i believe you think too much my good sir...
but yes, making artards pay for their actions would be somewhat satasfying
but yes, making artards pay for their actions would be somewhat satasfying
We've addressed this by making it a seperate game mode. Rank and stats would transfer between normal games and this one.R0lyP0ly wrote:
I think having a minimum rank req's for vehicle usage is NOT a good idea :
(1) How can the lower-ranked players ever gain exp. in that vehicle if (he / she / it) cannot obtain usage?
Yup, making rank the only requirement will not work.R0lyP0ly wrote:
(2) Even a total air suckass (the nemesis to plane whores), can gain rank by being a tank whore, thus giving him "rights" to that J-10 even though the lower-ranked-but-more-experienced-player could make better use
As for your money system pitch, consider this situation where one team has a bunch of ranked players, and the other has mostly noobs. The noobs don't have much of a chance to begind with, and if you make the individual buy each asset, there could be a case where no one can buy a plane on the whole team. This pretty much gaurantee's a loss. This system will really widen the gap between experienced players and new guys. What I want to achive with my money system idea is to prioritize who gets access to advanced vehicles.
For now, lets say my system makes the game looks at your stats with a specific vehicle, not just rank.R0lyP0ly wrote:
You need a bit more detail to clear it up (for me @ least) :
Could I, by chance, armor whore in a tank, a get enough points to use a J-10??
Please explain
What the...you're going to require people to be an officer to fly? Not everybody has as much free time as you.WarmPudgy wrote:
i personally think there should be a minimum rank for certain vehicles
and the spawn time should be considerably longer as well
id say at least captain for jets, butterbar for choppers
msgt for tanks, gunny for apc's
and all ranks are able to operate transport vehicles including the blackhawk and sea cow
i think you should be able to prove your self on the ground before you pick up the big guns
If that was the case, I'd pity any US team on Wake Island with nothing but enlisted.
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-04-15 10:36:18)
Yet they don't understand. They see a single suggested radical change, and assume that it's going to rock the foundations of their Battlefield experience in a foul way.tF-afrojap wrote:
We've addressed this by making it a seperate game mode. Rank and stats would transfer between normal games and this one.
ALTERNATE GAME MODE, FOLKS!
its kindof like the game play for the HL mod Natural Selection. the commander gets resources from resource towers planted around the map. the comm uses these resources to build various structures and spawn weapons. mix this with bf2 and it would be a cool mod. its CnC meets BF2
there are what? 9000 hours in a year?unnamednewbie13 wrote:
What the...you're going to require people to be an officer to fly? Not everybody has as much free time as you.
i got officer in less than 700, ive seen some others get it with less than 400
and considering people like me that work full time (40 hours/week), and granted you get weekends off, thats 2080 hours a year, the required time to get ranks is not that much
and think what the ranks were back in 1.0 days, wasnt it 250,000 points just to get sgt major?
back to min ranks, its just my personal opinion, but you get to unlock weapons with rank, why not make it required to have TOS before you get to use the vehicles?
all the more reason to work hard
plus you have to consider the people who will abuse the system
we already have people statpadding to get ranks, people will find a way to abuse the cash system or what ever else someone might think of
if a team doesnt have any pilots/officers theyd better damn well work hard to take out that base that controls the jets or armorIf that was the case, I'd pity any US team on Wake Island with nothing but enlisted
if someone was able to get to the required rank on foot to get that tank, and use it the entire way to officer, why would he suddenly give up something he was good at to do something he sucked at?R0lyP0ly wrote:
(2) Even a total air suckass (the nemesis to plane whores), can gain rank by being a tank whore, thus giving him "rights" to that J-10 even though the lower-ranked-but-more-experienced-player could make better use
i dont think think this should be a different game mode, i think this is the way it should have been from the very beginning
again, just my opinion
"""if someone was able to get to the required rank on foot to get that tank, and use it the entire way to officer, why would he suddenly give up something he was good at to do something he sucked at?"""
