cant really be all that in-depth though, can it?Jenspm wrote:
FYI: Philosophy is a mandatory course in (afaik) ALL university degrees in Norway.
My contribution.
Liberal arts is the biggest by quite a bit, and then I am pretty sure it's either business or engineering natural sciences then engineering. Rough estimates off wikipedia says about 5k/40k undergrads are engineers. That is a lot to say "an undergraduate degree is worth so little it's not worth mention".Pochsy wrote:
I actually burst out laughing. You're my favorite interlocutor on this site by far.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
That is one massive exception. So large it essentially invalidates the previous theory. The engineering is either the second or third largest one on campus here.Pochsy wrote:
We ALL know an undergraduate degree is worth so little it's not worth mention. The only exception being engineering degrees.
Second or third by what margin?
It's not the same everywhere.
There are more BA graduates than there are engineers.
You and Macbeth sure like to follow me around.
it isn't that in-depth, no.Uzique wrote:
cant really be all that in-depth though, can it?Jenspm wrote:
FYI: Philosophy is a mandatory course in (afaik) ALL university degrees in Norway.
My contribution.
and laika it depends on the country. some socialist states subsidize education. for internationals, it depends again on the country.
1/8th of all undergradute degrees. Yeah, that's huge...Flaming_Maniac wrote:
Liberal arts is the biggest by quite a bit, and then I am pretty sure it's either business or engineering natural sciences then engineering. Rough estimates off wikipedia says about 5k/40k undergrads are engineers. That is a lot to say "an undergraduate degree is worth so little it's not worth mention".Pochsy wrote:
I actually burst out laughing. You're my favorite interlocutor on this site by far.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
That is one massive exception. So large it essentially invalidates the previous theory. The engineering is either the second or third largest one on campus here.
Second or third by what margin?
It's not the same everywhere.
There are more BA graduates than there are engineers.
You and Macbeth sure like to follow me around.
protip: I posted on this thread before you did.
my mom's a biochemist and it took her at least 15 years before she started seeing 6 figures. she didnt see that until she into business for herselfJohnG@lt wrote:
I've already got a job offer waiting for me starting at $85k/yr.Pochsy wrote:
Pfff everybody knows you take a liberal arts degree to say you have one, and use it to apply to grad school. MBA, MPP, MHR, JD or LLB etc.
I think the science kids are a joke. We ALL know an undergraduate degree is worth so little it's not worth mention. The only exception being engineering degrees. You use them as a stepping stone to your end goal; so why not take the path of least resistance? I prefer to study something I enjoy, which is admittedly only of any good or interest to myself, before I go off and find myself a real pursuit.
lol, not sure who said it (prob Galt), but I laughed pretty hard when I read that most science degrees with earn you 6 figures in a few years. Delusional.
EDIT- yeah, it was GaltJohnG@lt wrote:
a BS will have you making six figures in a few years.
Last edited by eleven bravo (2010-02-08 10:43:53)
Yeah, a blowfish that has to contend with such haughty arguments.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
You could think that engineering has a higher dropout rate because it is harder. You could think that LA has a higher dropout rate because the people that are in liberal arts in the first place aren't as motivated and probably don't work well in a self-motivated atmosphere.
~12.5% are straight engineers. Then add even half the ~8k/40k natural science students that probably won't go for masters degrees with perfectly useful degrees like computer science. A fifth of the school is not a "caveat". An undergrad degree in itself is worth a lot as far as finding a job, even if unrelated to your field. An engineering degree just means instead of a piece of paper showing you have the will and the means to complete 4 years of general coursework, you have a piece of paper showing you have the will and the means to complete specialized coursework.
Disappointing? What are you on? You're like a blowfish in defense mode.
Science gets you 5 figures at best... Finance and accounting will get you 6 (If you're fucking good at it).eleven bravo wrote:
my mom's a biochemist and it took her at least 15 years before she started seeing 6 figures. she didnt see that until she into business for herselfJohnG@lt wrote:
I've already got a job offer waiting for me starting at $85k/yr.Pochsy wrote:
Pfff everybody knows you take a liberal arts degree to say you have one, and use it to apply to grad school. MBA, MPP, MHR, JD or LLB etc.
