Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6457|Winland

Bertster7 wrote:

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


Ideally you have both set up and use digital when using digital content and analog through the sound card when not.
What do you mean by that?

And are you sure that's the DAC that's in them? It's a bit expensive for the application.
That is the DAC they use. Well, it isn't actually a DAC, it's an audio processor that also performs the function of a DAC - but that's what most sound cards use these days anyway.

A bit expensive for the application? What do you mean? Having a decent audio processing chip is quite important for a set of speakers that have digital inputs.
Are you really sure that's what's in them? Do you have a source? Having a decent processor is indeed an important part of the chain, but seeing how Logitech went all out BOSE with the rest of the system, I don't see why they would use good parts anywhere else in it; there's a humongous bottleneck both in the amplifier and the speakers themselves.
The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6841|SE London

Freezer7Pro wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

Freezer7Pro wrote:


What do you mean by that?

And are you sure that's the DAC that's in them? It's a bit expensive for the application.
That is the DAC they use. Well, it isn't actually a DAC, it's an audio processor that also performs the function of a DAC - but that's what most sound cards use these days anyway.

A bit expensive for the application? What do you mean? Having a decent audio processing chip is quite important for a set of speakers that have digital inputs.
Are you really sure that's what's in them? Do you have a source? Having a decent processor is indeed an important part of the chain, but seeing how Logitech went all out BOSE with the rest of the system, I don't see why they would use good parts anywhere else in it; there's a humongous bottleneck both in the amplifier and the speakers themselves.
Yes, I am sure.

I do have a source, at Logitech - that's how I get all my Logitech stuff so cheap, which is why I have lots of Logitech stuff. To be honest, the onboard decoder looks better than the DAC on the Audigy 2 - more like the one on the X-Fi.
Morpheus
This shit still going?
+508|6259|The Mitten

Whoaah wrote:

Morpheus wrote:

Whoaah wrote:

Additional trouble shooting
Pull power cord on pc, speakers still hum.
Pulled sound card out of pc and plugged speakers in, no hum.
Put card back in pc and plugged in only the speaker cables, no hum.
Plugged in Ethernet, small hum.
Plugged in parallel cable to printer, louder hum.
Plugged monitor DVI cable in, very loud hum.
Unplugged Ethernet and parallel, still very loud.
Unplugged power cord to monitor, no hum.
Plugged power cord to pc in, loud hum.
Unplugged power to pc and took a piece of wire from the receptacle ground to the pc chassis, loud hum.

So any ground path to the pc makes this hum! Bad receptacle ground? A simple receptacle tester shows hot, neutral & ground is ok.

Note: Sound system has an ungrounded power cord.

What sort of cable can I use to go from the digital output 1/8” plug on the card to the RCA input on the Logitech sound system? Any cable with 1/8” plug on one end and RCA on the other? Will switching to this cable solve my problem?
Try plugging in everything to the same power strip? I know you said that everything is eventually run to the UPS, but that's really like saying every ground leads to the same earth... There could be stuff that makes all the grounds work individually, but not as a whole set.
...And what kind of digital out do you have? I though you said it was an optical out.....
I did plug it all into one power strip, even tried a different strip. As I noted I can unplug everything except the sound system and touch a ground wire to the pc chassis with everything disconnected from the pc except the speaker wires and produce a loud hum. I think there's something going on with the building ground. Maybe equipment some where leaking a small voltage to ground.

The optical connection is from my tv to the to the speakers. I have an open digital input on the speakers and a digital output on the sound card that is not being used.
Ok. Well, then you can try this:
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/HumX/

It puts isolation on the ground, so I'd use it on a strip leading to your PC...

but you said other computers didn't have this hum issue?

And as far as the digital input, it depends on the format... you can't run AES/EBU into SPIDF and expect it work... although i suspect most consumer audio is SPIDF, i would double check the manuals.
EE (hats
Freezer7Pro
I don't come here a lot anymore.
+1,447|6457|Winland

Morpheus wrote:

Whoaah wrote:

Morpheus wrote:

Try plugging in everything to the same power strip? I know you said that everything is eventually run to the UPS, but that's really like saying every ground leads to the same earth... There could be stuff that makes all the grounds work individually, but not as a whole set.
...And what kind of digital out do you have? I though you said it was an optical out.....
I did plug it all into one power strip, even tried a different strip. As I noted I can unplug everything except the sound system and touch a ground wire to the pc chassis with everything disconnected from the pc except the speaker wires and produce a loud hum. I think there's something going on with the building ground. Maybe equipment some where leaking a small voltage to ground.

