its a buddy of the USA being messed with or doing the messing.
So I am wrong to ask that Ireland be united too then.
The blindly patriotic will act as if its normal after a country has rejected western values, influence and control to be subjected to invasion, interference, sanctions and a campaign of clandestine operations to reverse the will of the people. The rest of us know better than that.
it can, but it does not need to have anything to do with it. Just like I originally saidnukchebi0 wrote:
Ummmm...I wouldn't say that. No one hates Israel because they are anti-Semites? I find that a little hard to believe.max wrote:
antisemitism doesn't have to have anything to do with Israel.Kmarion wrote:
The antisemite will act as if it is normal for countries to fight and win wars only to give the land back. The rest of us know our history a little better than that.
Last edited by max (2008-05-14 02:11:56)
once upon a midnight dreary, while i pron surfed, weak and weary, over many a strange and spurious site of ' hot xxx galore'. While i clicked my fav'rite bookmark, suddenly there came a warning, and my heart was filled with mourning, mourning for my dear amour, " 'Tis not possible!", i muttered, " give me back my free hardcore!"..... quoth the server, 404.
They took a lot more than they were allocated in 1948, ousting 700,000 people in the process.Tetrino wrote:
Personally, I have no problem with Israel's existence. The only thing that miffs me is that they continue to expand their borders by force. Isn't the land they were allocated at the end of WW2 enough?
Only if he had defeated the attempt to remove him.JahManRed wrote:
You got your knickers in quite a twist when Saddam invaded Kuwait. He took that land using military force. By your rational he should have been allowed to keep it.
Or you could read the history of the Korean War.JahManRed wrote:
Also GTFO out of Korea too then, it was taken by force. Your not getting over that one in a hurry. I suppose its different rules when its a buddy of the USA being messed with or doing the messing.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
I was just about to say that, South Korea is still in the hands of the SK and reinforced by the US.FEOS wrote:
Only if he had defeated the attempt to remove him.JahManRed wrote:
You got your knickers in quite a twist when Saddam invaded Kuwait. He took that land using military force. By your rational he should have been allowed to keep it.Or you could read the history of the Korean War.JahManRed wrote:
Also GTFO out of Korea too then, it was taken by force. Your not getting over that one in a hurry. I suppose its different rules when its a buddy of the USA being messed with or doing the messing.
So the USA and USSR used Korea to fight one of their many proxy wars. Does that make it right?M.O.A.B wrote:
I was just about to say that, South Korea is still in the hands of the SK and reinforced by the US.FEOS wrote:
Only if he had defeated the attempt to remove him.JahManRed wrote:
You got your knickers in quite a twist when Saddam invaded Kuwait. He took that land using military force. By your rational he should have been allowed to keep it.Or you could read the history of the Korean War.JahManRed wrote:
Also GTFO out of Korea too then, it was taken by force. Your not getting over that one in a hurry. I suppose its different rules when its a buddy of the USA being messed with or doing the messing.
The parallel is enforced by the US. That's my point. Korea was a military take over. Yet the USA felt the need to intervene in that conflict, yet supported the creation of the Israeli state, a state which was born from conflict. It comes down to protecting US interests. If anyone thinks its some form of righteousness, then your deluded.
And how long can you continue to try and remove an invading force before you are interfering in a new province of that invading country? IS there a rule book?
My link is tedious yes, but I am making the point that invasion is only a bad thing when it hurts the USA's interests. The USA has a long history in removing governments, funding opposition parties, assassination and clandestine operations, all to ensure governments will do whats best for the USA not necessarily the people of said country.
It seams its OK to take a peoples land by war or by the back door. But bad if the people try and take it back............................
South Korea asked for US assistance, not too mention Commonwealth assistance and the UN. Korea was not a military takeover, the only ones trying that were the Soviet backed North trying to take control of the South.
I'd say South Korea has turned out pretty damn well despite the so-called interference and meddling the West has in it wouldn't you say?
I'd say South Korea has turned out pretty damn well despite the so-called interference and meddling the West has in it wouldn't you say?
I see what you mean, Jah, but that's what every nation does. Putting their interests and the interests of their citizens over everybody else's interests. It may sound harsh, but isn't that what governments are supposed to do ?
For example, wouldn't you expect the irish government to put the interests of irish citizens over those of anyone else ?
Sure, the implications are somewhat more serious when you're a superpower like the US, but the principle is followed by every nation on the planet, I'd say, at least to some extent
For example, wouldn't you expect the irish government to put the interests of irish citizens over those of anyone else ?
Sure, the implications are somewhat more serious when you're a superpower like the US, but the principle is followed by every nation on the planet, I'd say, at least to some extent
Goodwill? C'monTrollmeaT wrote:
The problem is that most of the palestinians didn't accept & integrate into israeli society after they offered in goodwill to take them all in. If they don't like the rule of israel then they should leave, peacefully. Oh but you say they have no where to go, I'm sorry but if I was in that situation as a palestinian I would find some way out or try & be a productive member of their society.
There is bad blood now on both sides, it is up to them now ,no one else, to reconcile & forgive each other for past crimes against each other.
Happy B-day israel , may the wisdom to solve this conflict shine upon your nation.
Try for a second to imagine that.
