Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7021|132 and Bush

https://i34.tinypic.com/erafrq.jpg
A snapshot showing the new, efficient oxygen
catalyst in action in Dan Nocera's laboratory at MIT.


http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 … 143345.htm
A research team at MIT claims they have discovered a process that will make solar power practical for mass production of energy, even when the sun doesn’t shine. Using photosynthesis as a guide, the team believes it has discovered the “nirvana” of exploiting the sun’s power to generate a reliable, stable, and safe source for electricity:

Until now, solar power has been a daytime-only energy source, because storing extra solar energy for later use is prohibitively expensive and grossly inefficient. With today’s announcement, MIT researchers have hit upon a simple, inexpensive, highly efficient process for storing solar energy.

    Requiring nothing but abundant, non-toxic natural materials, this discovery could unlock the most potent, carbon-free energy source of all: the sun. “This is the nirvana of what we’ve been talking about for years,” said MIT’s Daniel Nocera, the Henry Dreyfus Professor of Energy at MIT and senior author of a paper describing the work in the July 31 issue of Science. “Solar power has always been a limited, far-off solution. Now we can seriously think about solar power as unlimited and soon.”

    Inspired by the photosynthesis performed by plants, Nocera and Matthew Kanan, a postdoctoral fellow in Nocera’s lab, have developed an unprecedented process that will allow the sun’s energy to be used to split water into hydrogen and oxygen gases. Later, the oxygen and hydrogen may be recombined inside a fuel cell, creating carbon-free electricity to power your house or your electric car, day or night.
I’ve been through the cold-fusion roller coaster before, so color me skeptical at the moment. The study got published yesterday, and Nocera and Kanan will have to endure the scrutiny of their peers. However, if this works and is as cheap as people believe, it could revolutionize energy production, at least for certain applications.

Solar energy’s drawback has always been storage. Solar cells produce electricity with good efficiency when the sun shines, but at night or under overcast conditions, production becomes unreliable. The same is true for other environmental-based alternatives such as wind power, hydro, and other “boutique” offerings, as the article calls them. Fuel cells work well, but the big problem is in generating the hydrogen cheaply and efficiently. Current electrolyzers were either too expensive or used dangerous and damaging materials.

This solution combines the best of both worlds. When the sun shines, the photovoltaic energy can produce enough electricity to power a house or a car as well as photosynthesize the elements of a fuel cell. Instead of storing electrical energy in a battery, the fuel cell retains the elements needed to provide power when the solar panels or wind turbines drop production rates.

If this pans out, it could decentralize electrical production and allow each household to run independently from the grid, or even sell excess power back to the grid as some do now. Electric vehicles would become much more practical with fuel cells rather than massive batteries, and distribution of fuel-cell hydrogen would no longer be required. It could spell an end to most emissions problems and make the US completely independent of all foreign oil sources in a short period of time.

That is, of course, a mighty big if.  It could also be cold fusion.  We need to continue drilling oil in the near term to ensure energy security and protect our economy.  But it’s worth watching.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Roger Lesboules
Ah ben tabarnak!
+316|6998|Abitibi-Temiscamingue. Québec!
Havent read all of it but it sound pretty awesome.
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|7066
yeah I was gonna post this today didnt think people were gonna find it interesting but yeah nice concept
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7021|132 and Bush

blademaster wrote:

yeah I was gonna post this today didnt think people were gonna find it interesting but yeah nice concept
I should have added "die bush" for guaranteed search results.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|7187|UK
um arent they just using the electricity from solar panles for electrolosis. they must be doing something else though otherwise they wouldn't  be claiming its new
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|7095|Canberra, AUS

Vilham wrote:

um arent they just using the electricity from solar panles for electrolosis. they must be doing something else though otherwise they wouldn't  be claiming its new
I think what they are doing is using sunlight as electrolysis. Not using solar power in order to power traditional forms of electrolysis (which are horribly inefficient).