Perhaps he/she isn't good at planes, but wants to fly them, so they rack up pts on something they ARE good at so they are eligible to fly
Perhaps he/she isn't good at planes, but wants to fly them, so they rack up pts on something they ARE good at so they are eligible to fly
if any one that can get to the rank to fly and sucks, if they have half a brain then theyre not gunna try to fly only to get shot down within a few seconds
not if they like doing it and want to continue!WarmPudgy wrote:
if any one that can get to the rank to fly and sucks, if they have half a brain then theyre not gunna try to fly only to get shot down within a few seconds
I know that I am not the only person here who has seen an inexperienced player (aka noob,nub,etc) get into an aircraft, be promptly shot down, then immediately try and get into the air again!
I'm want to shift the topic away from vehicles requirements, and back on the main topic.
I think we all agree that rank alone isn't enough when you want to determine who is qualified for a vehicle.
The game will look at your hours / kills in that vehicle and figure out who is the ideal pilot etc. Let's end the argument there and move on. I want to see some discussion regarding the point Skruples brought up, which is, how to implement this idea without making it impossible to recover from a baserape situation when a team is locked down to one flag.
I proposed a solution:
I think we all agree that rank alone isn't enough when you want to determine who is qualified for a vehicle.
The game will look at your hours / kills in that vehicle and figure out who is the ideal pilot etc. Let's end the argument there and move on. I want to see some discussion regarding the point Skruples brought up, which is, how to implement this idea without making it impossible to recover from a baserape situation when a team is locked down to one flag.
I proposed a solution:
Thoughts?The commander will know that it is useless to spawn anything into the main base. Perhaps he could save that cash and invest it in some sort of temporary uber defensive rail gun of doom. Or a bigass EMP shockwave. I know it's cheesy to the max, but you get the idea. Anyone got any thoughts on this?
In my experience, the only people that truly ruin games are asshole veteran players who seem to think that their rank guarantees them immunity.R0lyP0ly wrote:
Nice idea. Beginner commanders, "noobs", would have to have a smaller necessary kick vote due to he chance of ruining a game.
If we honestly wanted to make this game better, all the whiners, mopers and general idiots would be kept to their own servers.
There is actually a nugget of sensibility in my system, if anyone remembers Gunbound. Gunbound kept players of a low level to a certain selection of servers until they'd progressed. So if you were to create so called new player servers where it's necessary to obtain a certain amount of time in all vehicles before you can progress we'd see a lot less idiotic newbies and quite a few more people who'd kick your ass.
I'm sure it's only natural to want to segregate the people you don't like yankee boy. But truth be told, if you were a new player and got told that the big shiny game you bought with planes and tanks on the front wouldn't let you play them because some jumped up 14 year old thought you were to "n00bish" then you'd return that game in a second.
...drool.tF-afrojap wrote:
I proposed a solution:Thoughts?The commander will know that it is useless to spawn anything into the main base. Perhaps he could save that cash and invest it in some sort of temporary uber defensive rail gun of doom. Or a bigass EMP shockwave. I know it's cheesy to the max, but you get the idea. Anyone got any thoughts on this?
think of the madness though. if a commander put a defensive structure on the front lines of a battle. chaos, but fun to watch and laugh!
*chortle
as for having defense, i totally agree. mabye an automated AA station, like a downgraded Phalanx. or mabye some bouncing betties for troops and light armor.
I only read the first line and it is a fucking shit idea. The game is the way it is now go and play it and stop bitching
Another civilized and open-minded fellowSgt_Bob05 wrote:
I only read the first line and it is a fucking shit idea. The game is the way it is now go and play it and stop bitching
To be completely honest, I like the idea but I think it would never work. Here's why (and this is reitterating what some people have said, I know):
- I think this would really sap a lot of the fun out of the game; as I read somewhere else, a lot of people play it for the "Chaos Factor". There isn't really much point in having a game that only a few people can enjoy, especially from EA's point of view since they want to rip off as many people as possible....
