BF2S Forums So who is being a racist and is this even a headline topic??

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Did I? Please show me where I said that.

Short memory lowing? Do you not remember discussing at length whether or not African Americans had to contend with racism in the working world of modern America as a result of the hangover from the days of segregation? You claimed that no such disadvantage exists and that everyone is in the same boat, hence one's own attitude and efforts in life are all that count when it comes to getting ahead in life. You said that African Americans can't use the apartheid era as an excuse as the problems and injustices of that era have no connection to modern American life.

But I'm sure you'll tapdance your way around that argument somehow and to be honest I don't think there's any point in us going over the same stalemate again.

Yeah I said that

I never said racism did not exist after 1865

So no my memory isn't short, you simply are not repeating your claim that I said racism stopped existing after 1865. So again I ask you t oplease show me where I said racism does not exist after 1865.

Last edited by Braddock (2008-08-11 12:34:51)

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Yeah I said that

I never said racism did not exist after 1865

So no my memory isn't short, you simply are not repeating your claim that I said racism stopped existing after 1865. So again I ask you t oplease show me where I said racism does not exist after 1865.

So you do admit that there are in fact racial obstacles in existence in contemporary America? And if we extrapolate this problem then it could be fair to say that one's own efforts might not always be the sole determining factor when it comes to success in the working world.

One thing at a time

FIRST, SHOW ME where I have made the claim that racism has not existed after 1865, or retract it 

I admit there ar eall kinds of obsticles that need over coming in by EVERY kind of young person in America, and NO, slavery is NOT one of them.

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Yeah, that is pretty much what I said, because modern black people were not slaves 180 years ago there fore have no complaint coming about being a fucking slave. isn't that a far cry from claiming that I said racism has not existed for 180 some years?

My argument had been that you can't expect the trenchant and deep rooted racism of previous generations to have no inherited effect on subsequent generations, at least not in such a short time frame as one or two generations. True they have no right to call themselves slaves or even 'victims' of slavery but they may in many cases have to put up with racism from people who have themselves developed their own racist attitudes on the back of the beliefs of their forefathers.

lowing wrote:

Oh and they are not AFRICAN American, they are only American. If your ass has NEVER been to Africa, let alone never being born in Africa, then you have no claim to put AFRICA in your identity. You are in FACT no more African than I am European.

I actually agree with you here, I'll bet the term 'African American' creeped into common parlance as some sort of PC equivalent to the term 'black American' or 'Negro'. It has in fact had an alienating effect if anything as it only further enforces the division in society between black people and people of other colours; as you point out white Americans never get referred to as 'European Americans'.

Actually you've touched on something quite telling there: Spanish Americans get called 'Latinos', Native Americans get called 'Indians', black Americans get called 'African Americans' and yet white Americans just get called 'Americans'...interesting.

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Yeah, that is pretty much what I said, because modern black people were not slaves 180 years ago there fore have no complaint coming about being a fucking slave. isn't that a far cry from claiming that I said racism has not existed for 180 some years?

My argument had been that you can't expect the trenchant and deep rooted racism of previous generations to have no inherited effect on subsequent generations, at least not in such a short time frame as one or two generations. True they have no right to call themselves slaves or even 'victims' of slavery but they may in many cases have to put up with racism from people who have themselves developed their own racist attitudes on the back of the beliefs of their forefathers.


I actually agree with you here, I'll bet the term 'African American' creeped into common parlance as some sort of PC equivalent to the term 'black American' or 'Negro'. It has in fact had an alienating effect if anything as it only further enforces the division in society between black people and people of other colours; as you point out white Americans never get referred to as 'European Americans'.

Actually you've touched on something quite telling there: Spanish Americans get called 'Latinos', Native Americans get called 'Indians', black Americans get called 'African Americans' and yet white Americans just get called 'Americans'...interesting.

1. Ok this is fine, and we have argued this point and by all means continue to do so if you wish. Just do not try and make an argument against me by inventing something I did not say

2. Yer right ya know why? Because white people in America have never insisted on being labeled individually or distinctly all the while screaming that we are being labeled individually or distinctly.

1. Chill out mate, I've already said that my post was an exaggeration based on your previous posts in other threads, I wasn't trying to seriously claim you thought racism completely ceased to exist after emancipation. I'll use sarcasm tags next time.

2. Or is it maybe just that white America are the ones who come up with the labels?

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Yeah, that is pretty much what I said, because modern black people were not slaves 180 years ago there fore have no complaint coming about being a fucking slave. isn't that a far cry from claiming that I said racism has not existed for 180 some years?

My argument had been that you can't expect the trenchant and deep rooted racism of previous generations to have no inherited effect on subsequent generations, at least not in such a short time frame as one or two generations. True they have no right to call themselves slaves or even 'victims' of slavery but they may in many cases have to put up with racism from people who have themselves developed their own racist attitudes on the back of the beliefs of their forefathers.


I actually agree with you here, I'll bet the term 'African American' creeped into common parlance as some sort of PC equivalent to the term 'black American' or 'Negro'. It has in fact had an alienating effect if anything as it only further enforces the division in society between black people and people of other colours; as you point out white Americans never get referred to as 'European Americans'.

Actually you've touched on something quite telling there: Spanish Americans get called 'Latinos', Native Americans get called 'Indians', black Americans get called 'African Americans' and yet white Americans just get called 'Americans'...interesting.

1. Ok this is fine, and we have argued this point and by all means continue to do so if you wish. Just do not try and make an argument against me by inventing something I did not say

2. Yer right ya know why? Because white people in America have never insisted on being labeled individually or distinctly all the while screaming that we are being labeled individually or distinctly.

1. Chill out mate, I've already said that my post was an exaggeration based on your previous posts in other threads, I wasn't trying to seriously claim you thought racism completely ceased to exist after emancipation. I'll use sarcasm tags next time.

2. Or is it maybe just that white America are the ones who come up with the labels?

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

1. Chill out mate, I've already said that my post was an exaggeration based on your previous posts in other threads, I wasn't trying to seriously claim you thought racism completely ceased to exist after emancipation. I'll use sarcasm tags next time.

2. Or is it maybe just that white America are the ones who come up with the labels?

2. sorry to disappoint, yer wrong


In this same period, a smaller number of people favored Afro-American. In the 1980s the term African American was advanced on the model of, for example, German American. Jesse Jackson popularized the term, and it was quickly adopted by major media. Many blacks in America expressed a preference for the term, as it was formed in the same way as names for others of the many ethnic groups. Some argued further that, because of the historical circumstances surrounding the capture, enslavement and systematic attempts to de-Africanize blacks in the United States under chattel slavery, most African Americans are unable to trace their ancestry to a specific African nation; hence, the entire continent serves as a geographic marker.

taken from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_American

Well there you go, Jesse Jackson comes up with yet another way of setting his race aside from others and holding his fellow people back.

Surprise, surprise!

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

Well there you go, Jesse Jackson comes up with yet another way of setting his race aside from others and holding his fellow people back.

Surprise, surprise!

yeah and.....................you were wrong

How can someone be wrong by asking a question?

Braddock wrote:

Or is it maybe just that white America are the ones who come up with the labels?

Last edited by lowing (2008-08-15 14:41:47)