We shall see. Skepticism pays on things like this all too often. BTW: Anyone remember what happened to that 'solar paint' - that was supposed to be very cheap (albeit very inefficient)
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7021|132 and Bush

Every great advancement in human history has had it's skeptics.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Flaming_Maniac
prince of insufficient light
+2,490|7127|67.222.138.85


Sure do hope this pans out. It doesn't completely erase the need for a better battery solution, but it sure would help.

It also seems like even if you didn't have good sun for a couple days, rain, live near the poles, whatever, you could buy hydrogen and oxygen to make the "night" half of the system work at any time when needed.
xBlackPantherx
Grow up, or die
+142|6763|California
Well, considering you could use the excess energy to "refuel" fuel-cells for electric cars you could essentially cross many states without stopping for gas.
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|7187|UK

Flaming_Maniac wrote:



Sure do hope this pans out. It doesn't completely erase the need for a better battery solution, but it sure would help.

It also seems like even if you didn't have good sun for a couple days, rain, live near the poles, whatever, you could buy hydrogen and oxygen to make the "night" half of the system work at any time when needed.
u dont buy hydrogen and oxygen, you buy water.
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6950|Global Command
Encouraging news.
Flaming_Maniac
prince of insufficient light
+2,490|7127|67.222.138.85

Vilham wrote:

Flaming_Maniac wrote:



Sure do hope this pans out. It doesn't completely erase the need for a better battery solution, but it sure would help.

It also seems like even if you didn't have good sun for a couple days, rain, live near the poles, whatever, you could buy hydrogen and oxygen to make the "night" half of the system work at any time when needed.
u dont buy hydrogen and oxygen, you buy water.
It said during the day it goes through electrolysis, then at night it recombines hydrogen and oxygen.
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|7095|Canberra, AUS

Kmarion wrote:

Every great advancement in human history has had it's skeptics.
And so it should be.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7186|Cambridge (UK)

Kmarion wrote:

Solar energy’s drawback has always been storage. Solar cells produce electricity with good efficiency when the sun shines, but at night or under overcast conditions, production becomes unreliable.
Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
Doctor Strangelove
Real Battlefield Veterinarian.
+1,758|6889

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Solar energy’s drawback has always been storage. Solar cells produce electricity with good efficiency when the sun shines, but at night or under overcast conditions, production becomes unreliable.
Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
Yeah, the deserts in Africa and the Middle East could be put to good use. Also it would create jobs in those regions which is always a good thing.
Flaming_Maniac
prince of insufficient light
+2,490|7127|67.222.138.85

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Solar energy’s drawback has always been storage. Solar cells produce electricity with good efficiency when the sun shines, but at night or under overcast conditions, production becomes unreliable.
Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
What about cloudy areas? Areas near the poles?  How do you get power across oceans? etc. etc.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7021|132 and Bush

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Solar energy’s drawback has always been storage. Solar cells produce electricity with good efficiency when the sun shines, but at night or under overcast conditions, production becomes unreliable.
Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
This breakthrough (in theory) would eliminate a grid completely. Energy independence per household. If able to store the energy properly a home could easily be able to gather enough of its own sunlight despite fluctuating weather conditions. The article elaborated saying enough sunlight hits the earth in one hour to power all the worlds energy needs for a year.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
13rin
Member
+977|6900
MIT is pretty badass.  I hope it pans out.  I'd love getting off the city grid.  Power Bill for a 1200 sqft home?  $450.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7186|Cambridge (UK)

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Solar energy’s drawback has always been storage. Solar cells produce electricity with good efficiency when the sun shines, but at night or under overcast conditions, production becomes unreliable.
Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
What about cloudy areas? Areas near the poles?  How do you get power across oceans? etc. etc.
1. Nowhere on the planet is cloudy all the time, and even if it was, it too would be connected to the global grid - same with places near the poles would also be connected to the global grid - that's what global means.