I think the science kids are a joke. We ALL know an undergraduate degree is worth so little it's not worth mention. The only exception being engineering degrees. You use them as a stepping stone to your end goal; so why not take the path of least resistance? I prefer to study something I enjoy, which is admittedly only of any good or interest to myself, before I go off and find myself a real pursuit.
lol, not sure who said it (prob Galt), but I laughed pretty hard when I read that most science degrees with earn you 6 figures in a few years. Delusional.
EDIT- yeah, it was Galt
Good advice if you're a selfish prick that isn't thinking long term about providing a nice life for his future family. Doing what interests you is what hobbies are for. If you can match a high paying job with something you like it's awesome. Would I ever choose a low paying job willingly because it's 'fun'? No, that's what high school jobs are for.Jenspm wrote:
And I tend to agree with Uzique here, stop fucking talking about figures. Study what interests you.
How exactly is a BS in Computer Science so unlike a BS in Electrical Computer Engineering as an end goal? In context of "We ALL know an undergraduate degree is worth so little it's not worth mention. ... You use them as a stepping stone to your end goal"Pochsy wrote:
Yeah, a blowfish that has to contend with such haughty arguments.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
You could think that engineering has a higher dropout rate because it is harder. You could think that LA has a higher dropout rate because the people that are in liberal arts in the first place aren't as motivated and probably don't work well in a self-motivated atmosphere.
~12.5% are straight engineers. Then add even half the ~8k/40k natural science students that probably won't go for masters degrees with perfectly useful degrees like computer science. A fifth of the school is not a "caveat". An undergrad degree in itself is worth a lot as far as finding a job, even if unrelated to your field. An engineering degree just means instead of a piece of paper showing you have the will and the means to complete 4 years of general coursework, you have a piece of paper showing you have the will and the means to complete specialized coursework.
Disappointing? What are you on? You're like a blowfish in defense mode.
Now the natural science students are lumped in with engineers? Okay...sure, I'll just leave that for your own intellect to struggle with. Mine could never handle the leaps in logic.
Now we want to re-define what worth is as we come to find your claims untenable under the old? Why was this not brought up sooner, then? Not only this, but you're definition proves nothing as to the value of a degree, seeing as damn near everybody has one. Yes, they are a necessity as you so pointed out so well, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that this makes them valuable in todays market-- they're the average, and nothing more.
And here we come to the crux of this debate.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
How exactly is a BS in Computer Science so unlike a BS in Electrical Computer Engineering as an end goal? In context of "We ALL know an undergraduate degree is worth so little it's not worth mention. ... You use them as a stepping stone to your end goal"Pochsy wrote:
Yeah, a blowfish that has to contend with such haughty arguments.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
You could think that engineering has a higher dropout rate because it is harder. You could think that LA has a higher dropout rate because the people that are in liberal arts in the first place aren't as motivated and probably don't work well in a self-motivated atmosphere.
~12.5% are straight engineers. Then add even half the ~8k/40k natural science students that probably won't go for masters degrees with perfectly useful degrees like computer science. A fifth of the school is not a "caveat". An undergrad degree in itself is worth a lot as far as finding a job, even if unrelated to your field. An engineering degree just means instead of a piece of paper showing you have the will and the means to complete 4 years of general coursework, you have a piece of paper showing you have the will and the means to complete specialized coursework.
Disappointing? What are you on? You're like a blowfish in defense mode.
Now the natural science students are lumped in with engineers? Okay...sure, I'll just leave that for your own intellect to struggle with. Mine could never handle the leaps in logic.
Now we want to re-define what worth is as we come to find your claims untenable under the old? Why was this not brought up sooner, then? Not only this, but you're definition proves nothing as to the value of a degree, seeing as damn near everybody has one. Yes, they are a necessity as you so pointed out so well, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that this makes them valuable in todays market-- they're the average, and nothing more.
Because besides the fact that engineers make up such a large part of most universities that to dismiss them as the exception that proves the rule is ridiculous, your original statement is very offensive. Go tell a legal immigrant with a doctor's degree in his native country, working for little more than minimum wage in a plant in America that an American degree of any kind isn't worth anything. To say a degree that gets you a 40k/yr job isn't "valuable in today's market" is stupid elitist.
the fuck is wrong with you, you cunt?JohnG@lt wrote:
Good advice if you're a selfish prick that isn't thinking long term about providing a nice life for his future family. Doing what interests you is what hobbies are for. If you can match a high paying job with something you like it's awesome. Would I ever choose a low paying job willingly because it's 'fun'? No, that's what high school jobs are for.Jenspm wrote:
And I tend to agree with Uzique here, stop fucking talking about figures. Study what interests you.