The optical connection is from my tv to the to the speakers. I have an open digital input on the speakers and a digital output on the sound card that is not being used.
Ok. Well, then you can try this:
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/HumX/

It puts isolation on the ground, so I'd use it on a strip leading to your PC...

but you said other computers didn't have this hum issue?

And as far as the digital input, it depends on the format... you can't run AES/EBU into SPIDF and expect it work... although i suspect most consumer audio is SPIDF, i would double check the manuals.
That thing is incredibly overpriced.

Whoaah wrote:

Additional trouble shooting
Pull power cord on pc, speakers still hum.
Pulled sound card out of pc and plugged speakers in, no hum.
Put card back in pc and plugged in only the speaker cables, no hum.
Plugged in Ethernet, small hum.
Plugged in parallel cable to printer, louder hum.
Plugged monitor DVI cable in, very loud hum.
Unplugged Ethernet and parallel, still very loud.
Unplugged power cord to monitor, no hum.
Plugged power cord to pc in, loud hum.
Unplugged power to pc and took a piece of wire from the receptacle ground to the pc chassis, loud hum.

So any ground path to the pc makes this hum! Bad receptacle ground? A simple receptacle tester shows hot, neutral & ground is ok.

Note: Sound system has an ungrounded power cord.

What sort of cable can I use to go from the digital output 1/8” plug on the card to the RCA input on the Logitech sound system? Any cable with 1/8” plug on one end and RCA on the other? Will switching to this cable solve my problem?
Hm, try plugging the monitor's power cord in the other way. Depending on where you live, this might not be possible, though...

Last edited by Freezer7Pro (2009-11-14 09:11:03)

The idea of any hi-fi system is to reproduce the source material as faithfully as possible, and to deliberately add distortion to everything you hear (due to amplifier deficiencies) because it sounds 'nice' is simply not high fidelity. If that is what you want to hear then there is no problem with that, but by adding so much additional material (by way of harmonics and intermodulation) you have a tailored sound system, not a hi-fi. - Rod Elliot, ESP
Morpheus
This shit still going?
+508|6259|The Mitten
Freezer:Overpriced it might seem, but do you have any other suggestions?

Whoaah: You could just ground lift the entire system...

I'd also try using a different outlet, you're right, the receptacle could be bad.

...Also, does it look like the audio power should be grounded? (as in, is there a pin missing in the plug, or is it a regular wall wort without ground?)

edit for clarification

Last edited by Morpheus (2009-11-15 14:25:57)

EE (hats
Whoaah
Member
+1|6480|Pa USA

Morpheus wrote:

Freezer:Overpriced it might seem, but do you have any other suggestions?

Whoaah: You could just ground lift the entire system...

I'd also try using a different outlet, you're right, the receptacle could be bad.

...Also, does it look like the audio power should be grounded? (as in, is there a pin missing in the plug, or is it a regular wall wort without ground?)

edit for clarification
Lifting the ground on the entire system is my last resort but I will if it comes to that.

The audio has a two wire ungrounded cord. The sub contains the power supply in a wooden box. I was think of maybe running a ground wire into the box and hopefully find a point to ground inside so everything will have the same ground reference.

I will not have anytime until next weekend to try this.
Morpheus
This shit still going?
+508|6259|The Mitten

Whoaah wrote:

Morpheus wrote:

Freezer:Overpriced it might seem, but do you have any other suggestions?

Whoaah: You could just ground lift the entire system...

I'd also try using a different outlet, you're right, the receptacle could be bad.

...Also, does it look like the audio power should be grounded? (as in, is there a pin missing in the plug, or is it a regular wall wort without ground?)

edit for clarification
Lifting the ground on the entire system is my last resort but I will if it comes to that.

The audio has a two wire ungrounded cord. The sub contains the power supply in a wooden box. I was think of maybe running a ground wire into the box and hopefully find a point to ground inside so everything will have the same ground reference.

I will not have anytime until next weekend to try this.
No, you'd have to ground the audio signal into the amp... and i doubt you can do that on a pair of Logitechs...

TBH, I'd try replacing the PSU... there might be something funky in it that's causing the clean power to jump onto the ground, which would mess up the audio... or, if you don't have a spare, just try removing it and repeating troubleshooting steps...
EE (hats

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