2. How do you get data across the oceans? In little digital boats? No, by cables, that run across the ocean-floor. Not that many would be needed - most of the inhabited land masses are either all connected, or very close together.
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7186|Cambridge (UK)

Kmarion wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Solar energy’s drawback has always been storage. Solar cells produce electricity with good efficiency when the sun shines, but at night or under overcast conditions, production becomes unreliable.
Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
This breakthrough (in theory) would eliminate a grid completely. Energy independence per household. If able to store the energy properly a home could easily be able to gather enough of its own sunlight despite fluctuating weather conditions. The article elaborated saying enough sunlight hits the earth in one hour to power all the worlds energy needs for a year.
The point of having a grid is that there are some inhabited places that don't get any sun at all (or very very little) for half the year - a global grid evens things out.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7021|132 and Bush

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
This breakthrough (in theory) would eliminate a grid completely. Energy independence per household. If able to store the energy properly a home could easily be able to gather enough of its own sunlight despite fluctuating weather conditions. The article elaborated saying enough sunlight hits the earth in one hour to power all the worlds energy needs for a year.
The point of having a grid is that there are some inhabited places that don't get any sun at all (or very very little) for half the year - a global grid evens things out.
A grid won't ever totally be eliminated. But this new tech would be able to get power even in areas that get very little direct sunlight. Remember this theory was spawned by the idea of photosynthesis. It would even be able to draw power from areas that are even predominantly overcast. There is plant life everywhere.. same theory. 

Read the article. Your debating with the existing technology.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7186|Cambridge (UK)

Kmarion wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


This breakthrough (in theory) would eliminate a grid completely. Energy independence per household. If able to store the energy properly a home could easily be able to gather enough of its own sunlight despite fluctuating weather conditions. The article elaborated saying enough sunlight hits the earth in one hour to power all the worlds energy needs for a year.
The point of having a grid is that there are some inhabited places that don't get any sun at all (or very very little) for half the year - a global grid evens things out.
A grid won't ever totally be eliminated. But this new tech would be able to get power even in areas that get very little direct sunlight. Remember this theory was spawned by the idea of photosynthesis. It would even be able to draw power from areas that are even predominantly overcast. There is plant life everywhere.. same theory. 

Read the article. Your debating with the existing technology.
Yeah, I understand the theory. It's just much more efficient, imo, to have one generator in one place (or a small number of generators in a few places) and then distribute the power equally, than it is to have billions of individual generators.
Flaming_Maniac
prince of insufficient light
+2,490|7127|67.222.138.85

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:


Which is why we need to forget the whole idea of separate countries, each with their own individual power-grids, and go global - the sun is always shining somewhere - place solar panels around the equator, connect every country up to one global power-grid - problem solved.
What about cloudy areas? Areas near the poles?  How do you get power across oceans? etc. etc.
1. Nowhere on the planet is cloudy all the time, and even if it was, it too would be connected to the global grid - same with places near the poles would also be connected to the global grid - that's what global means.

2. How do you get data across the oceans? In little digital boats? No, by cables, that run across the ocean-floor. Not that many would be needed - most of the inhabited land masses are either all connected, or very close together.
1. Seattle?

2. High voltage power lines are a bigger deal than internet cables. Especially the global security risk they present.
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|7095|Canberra, AUS
One of the reasons solar is so attractive is that it reduces - or even elimates - the need for massive electricity grids.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7186|Cambridge (UK)

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Flaming_Maniac wrote:


What about cloudy areas? Areas near the poles?  How do you get power across oceans? etc. etc.
1. Nowhere on the planet is cloudy all the time, and even if it was, it too would be connected to the global grid - same with places near the poles would also be connected to the global grid - that's what global means.

2. How do you get data across the oceans? In little digital boats? No, by cables, that run across the ocean-floor. Not that many would be needed - most of the inhabited land masses are either all connected, or very close together.
1. Seattle?

2. High voltage power lines are a bigger deal than internet cables. Especially the global security risk they present.
What global security risk, when you've got a global energy grid?

spark wrote:

One of the reasons solar is so attractive is that it reduces - or even eliminates - the need for massive electricity grids.
You've still got to get the electricity to where it's needed when it's needed.

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