Last edited by DBBrinson1 (2008-08-01 11:34:13)
ToucheSEREMAKER wrote:
and thats why congress has lower approve ratings then Pres Bush
Fixed.DBBrinson1 wrote:
Touche doucheSEREMAKER wrote:
and thats why congress= has lower approve ratings then Pres Bush
Why not? If the market was flooded with oil (literally) the price would fall (atleast, it should). Stagering the supply inflates the price (and speculation). It also isnt simply a case of saying, ok lads now that one is dry, go open one here. Even after the red tape has been worked out, building the rigs and getting infastructure in (as in transport etc) isnt an over night job.Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:
Why should we open the drilling when oil companies haven't even explored or exploited the leases they already had before the bans went into place?
Because todays gas prices are determined by what will happen in the future. There is no shortage of oil now. The surge in gas prices was driven by the oil leases getting grabbed up. It makes no sense to drill for oil in a market that has plenty of supply. The recent possibility of opening up more leases drove down prices immediately. Ultimately it is just biding time. We need a combination of approaches to make the transition to renewable energy.Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:
Why should we open the drilling when oil companies haven't even explored or exploited the leases they already had before the bans went into place?
Once they have thoroughly explored what they already have access to, and find there is no oil, or the oil isn't accessible given current technology, then we'll talk about opening more offshore drilling.
Basically, eat your vegetables, or no dessert.
Why should we regulate the free market?Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:
Why should we open the drilling when oil companies haven't even explored or exploited the leases they already had before the bans went into place?
Once they have thoroughly explored what they already have access to, and find there is no oil, or the oil isn't accessible given current technology, then we'll talk about opening more offshore drilling.
Basically, eat your vegetables, or no dessert.
The reality of it is the speculators. Did anyone notice that when President Bush gave his speech pushing to open up offshore drilling, that the price of oil dropped $9 by the end of his speech. Nothing was approved, not a drop of oil hit the market. But the speculators began to sell off. The huge increase in the price of oil is due to the specualtors betting that the price will keep going up.Kmarion wrote:
Because todays gas prices are determined by what will happen in the future. There is no shortage of oil now. The surge in gas prices was driven by the oil leases getting grabbed up. It makes no sense to drill for oil in a market that has plenty of supply. The recent possibility of opening up more leases drove down prices immediately. Ultimately it is just biding time. We need a combination of approaches to make the transition to renewable energy.Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:
Why should we open the drilling when oil companies haven't even explored or exploited the leases they already had before the bans went into place?
Once they have thoroughly explored what they already have access to, and find there is no oil, or the oil isn't accessible given current technology, then we'll talk about opening more offshore drilling.
Basically, eat your vegetables, or no dessert.
and with his ratings thats almost impossibleSEREMAKER wrote:
and thats why congress has lower approve ratings then Pres Bush
The longer version of what I wrote. I'm just getting tired of repeating the same explanation .imortal wrote:
The reality of it is the speculators. Did anyone notice that when President Bush gave his speech pushing to open up offshore drilling, that the price of oil dropped $9 by the end of his speech. Nothing was approved, not a drop of oil hit the market. But the speculators began to sell off. The huge increase in the price of oil is due to the specualtors betting that the price will keep going up.Kmarion wrote:
Because todays gas prices are determined by what will happen in the future. There is no shortage of oil now. The surge in gas prices was driven by the oil leases getting grabbed up. It makes no sense to drill for oil in a market that has plenty of supply. The recent possibility of opening up more leases drove down prices immediately. Ultimately it is just biding time. We need a combination of approaches to make the transition to renewable energy.Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:
Why should we open the drilling when oil companies haven't even explored or exploited the leases they already had before the bans went into place?
Once they have thoroughly explored what they already have access to, and find there is no oil, or the oil isn't accessible given current technology, then we'll talk about opening more offshore drilling.
Basically, eat your vegetables, or no dessert.
If offshore drilling started tomorrow, we would not see a new drop of gas from them for as long as two years. But the cost of gas would drop now, because of the effect that future oil would have on the oil speculation market. I am not saying it would go all the way back to $2.80 a gallon, but it would take a huge dip, and hopefully let market forces work on their own.
