wikipedia sucks and should not be used as a reference for shit without other sources as well. All Im reading is a state of martial law declared, de facto war. but not officially a war.Poseidon wrote:
http://www.radionetherlands.nl/news/int … clares-warGod Save the Queen wrote:
you know, georgia has yet to have declared war on russia as far as Im able to read.
I just looked up "Georgia Declares War" on Google and up it came...whether it's reliable I've got no idea.God Save the Queen wrote:
wikipedia sucks and should not be used as a reference for shit without other sources as well. All Im reading is a state of martial law declared, de facto war. but not officially a war.Poseidon wrote:
http://www.radionetherlands.nl/news/int … clares-warGod Save the Queen wrote:
you know, georgia has yet to have declared war on russia as far as Im able to read.
http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/lo … 40156.aspx
I guess that could be seen as declaring war as well.
declaring martial law is completely different from declaring war, the media seem to have missed that entirely.
see, thats what I read that lead me to post the fact that georgia didnt declare war.Poseidon wrote:
I just looked up "Georgia Declares War" on Google and up it came...whether it's reliable I've got no idea.God Save the Queen wrote:
wikipedia sucks and should not be used as a reference for shit without other sources as well. All Im reading is a state of martial law declared, de facto war. but not officially a war.Poseidon wrote:
http://www.radionetherlands.nl/news/international/5911562/Georgia-declares-war
http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/lo … 40156.aspx
I guess that could be seen as declaring war as well.
I think you are right on this one.Vilham wrote:
declaring martial law is completely different from declaring war, the media seem to have missed that entirely.
Last edited by God Save the Queen (2008-08-11 07:47:15)
The USSR made South Ossetia part of Georgia during the soviet period. As such Georgia fell into 'internationally recognised' possession of South Ossetia by a strange kind of default, despite the fact the region had its own autonomous government and its own language and ethnicity. South Ossetia attempted to become part of 'Mother Russia' in the early nineties with the issue never having been fully concluded. This is the latest episode in a conflict that has continued since the collapse of the USSR.jord wrote:
Russian has been handing passports out like they're going out of fashion to the S Ossetians. I've said it before and I'll say it again, if they really want to be part or Russia so badly they can go move there. It's not like there's not enough space...CameronPoe wrote:
More deep thought from usmarine, completely oblivious to the realities on the ground. Obviously not big on South Ossetian or Abkhazian rights, eh? Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Georgia roll the tanks in to regions of Georgia where they weren't welcome? Kind of like what Serbia did to Bosnia, Croatia, Slovenia, Kosovo and all of the other 'parts of Yugoslavia' that are now countries in their own right, some of which being down to western intervention??? Such rationalising is probably beyond usmarine...usmarine wrote:
wow, nice op...........lol.
anyway, you declare war on someone when they shoot down your shit in your own airspace and have troops inside your borders. I know, thats just the imagination of the west according to cam.
This does not mean that Russia are doing this out of the goodness of their hearts but they do coincidentally happen to be acting in the interests of South Ossetians, whom the Georgians want to rule over against their will.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-08-11 07:49:55)
russia is concluding itCameronPoe wrote:
South Ossetia attempted to become part of 'Mother Russia' in the early nineties with the issue never having been fully concluded.
So it would seem. And I have no doubt that they will 'conclude' it with Georgia losing both Abkhazia and South Ossetia. I am almost certain that Russia's interests are only in these two regions and their plans do not include the invasion and occupation of Georgia. If I am wrong then you can tell me 'I told you so' but personally I don't think they're interested in establishing control over a nation whose population are averse to their influence, or establishing control over the Baku-Batumi pipeline. They are just restoring a bit of post-Kosovo pride by telling the Georgian upstart 'who's boss' when it comes to South Ossetia and Abkhazia. I'm convinced Saakashvili launched the advance on South Ossetia on Day One of the Olympics on purpose - thinking Russia wouldn't respond.God Save the Queen wrote:
russia is concluding itCameronPoe wrote:
South Ossetia attempted to become part of 'Mother Russia' in the early nineties with the issue never having been fully concluded.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-08-11 08:01:39)
with the scale of russian military action, the planning wasnt drawn on a napkin in hurry to respond to georgian action against the south ossetians. This had obviously been in the works for a while by the russians.
Im reading that Russia is going to want peacekeepers on georgian territory.
Im reading that Russia is going to want peacekeepers on georgian territory.
People do that with the US every chance they get.CameronPoe wrote:
4. The western nedia has been virulently anti-Russia to a ridiculously unbalanced degree. They haven't fleshed out any of the core issues here and are simply using this war, rightly or wrongly, to demonise Russia.
Certain media outlets have been yes. There is a world of a difference between the Georgian conflict - which is more reminiscent of the Balkan problems of the 90s - and the wars of choice and other activities that the US have engaged in of late however.M.O.A.B wrote:
People do that with the US every chance they get.CameronPoe wrote:
4. The western nedia has been virulently anti-Russia to a ridiculously unbalanced degree. They haven't fleshed out any of the core issues here and are simply using this war, rightly or wrongly, to demonise Russia.
