Pages: 1

 

2008-09-08 11:50:29
CrazeD
Member
+368|6940|Maine
I have two ethernet wires that come into my room, and one of them is fucking possessed or something.

I have a 4 port wired router which connects to a 4 port wired hub. The wire for my main rig comes from the router, the wire for my second pc comes from the hub. The hub sucks balls so I want to put the second pc on the router as well. Only problem is, the wire only works on the hub.

It is a regular CAT 5 cable and I have redone both ends.

It works fine on the hub, but if I plug it into the router I have no internet and can't communicate at all with the router. The PC gets assigned a default IP because it can't acquire one. I've tried a static IP, that doesn't work either.

I've tried it in 3 different PC's, all have the same result.

How can a cable work in a hub but not in a router?

I'm not very experienced with networking, so I'm not sure if it matters what the wire arrangement is, but my pattern is (if the clip is facing down, and left to right):

Orange - Orange/white - Blue - Blue/white - Green - Green/white - Brown - Brown/white

Same on both sides of course.

So, what gives?
2008-09-08 12:02:16
Brasso
member
+1,549|6897

I would just buy/make a new cable, it's so cheap.  Weird problem though.  I'm in CISCO but I know jack shit about networking (funny, I know).
"people in ny have a general idea of how to drive. one of the pedals goes forward the other one prevents you from dying"
2008-09-08 12:13:38
Agent_Dung_Bomb
Member
+302|7003|Salt Lake City

OK, that is weird.  I would re-do the ends again, but make sure you do it like this; you will do both ends the same.  This is one of the two industry standard wiring schemes.

Orange/White - Orange - Green/White - Blue - Blue/White - Green - Brown/White - Brown

With the wires sorted in that order take and hold the cable end.  The clip side should be away from you with the cable opening down towards the ground and the connector side up.  Insert the cable and make sure you can see the copper ends of the wires at the end of the cable end.  Then crimp the cable end.  I usually do the crimp a couple of times just to make sure I get full penetration of the metal pins into the wires.
2008-09-08 13:29:19
CrazeD
Member
+368|6940|Maine

haffeysucks wrote:

I would just buy/make a new cable, it's so cheap.  Weird problem though.  I'm in CISCO but I know jack shit about networking (funny, I know).
I don't have more cable, I don't have any money, and it's a pain in the ass to route it here.

So then do you think my wire arrangement is the cause?
2008-09-08 13:30:23
Brasso
member
+1,549|6897

CrazeD wrote:

haffeysucks wrote:

I would just buy/make a new cable, it's so cheap.  Weird problem though.  I'm in CISCO but I know jack shit about networking (funny, I know).
I don't have more cable, I don't have any money, and it's a pain in the ass to route it here.

So then do you think my wire arrangement is the cause?
i don't know, it's such a strange problem.  try using a different wire, perhaps the other one since you know it works.
"people in ny have a general idea of how to drive. one of the pedals goes forward the other one prevents you from dying"
2008-09-08 13:35:12
CrazeD
Member
+368|6940|Maine
Well, the wire going to my main rig works for it.

I was always under the assumption that as long as both ends are the same arrangement, it should work. Unless it's a crossover.

I want to think that arrangement shouldn't matter, because it's just a wire in there that's transferring data. If it's Orange - Orange/white - Blue - Blue /white or Blue - Blue/white - Orange - Orange/white, that shouldn't matter, still the same just different visual color. Or is there something magical at play here.
2008-09-08 13:38:17
mikkel
Member
+383|6868

CrazeD wrote:

Well, the wire going to my main rig works for it.

I was always under the assumption that as long as both ends are the same arrangement, it should work. Unless it's a crossover.

I want to think that arrangement shouldn't matter, because it's just a wire in there that's transferring data. If it's Orange - Orange/white - Blue - Blue /white or Blue - Blue/white - Orange - Orange/white, that shouldn't matter, still the same just different visual color. Or is there something magical at play here.
No, you have it right. Same wire, same gauge, same ohmic resistance. The colour pattern is irrelevant, as long as the pinout is the same on both ends and the cable is physically undamaged.

Sounds like you have an open or a short somewhere in the cable, or that you're getting some serious electromagnetic interference across the wire pairs. If you have access to a UTP cable tester, I'd suggest that you check the wire maps and the attenuation on one of those.