- Restricting vehicles to higher ranked players will mean that nobody will ever learn or have the motivation to gain tens of thousands of points before they can drive even a tank. No offence, but isn't it a bit unfair to those of us who aren't the 1337est uber pro pilots? One of the mainn attractions of BF2 for a lot of people is the abundance of vehicles and how easy it is for anyone to have a go.
- Resources is a nice idea, but if a team lost money for deaths and the opposition gained cash for captured cp etc. then once a team started losing, it would be very hard for them to pull back. Again it would discourage new or not-so-brilliant players from enjoying themselves
- If you have, say, only one plane per round (as someone suggested) all it takes is for one person to crash and the whole team would be completely screwed. Plus that person would be persecuted for the rest of the game.
- Finally- who doesn't muck around a bit? Ocasionally having a bit of a laugh is more important than winning by steely determination and efficient play... it's called a game for a reason. And no I'm not a noob ;-)
So... yeah. I like some aspects of it though, like more power to squadleaders, more powers becoming available with better scores (but on an iar basis).
just my humble and rather long-winded opinion
brome
ps. completely agree with chuckle_hound
- I think this would really sap a lot of the fun out of the game; as I read somewhere else, a lot of people play it for the "Chaos Factor". There isn't really much point in having a game that only a few people can enjoy, especially from EA's point of view since they want to rip off as many people as possible....
- Restricting vehicles to higher ranked players will mean that nobody will ever learn or have the motivation to gain tens of thousands of points before they can drive even a tank. No offence, but isn't it a bit unfair to those of us who aren't the 1337est uber pro pilots? One of the mainn attractions of BF2 for a lot of people is the abundance of vehicles and how easy it is for anyone to have a go.
- Resources is a nice idea, but if a team lost money for deaths and the opposition gained cash for captured cp etc. then once a team started losing, it would be very hard for them to pull back. Again it would discourage new or not-so-brilliant players from enjoying themselves
- If you have, say, only one plane per round (as someone suggested) all it takes is for one person to crash and the whole team would be completely screwed. Plus that person would be persecuted for the rest of the game.
- Finally- who doesn't muck around a bit? Ocasionally having a bit of a laugh is more important than winning by steely determination and efficient play... it's called a game for a reason. And no I'm not a noob ;-)
So... yeah. I like some aspects of it though, like more power to squadleaders, more powers becoming available with better scores (but on an iar basis).
just my humble and rather long-winded opinion
brome
ps. completely agree with chuckle_hound
Last edited by brome (2006-04-16 08:13:14)
You, sir, are a certified chucklehead.Sgt_Bob05 wrote:
I only read the first line and it is a fucking shit idea. The game is the way it is now go and play it and stop bitching
This is a proposed game mode, not a replacement for every single kind of Battlefield 2 server. Don't worry, you'd still have your instaspawning tanks, should you choose not to play in this mode.
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-04-17 00:12:30)
I've always thought more tickets should be deducted based on killing a person in a vehicle.
Something like:
infantry = 1 ticket
tank/apc = 2 tickets
chopper = 3 tickets
plane = 4 tickets
Adds a little more value to keeping vehicles operational, and in the hands of skilled players.
So instead of using a "budget", use the existing ticket system to make vehicles and their operators more accountable.
Something like:
infantry = 1 ticket
tank/apc = 2 tickets
chopper = 3 tickets
plane = 4 tickets
Adds a little more value to keeping vehicles operational, and in the hands of skilled players.
So instead of using a "budget", use the existing ticket system to make vehicles and their operators more accountable.
I've another idea. What if it worked the following way:
When a player gets into the vehicle he puts up an advance of a certain amount of points, ie.
Attack Chopper: 150
Plane: 120
Tank: 100
APC: 60
Car: 20
etc...
Once the player takes off in the said vehicle, every time he makes a kill the amount of points decreases by a certain amount, say 20. If the player crashes the vehicle he loses the points that he has up for it.