Also, so what if we have to wait 2 years? We are still going to need oil then, too. The demand for oil is only going up. If we wait until we absolutely have to have it, we will still have to wait for 2 years before we can get any relief. That is like owning a boat, but waiting until you are drowning before thinking about buying a life preserver.
Drilling isn't enough. You need to refine it and:imortal wrote:
The reality of it is the speculators. Did anyone notice that when President Bush gave his speech pushing to open up offshore drilling, that the price of oil dropped $9 by the end of his speech. Nothing was approved, not a drop of oil hit the market. But the speculators began to sell off. The huge increase in the price of oil is due to the specualtors betting that the price will keep going up.Kmarion wrote:
Because todays gas prices are determined by what will happen in the future. There is no shortage of oil now. The surge in gas prices was driven by the oil leases getting grabbed up. It makes no sense to drill for oil in a market that has plenty of supply. The recent possibility of opening up more leases drove down prices immediately. Ultimately it is just biding time. We need a combination of approaches to make the transition to renewable energy.Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:
Why should we open the drilling when oil companies haven't even explored or exploited the leases they already had before the bans went into place?
Once they have thoroughly explored what they already have access to, and find there is no oil, or the oil isn't accessible given current technology, then we'll talk about opening more offshore drilling.
Basically, eat your vegetables, or no dessert.
If offshore drilling started tomorrow, we would not see a new drop of gas from them for as long as two years. But the cost of gas would drop now, because of the effect that future oil would have on the oil speculation market. I am not saying it would go all the way back to $2.80 a gallon, but it would take a huge dip, and hopefully let market forces work on their own.
Also, so what if we have to wait 2 years? We are still going to need oil then, too. The demand for oil is only going up. If we wait until we absolutely have to have it, we will still have to wait for 2 years before we can get any relief. That is like owning a boat, but waiting until you are drowning before thinking about buying a life preserver.
We need to replace the foreign oil with domestic oil. We should have our own refineries working for us. Our demand is steady, nothing like China's. We have plenty of time to adjust if we concentrate on providing for ourselves (energy independence). .. assuming we continue the work towards getting off of fossil fuels at the same time.Spark wrote:
Drilling isn't enough. You need to refine it and:imortal wrote:
The reality of it is the speculators. Did anyone notice that when President Bush gave his speech pushing to open up offshore drilling, that the price of oil dropped $9 by the end of his speech. Nothing was approved, not a drop of oil hit the market. But the speculators began to sell off. The huge increase in the price of oil is due to the specualtors betting that the price will keep going up.Kmarion wrote:
Because todays gas prices are determined by what will happen in the future. There is no shortage of oil now. The surge in gas prices was driven by the oil leases getting grabbed up. It makes no sense to drill for oil in a market that has plenty of supply. The recent possibility of opening up more leases drove down prices immediately. Ultimately it is just biding time. We need a combination of approaches to make the transition to renewable energy.
If offshore drilling started tomorrow, we would not see a new drop of gas from them for as long as two years. But the cost of gas would drop now, because of the effect that future oil would have on the oil speculation market. I am not saying it would go all the way back to $2.80 a gallon, but it would take a huge dip, and hopefully let market forces work on their own.
Also, so what if we have to wait 2 years? We are still going to need oil then, too. The demand for oil is only going up. If we wait until we absolutely have to have it, we will still have to wait for 2 years before we can get any relief. That is like owning a boat, but waiting until you are drowning before thinking about buying a life preserver.
A. We don't have sufficient refining capacity as it is
B. Building new refineries takes a long time.
Last edited by Turquoise (2008-08-02 15:09:07)
There already sitting there off the coasts.Turquoise wrote:
It's not just the Democrats and environmentalists who are blocking offshore drilling. This is also coming from the tourism industries that would be affected (or at least believe they would be) and the local residents that are concerned.
Still, it's worth noting that oil companies currently have a ton of land leased out for drilling that they aren't using. While it's probably true that the majority of this land isn't worth drilling, there are large areas that haven't even been explored yet, but since leasing is so cheap, these companies still own the rights to drill there.