One day, the international community decide to create a muslim country in YOUR state.. Boats and planes start to arrive from all over the world carrying thousands of muslims, those muslims settle in your area, take your houses and land and kicked you out at gun point...
You are asked by the international community to go settle in a small strip of land or better to leave completely the state. You have no choice because those muslims receive a shtload of weapons and money from a foreign country who will do anything to have a muslim presence in the United States.
Would you leave your homes peacefully to let these god chosen muslim live their dream of a promised land in your sate or would you fight back?
I know i would pick up a gun and fight back. I would do anything possible to prevent the ones who stole my land to live peacefully.
And this has nothing to do with antisemitism.. israel could be a christian state or mormon state, if it was CREATED the same way, i would still oppose it.
Edit: typos
Last edited by AutralianChainsaw (2008-05-14 05:41:27)
Kinda like if you try to blame a terrorist for murder you get the islamaphobe card. Let me let you in on a little secret. Saddam lost a war following Kuwait and was forced to give up land. See how that works? I have been critical of Israel in this forum for a very long time. Your second paragraph is based on inaccurate presumptions about me. It is curios that "You got your knickers in quite a twist" over that statement though. Feeling a bit defensive are we? Maybe you should explore that.JahManRed wrote:
aHHH, The "if you question Israeli your antisemitic" card. Only took 4 pages this time.Kmarion wrote:
The antisemitic will act as if it is normal for countries to fight and win wars only to give the land back. The rest of us know our history a little better than that.
You got your knickers in quite a twist when Saddam invaded Kuwait. He took that land using military force. By your rational he should have been allowed to keep it. Also GTFO out of Korea too then, it was taken by force. Your not getting over that one in a hurry. I suppose its different rules when its a buddy of the USA being messed with or doing the messing.
So I am wrong to ask that Ireland be united too then.
The blindly patriotic will act as if its normal after a country has rejected western values, influence and control to be subjected to invasion, interference, sanctions and a campaign of clandestine operations to reverse the will of the people. The rest of us know better than that.
Again, how often is it that a country wins a war and gives up land? Don't start shit with a country that can kick the whole regions ass in less than a week. Capiche? It's not blind patriotism, it's common sense.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
With the US as ally it's easy to do. Leave 'em alone and the story will be different. Peace deal in a week. Capiche? It's not blind criticism, it's common sense.Kmarion wrote:
Don't start shit with a country that can kick the whole regions ass in less than a week. Capiche? It's not blind patriotism, it's common sense.
I've been saying cut the cord for a long time now. Especially when it comes to Israeli charity at the expense of American tax payers. A conservative understands how shitty that policy is. A Neo (new)- Conservative, not so much. You are criticizing someone who has agreed with you. You should really read up on classic conservatism. Maybe you will understand me more. Capiche?
Some of our (The US) founding fathers where liberal minded conservatives (Thomas Jefferson). Put that in your pipe and smoke it..lol
Some of our (The US) founding fathers where liberal minded conservatives (Thomas Jefferson). Put that in your pipe and smoke it..lol
Xbone Stormsurgezz
By criticism I meant Israel not you. Capiche?Kmarion wrote:
I've been saying cut the cord for a long time now. Especially when it comes to Israeli charity at the expense of American tax payers. A conservative understands how shitty that policy is. A Neo (new)- Conservative, not so much. You are criticizing someone who has agreed with you. You should really read up on classic conservatism. Maybe you will understand me more. Capiche?
Some of our (The US) founding fathers where liberal minded conservatives (Thomas Jefferson). Put that in your pipe and smoke it..lol
Why are we talking like the Sopranos?
I saddened to say that the Israeli government has made me hate Israel the most of all the countries in the world, The way the government can just abuse another nation and nothing can be done cause america is always on their side. That also makes me hate the american government and I hope one day Iran will nuke the shit out of Israel and see where it goes from there.
Seriously, I dont hate anything more than Israel.
Seriously, I dont hate anything more than Israel.
Israel doesnt give a fuck
you cant even imagine how right you are!God Save the Queen wrote:
Israel doesnt give a fuck
Par-tay
Israel is a jewish state, so its reasonable to refer to them as 'the jews'.I recommend that from this point forward in the thread, we refer to the Palestinians as "the muslims" since so many seem to think it's proper to refer to the Israelis as "the jews".
The Palestinians are multi-faith, so it wouldn't be reasonable to refer to them as 'the muslims'.
We can call the Americans 'the pricks' if you like.
If we are in the business of posting maps on here how about this.
I think we should have just 'moved on' and 'concentrated on making better lives for our children'
BTW It shows Palestine as 'Palestina'
Last edited by Dilbert_X (2008-05-15 06:30:40)
Fuck Israel
I dont get that map? what do the colors mean?Dilbert_X wrote:
Israel is a jewish state, so its reasonable to refer to them as 'the jews'.I recommend that from this point forward in the thread, we refer to the Palestinians as "the muslims" since so many seem to think it's proper to refer to the Israelis as "the jews".
The Palestinians are multi-faith, so it wouldn't be reasonable to refer to them as 'the muslims'.
We can call the Americans 'the pricks' if you like.
If we are in the business of posting maps on here how about this.
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj25 … _1941-.png
I think we should have just 'moved on' and 'concentrated on making better lives for our children'
BTW It shows Palestine as 'Palestina'