If the player exits the vehicle, he has 30 seconds to get back in or he will be responsible for any dammage on the vehicle. If the vehicle is destroyed then it's the full amount, if it is just dammaged then for the amount of dammage.
For example:
Mr. Joe got into a Tank [100 hp] putting up a 100 GP on the line
He goes off and kills a Person, his GP go up by 2 and his cost for the Tank goes down to 80 GP
He goes on and kills 4 more people - Now he's got 10 total score and he totaly paid off his tank
He runs accross a mine and dies. But he doesn't lose any points because he paid his tank off.
Then Joe spawns again and picks up a brand new tank. (100 GP on the line again)
He goes off and runs into another tank he kills the opponent but has suffered some dammage, his tank is now at [40/100HP]
Joe says screw it and runs off. In 30 seconds Joe received -48GP penalty (60% of 80).
Mary decided to take the Tank next. She kills 4 people but they finally get her down and she bails with [10/100HP] on the Tank. She earned a total of 8 points but received a -18GP penalty for the tank so she's -10 in the hole.
etc...
This way the "Noob" players are not prohibited from using vehicles, but prepare to pay for it if you're not good. Good players can easily score 5 kills per tank life so it's not going to be a huge problem. The one thing that would have to be fixed for this to work, is that Negative points don't round up to 0 at the end of round but actually transfer to your GP. What do you guys think?
When a player gets into the vehicle he puts up an advance of a certain amount of points, ie.
Attack Chopper: 150
Plane: 120
Tank: 100
APC: 60
Car: 20
etc...
Once the player takes off in the said vehicle, every time he makes a kill the amount of points decreases by a certain amount, say 20. If the player crashes the vehicle he loses the points that he has up for it.
If the player exits the vehicle, he has 30 seconds to get back in or he will be responsible for any dammage on the vehicle. If the vehicle is destroyed then it's the full amount, if it is just dammaged then for the amount of dammage.
For example:
Mr. Joe got into a Tank [100 hp] putting up a 100 GP on the line
He goes off and kills a Person, his GP go up by 2 and his cost for the Tank goes down to 80 GP
He goes on and kills 4 more people - Now he's got 10 total score and he totaly paid off his tank
He runs accross a mine and dies. But he doesn't lose any points because he paid his tank off.
Then Joe spawns again and picks up a brand new tank. (100 GP on the line again)
He goes off and runs into another tank he kills the opponent but has suffered some dammage, his tank is now at [40/100HP]
Joe says screw it and runs off. In 30 seconds Joe received -48GP penalty (60% of 80).
Mary decided to take the Tank next. She kills 4 people but they finally get her down and she bails with [10/100HP] on the Tank. She earned a total of 8 points but received a -18GP penalty for the tank so she's -10 in the hole.
etc...
This way the "Noob" players are not prohibited from using vehicles, but prepare to pay for it if you're not good. Good players can easily score 5 kills per tank life so it's not going to be a huge problem. The one thing that would have to be fixed for this to work, is that Negative points don't round up to 0 at the end of round but actually transfer to your GP. What do you guys think?
Last edited by INCSOC (2006-04-20 12:16:45)
I think that the lower players should have less rights 2 vehicles, and b4 u go jumping 2 conlclusions its not because i think they suck, its so they can get some ground pounding experience, because MOST ppl spend more time on their feet then in a vehicle, so as u go up ranks u can use better vehicles, say u start with nothing, then private u can use a quick attack vehicle etc. u can b a passenger in them, but u cant drive them.
Last edited by Adams_BJ (2006-04-23 09:58:27)
This concept exists... Look at the MP part of the game "soldner". Supposedly it's a lot better now than it was when it first appeared (apparently for THAT game patches were a good thing). I haven't played it since it came out, it was pretty bad then.. But it did have some sort of "budget system". So you didn't just give a million dollar tank to just anyone as it could be taken out by a 10.000$ missile.