Last edited by mikkel (2008-09-08 13:43:19)

2008-09-08 13:43:55
CrazeD
Member
+368|6940|Maine
But why would it work on the hub then?
2008-09-08 13:46:11
mikkel
Member
+383|6868

CrazeD wrote:

But why would it work on the hub then?
It could be that the hub is less sensitive to attenuation. Who knows? Active hubs typically just regenerate the signal on the bit level, so it might be that it's cleaning up the signal on the way to the router.

Edit: It could also just be one damaged non-TX/RX wire that's messing up an auto-MDX/MDIX negotiation and causing both ends to default to incompatible settings when connected to the router.

Last edited by mikkel (2008-09-08 13:51:02)

2008-09-08 13:52:07
Agent_Dung_Bomb
Member
+302|7003|Salt Lake City

CrazeD wrote:

Well, the wire going to my main rig works for it.

I was always under the assumption that as long as both ends are the same arrangement, it should work. Unless it's a crossover.

I want to think that arrangement shouldn't matter, because it's just a wire in there that's transferring data. If it's Orange - Orange/white - Blue - Blue /white or Blue - Blue/white - Orange - Orange/white, that shouldn't matter, still the same just different visual color. Or is there something magical at play here.
You're right that in theory, as long as the wiring is the same on both ends, regardless of color scheme arrangement, it should work.  I'm thinking it has more to do with a problem cable end.  I'm just offering the correct wiring standard for replacing the ends.

Just one other option to consider, make sure that you don't have the computer's MAC address listed as restricted in the router.  If this is a manageable hub, it could have its own MAC address, which may be hiding your system from a restriction set in the router.

lastly, if your router is full, and you only have one port left, which you are trying to use for your system, try a different port.
2008-09-08 14:02:15
CrazeD
Member
+368|6940|Maine
The router is full and thus the use of the hub. I have tried different ports, same deal.

When I first plug the cable in, it seems to "kind of" recognize the router. If I plug the cable in and then ping the router, it will maybe fail once and succeed 3 times, then the next time it will fail completely.

It is not a manageable hub. I don't think it is a MAC address problem, because I tried the cable in my working pc and it no longer worked. Unless the cable somehow has a memory, I don't think that's the issue.

I guess I'll just live with the shitty hub until I can get a new cable.

Maybe I'll just use my crossover cable to connect my second pc to my main pc directly...then I won't have to wait 4 hours to copy a gb.

Last edited by CrazeD (2008-09-08 14:02:39)

2008-09-08 14:03:18
Brasso
member
+1,549|6897

i dunno what you guys are talking about anymore so i can't contribute anything
"people in ny have a general idea of how to drive. one of the pedals goes forward the other one prevents you from dying"
2008-09-08 14:15:21
Agent_Dung_Bomb
Member
+302|7003|Salt Lake City

Have you done a ping with the -t command and see if the link keeps going up and down?

Do you have all the NIC settings on your computer set to Auto?  I wonder if your computer's NIC is having a tough time negotiating a speed with the router?  If it's not on auto, then try auto, or if it's on auto, try forcing a specific connection, like 10 full duplex, 100 half duplex, 100 full duplex, etc.  See if maybe this is actually something to do with your computer's NIC and not the cable, hub, or router.
2008-09-08 14:19:53
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7033|Cambridge (UK)

Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:

Have you done a ping with the -t command and see if the link keeps going up and down?

Do you have all the NIC settings on your computer set to Auto?  I wonder if your computer's NIC is having a tough time negotiating a speed with the router?  If it's not on auto, then try auto, or if it's on auto, try forcing a specific connection, like 10 full duplex, 100 half duplex, 100 full duplex, etc.  See if maybe this is actually something to do with your computer's NIC and not the cable, hub, or router.
Good suggestions, but he said if he uses a different cable it works OK. Ergo, it's the cable.

OP: It's the cable. (probably)

Last edited by Scorpion0x17 (2008-09-08 14:20:27)

2008-09-08 14:22:12
CrazeD
Member
+368|6940|Maine

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:

Have you done a ping with the -t command and see if the link keeps going up and down?

Do you have all the NIC settings on your computer set to Auto?  I wonder if your computer's NIC is having a tough time negotiating a speed with the router?  If it's not on auto, then try auto, or if it's on auto, try forcing a specific connection, like 10 full duplex, 100 half duplex, 100 full duplex, etc.  See if maybe this is actually something to do with your computer's NIC and not the cable, hub, or router.
Good suggestions, but he said if he uses a different cable it works OK. Ergo, it's the cable.

OP: It's the cable. (probably)
Yeah... always has to be the hardest thing to fix.

Just didn't make any sense to me that it would work in a hub but not in a router.

Damn cheap radio shack cables.

 

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