While I like your idea here, be prepared to be labeled as a liberal hippie. Al Gore and Ralph Nader have made similar suggestions about this sort of thing.Lotta_Drool wrote:
fuck oil, no more refineries or drilling. Pass legistlation today that no new vehicles under 5000lbs can be sold in amerca unless powered by something other than gasoline or diesel.
Ethanol, Natural Gas, Electric
who needs greater amounts of fucking oil production capacity when it needs to start its downward trend in use. Oh wait, I guess the oil companies do which is why people are debating stupid shit resigned to the fact that oil is the only solution just like the idiots in washingto want.
sheeple.
In some areas, yes. I believe it was Kmarion that pointed out the irony of how China is now starting to drill off Cuba's coast or something like that. It's only like 90 miles from Florida.SealXo wrote:
There already sitting there off the coasts.Turquoise wrote:
It's not just the Democrats and environmentalists who are blocking offshore drilling. This is also coming from the tourism industries that would be affected (or at least believe they would be) and the local residents that are concerned.
Still, it's worth noting that oil companies currently have a ton of land leased out for drilling that they aren't using. While it's probably true that the majority of this land isn't worth drilling, there are large areas that haven't even been explored yet, but since leasing is so cheap, these companies still own the rights to drill there.
Cafe standards have always been around the past 2 decades and Bush has raised them more than anyone. Anywho, this is not what I was talking about. I am talking about letting Gasoline and Diesel phase completely out of person transportation as vehicals get older because no new vehicle would be sold to run on the shit unless it was Bigger like SemiTrucks, Busses, Tractors...... not used in personal vehicles like cars, trucks, medium to small SUVs and Vans.Turquoise wrote:
While I like your idea here, be prepared to be labeled as a liberal hippie. Al Gore and Ralph Nader have made similar suggestions about this sort of thing.Lotta_Drool wrote:
fuck oil, no more refineries or drilling. Pass legistlation today that no new vehicles under 5000lbs can be sold in amerca unless powered by something other than gasoline or diesel.
Ethanol, Natural Gas, Electric
who needs greater amounts of fucking oil production capacity when it needs to start its downward trend in use. Oh wait, I guess the oil companies do which is why people are debating stupid shit resigned to the fact that oil is the only solution just like the idiots in washingto want.
sheeple.
I'm not sure if I'd support something like that, but... it is worth noting that Reagan started the stagnation of fuel standards in the auto industry. For a while, we had a staggered system of fuel standards that would raise the average mpg required for selling cars in the U.S. This stopped around 1985, I believe.
Now, people are suggesting that we should bring back this concept, mostly because it's still in effect in most prosperous countries (particularly in Western Europe). I support this idea, but there is a lot of lobbyist opposition to it coming from the auto industry.
Lotta_Drool wrote:
Cafe standards have always been around the past 2 decades and Bush has raised them more than anyone. Anywho, this is not what I was talking about. I am talking about letting Gasoline and Diesel phase completely out of person transportation as vehicals get older because no new vehicle would be sold to run on the shit unless it was Bigger like SemiTrucks, Busses, Tractors...... not used in personal vehicles like cars, trucks, medium to small SUVs and Vans.Turquoise wrote:
While I like your idea here, be prepared to be labeled as a liberal hippie. Al Gore and Ralph Nader have made similar suggestions about this sort of thing.Lotta_Drool wrote:
fuck oil, no more refineries or drilling. Pass legistlation today that no new vehicles under 5000lbs can be sold in amerca unless powered by something other than gasoline or diesel.
Ethanol, Natural Gas, Electric
who needs greater amounts of fucking oil production capacity when it needs to start its downward trend in use. Oh wait, I guess the oil companies do which is why people are debating stupid shit resigned to the fact that oil is the only solution just like the idiots in washingto want.
sheeple.
I'm not sure if I'd support something like that, but... it is worth noting that Reagan started the stagnation of fuel standards in the auto industry. For a while, we had a staggered system of fuel standards that would raise the average mpg required for selling cars in the U.S. This stopped around 1985, I believe.
Now, people are suggesting that we should bring back this concept, mostly because it's still in effect in most prosperous countries (particularly in Western Europe). I support this idea, but there is a lot of lobbyist opposition to it coming from the auto industry.
Last edited by Turquoise (2008-08-02 15:41:24)