Funny that, I see that as a very American way of seeing things. No offence, it's just a different way of viewing things. Work your ass off -> get a family -> Work your ass off to pay for child's college -> die early of stress.JohnG@lt wrote:
Good advice if you're a selfish prick that isn't thinking long term about providing a nice life for his future family. Doing what interests you is what hobbies are for. If you can match a high paying job with something you like it's awesome. Would I ever choose a low paying job willingly because it's 'fun'? No, that's what high school jobs are for.Jenspm wrote:
And I tend to agree with Uzique here, stop fucking talking about figures. Study what interests you.
killer. chill with it.Uzique wrote:
fuck that, all ive done in this topic is provide the other perspective to the 'economic use' debate of a degree. i havent asked to be generalized or personally involved in any of the discourse. im sick and tired of g@lt and his pseudo-intellectual bookfed bullshit, when as soon as he is engaged on any personal views, he's quickly shown to be a dumb narrowminded motherfucker.
Yes, we can't all live in a country with a population half the size of New York City and the oil reserves of Saudi Arabia. The rest of us have to worry about things like providing health care, a home, an education and food to our children.Jenspm wrote:
Funny that, I see that as a very American way of seeing things. No offence, it's just a different way of viewing things. Work your ass off -> get a family -> Work your ass off to pay for child's college -> die early of stress.JohnG@lt wrote:
Good advice if you're a selfish prick that isn't thinking long term about providing a nice life for his future family. Doing what interests you is what hobbies are for. If you can match a high paying job with something you like it's awesome. Would I ever choose a low paying job willingly because it's 'fun'? No, that's what high school jobs are for.Jenspm wrote:
And I tend to agree with Uzique here, stop fucking talking about figures. Study what interests you.
Honestly, I'd much rather pursue a education/career/way of life that interests me, ahead of going for a boring line of work that gives you "mad cash". It's sad, really, that all one thinks about is money when choosing a career/education path, money that'll ultimately be used on your child's education, who will most likely do the same. Result: generations of people stuck in jobs they really don't want so their children can do the same.
And fucking hell, you don't need a fucking 6-figure salary to make a nice living for your future family. Shit, you don't even need an education to do that.
l2socialismJohnG@lt wrote:
Yes, we can't all live in a country with a population half the size of New York City and the oil reserves of Saudi Arabia. The rest of us have to worry about things like providing health care, a home, an education and food to our children.Jenspm wrote:
Funny that, I see that as a very American way of seeing things. No offence, it's just a different way of viewing things. Work your ass off -> get a family -> Work your ass off to pay for child's college -> die early of stress.JohnG@lt wrote:
Good advice if you're a selfish prick that isn't thinking long term about providing a nice life for his future family. Doing what interests you is what hobbies are for. If you can match a high paying job with something you like it's awesome. Would I ever choose a low paying job willingly because it's 'fun'? No, that's what high school jobs are for.
Honestly, I'd much rather pursue a education/career/way of life that interests me, ahead of going for a boring line of work that gives you "mad cash". It's sad, really, that all one thinks about is money when choosing a career/education path, money that'll ultimately be used on your child's education, who will most likely do the same. Result: generations of people stuck in jobs they really don't want so their children can do the same.
And fucking hell, you don't need a fucking 6-figure salary to make a nice living for your future family. Shit, you don't even need an education to do that.
l2trypullingitoffinacountrythatdoesn'thaveamillionbarrelsofoilpercitizenJenspm wrote:
l2socialism
l2emigrateJohnG@lt wrote:
l2trypullingitoffinacountrythatdoesn'thaveamillionbarrelsofoilpercitizenJenspm wrote:
l2socialism
And subsist on lutefisk?Jenspm wrote:
l2emigrateJohnG@lt wrote:
l2trypullingitoffinacountrythatdoesn'thaveamillionbarrelsofoilpercitizenJenspm wrote:
l2socialism