The whole thing has been escalating for years and particularly so in the last few months. This didn't happen overnight.God Save the Queen wrote:
with the scale of russian military action, the planning wasnt drawn on a napkin in hurry to respond to georgian action against the south ossetians. This had obviously been in the works for a while by the russians.
Im reading that Russia is going to want peacekeepers on georgian territory.
reading the pravda website is like going back in time.
http://english.pravda.ru/world/americas … _weapons-0God Save the Queen wrote:
reading the pravda website is like going back in time.
Gotta love state propaganda. lol
"Join Pravda.ru forum to experience freedom of speech"
I've already experienced it thanks.
I've already experienced it thanks.
wow. are those guys high on crack or something?CameronPoe wrote:
http://english.pravda.ru/world/americas … _weapons-0God Save the Queen wrote:
reading the pravda website is like going back in time.
Gotta love state propaganda. lol
regardless of the "who's right, who's wrong"-thing,
how stupid of georgia to send troops to (attack) south ossetia. i mean, they must have known that russia would react. 95(!) percent of the south ossetian inhabitants have russian citizenship
how stupid of georgia to send troops to (attack) south ossetia. i mean, they must have known that russia would react. 95(!) percent of the south ossetian inhabitants have russian citizenship
They have a go at the US government.M.O.A.B wrote:
People do that with the US every chance they get.CameronPoe wrote:
4. The western nedia has been virulently anti-Russia to a ridiculously unbalanced degree. They haven't fleshed out any of the core issues here and are simply using this war, rightly or wrongly, to demonise Russia.
Most people outside the US dont give a shit about the american people, it's Bush and his bum boys they ''demonise''.
Martyn
Breaking news on msnbc.com:
Georgia says key city of Gori taken by Russian forces
Ahahahaha, noobs.
Georgia says key city of Gori taken by Russian forces
Ahahahaha, noobs.
So I guess according to Cam and others here, once the hostilities are over, Russia should hand S. Ossetia and Abkhazia (and any other parts of Georgia they've occupied) back to Georgia. Can't keep land taken in war, now. That would be wrong.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2008 … rgia_N.htm
"The West has already sharply criticized Russia's military response to Georgia's attack on South Ossetia as disproportionate, and the world's seven largest economic powers urged Russia on Monday to accept an immediate cease-fire and agree to international mediation"
I don't get that quote, I find it funny really. So if a Country invaded us with knives we would have to fight back with knives? WTF?
"The West has already sharply criticized Russia's military response to Georgia's attack on South Ossetia as disproportionate, and the world's seven largest economic powers urged Russia on Monday to accept an immediate cease-fire and agree to international mediation"
I don't get that quote, I find it funny really. So if a Country invaded us with knives we would have to fight back with knives? WTF?
You never know. Russia don't want to be seen giving away a war like that, no-one does.dayarath wrote:
what-the-fuckCNN wrote:
"Swarms of Russian jets have launched new raids on Georgia as Moscow officials accuse its neighbor of violating a cease-fire around the breakaway province of South Ossetia, say reports."
wasn't it the Russians who refused a cease fire?
Did Georgia ever have control over these areas? Is it morally right for Georgia to have control over areas of land occupied by indigenous people who are ethnically distinct and who do not want to be part of a Georgian state? I disagree with Kosovan independence but the example has some parallels here: should the Kosovans have been forced unwillingly to accept Serbian rule?FEOS wrote:
So I guess according to Cam and others here, once the hostilities are over, Russia should hand S. Ossetia and Abkhazia (and any other parts of Georgia they've occupied) back to Georgia. Can't keep land taken in war, now. That would be wrong.
I guess it's more about bringing an army able to invade the whole country..SGT_Dicklewicz wrote:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2008-08-11-russia-georgia_N.htm
"The West has already sharply criticized Russia's military response to Georgia's attack on South Ossetia as disproportionate, and the world's seven largest economic powers urged Russia on Monday to accept an immediate cease-fire and agree to international mediation"
I don't get that quote, I find it funny really. So if a Country invaded us with knives we would have to fight back with knives? WTF?
Name three times someone has willingly accepted foreign rule, and it worked out.CameronPoe wrote:
Did Georgia ever have control over these areas? Is it morally right for Georgia to have control over areas of land occupied by indigenous people who are ethnically distinct and who do not want to be part of a Georgian state? I disagree with Kosovan independence but the example has some parallels here: should the Kosovans have been forced unwillingly to accept Serbian rule?FEOS wrote:
So I guess according to Cam and others here, once the hostilities are over, Russia should hand S. Ossetia and Abkhazia (and any other parts of Georgia they've occupied) back to Georgia. Can't keep land taken in war, now. That would be wrong.
you mean see the other thread where i owned you about sources, especially since you did not respond?AutralianChainsaw wrote:
And 75% of this forum fall for it.. see the other thread.CameronPoe wrote:
4. The western nedia has been virulently anti-Russia to a ridiculously unbalanced degree. They haven't fleshed out any of the core issues here and are simply using this war, rightly or wrongly, to demonise Russia.
Last edited by usmarine (2008-08-11 11:31:40)