Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|7077

Macbeth wrote:

Editorial from U.S.A today-
In fact, Bush's were a tad higher. His four-year average was 77; Kerry's 76. Both were C students. Kerry graduated from Yale in 1966; Bush in 1968.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/co … etto_x.htm

People with shitty highschool grades either continue to get shitty grades, do worse, or blossom and do really well. People with good high school grades either stay the same or do better, they don't suddenly become C students.

It's fair to say he didn't get in because of his academics and since he hasn't shown himself to have Nietzsche, or Joyce level of creativity or intelligence it's logical to conclude he got in because of his Yale graduate Texas oil millionaire father.

I don't see how admitting that his lucky birth and not his ability gave him some extra opportunity in life is impossible for you to do. I'm pretty ambivalent towards the guy and can recognize his college meant little to his presidency or legacy. To be honest, from where I dropped in, it looks like you are just arguing against Uzique for the sake of arguing against Uzique despite being wrong, like you do a lot.
Ehhh thats kinda untrue. One of friends here in Sydney was doing Commerce/Law here in UNSW last year (99.5 ATAR or pretty goddamn hard marks to get) and he got kicked out of UNSW coz he burned out last year, smoked a lot of weed stopped caring and failed most of his courses. It all depends what happens when you get into university.
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
13urnzz
Banned
+5,830|6858

Uzique wrote:

far-right nationalist president waging a 'war on terror'? not exactly a political masterclass
you are assuming Bush jr. was far right. jesus wept, stay out of Utah then. we have a 'Democrat' congressman (Matheson) who is more conservative than Bush ever was.

and he's our token liberal . . .
11 Bravo
Banned
+965|5598|Cleveland, Ohio

burnzz wrote:

Uzique wrote:

far-right nationalist president waging a 'war on terror'? not exactly a political masterclass
you are assuming Bush jr. was far right. jesus wept, stay out of Utah then. we have a 'Democrat' congressman (Matheson) who is more conservative than Bush ever was.

and he's our token liberal . . .
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6962|132 and Bush

I thought this was an interesting article.
The biggest lie in British politics.

Wherever it has been tried, it has worked. Look at the last Great Depression. The Great Crash of 1929 was followed by a US President, Herbert Hoover, who did everything Cameron demands. He cut spending and paid off the debt. The recession grew and grew. Then Franklin Roosevelt was elected and listened to Keynes. He ramped up spending – and unemployment fell, and the economy swelled. Then in 1936 he started listening to the Cameron debt-shriekers of his day. The result? The economy collapsed again. It was only the gigantic spending of the Second World War that finally ended it.
.. though it could be argued that the (relapse) collapse was the result of the previous years of spending, that it was not sustainable. With an economy the size of the US it takes a few years for the result of any action to be felt. Nothing is instant.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6962|132 and Bush

US economy outpaces rivals even as job growth lags

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The United States is out of step with the rest of the world's richest industrialized nations: Its economy is growing faster than theirs but creating far fewer jobs.

The reason is U.S. workers have become so productive that it's harder for anyone without a job to get one.

Companies are producing and profiting more than when the recession began, despite fewer workers. They're hiring again, but not fast enough to replace most of the 7.5 million jobs lost since the recession began.

Measured in growth, the American economy has outperformed those of Britain, France, Germany, Italy and Japan - every Group of 7 developed nation except Canada, according to The Associated Press' new Global Economy Tracker, a quarterly analysis of 22 countries representing more than 80 percent of global output.

Yet the U.S. job market remains the group's weakest. U.S. employment bottomed and started growing again a year ago, but there are still 5.4 percent fewer American jobs than in December 2007. That's a much sharper drop than in any other G-7 country. The U.S. had the G-7's highest unemployment rate as of December.

Canada and Germany have actually added jobs since the recession ended in June 2009.

U.S. companies aren't acting the way economists had expected them to.

In the past, when the U.S. economy fell into recession, companies typically cut jobs but often kept more than they needed. Some might have felt protective of their staffs. Or they didn't want to risk losing skilled employees they'd need once business rebounded.

Among manufacturers, for example, some tended to hoard workers during downturns by giving them make-work assignments - sweeping factory floors, counting inventory, painting warehouses.

The result is that productivity - output per workers - has typically decelerated or even dropped as the economy has weakened.

Japan and Europe have been following that script. At the depth of the recession in 2009, productivity shrank 3.7 percent in Japan and 2.2 percent in Europe.

The United States has proved the exception. U.S. productivity growth doubled from 2008 to 2009, then doubled again in 2010, according to the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development.

Panicked by the 2008 financial crisis and deepening recession, U.S. employers cut jobs pitilessly. They slashed an average of 780,000 jobs a month in the January-March quarter of 2009.

Japanese, European and Canadian companies are less inclined to purge employees. Their customs, labor regulations and unions discourage aggressive layoffs.

U.S. management practices "make it easier for employers to avoid adding permanent jobs," says economist Erica Groshen, a vice president at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. "They have temporary help they can hire easily. They're less constrained by traditional human resources practices or by union contracts."

Fewer than 12 percent of American workers belong to unions, which provide some protection against job cuts. That's the fourth-lowest union participation rate among 31 countries the OECD tracks.

"When there's pressure to cut costs in the United States, it's borne by the workers," says Howard Rosen, visiting fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics. "In Europe, it's borne differently."

In Germany, unemployment is lower now than before the recession. To limit layoffs, German companies spread the pain by reducing workers' hours.

"Japanese companies took it upon themselves to paint the factory - do more stuff that kept people on the payroll," says Gary Burtless, senior fellow in economic studies at the Brookings Institution.

That helps explain why Japan's unemployment rate was the lowest among G-7 countries in December at just 4.9 percent, though it may rise after the earthquake and nuclear disaster that struck Japan's northeastern coastline.

The United States is "on the other end of the spectrum," says Carl Van Horn, director of the John J. Heldrich Center for Workforce Development at Rutgers University.

"Everything is tilted in favor of the employers... The employee has no leverage. If your boss says, `I want you to come in the next two Saturdays,' what are you going to say - no?"
tldr; The US is doing great.. except in the most important areas, job growth.

So what does it say to you when the economy is growing, and yet employers refuse to hire? Widening wealth disparity? Too much gvmt interference? Not enough govmt action? Employers that are scared to act, to ensure their financial future?
I'm having a difficult time getting a read on this logic.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6772|'Murka

Maybe companies have realized they can produce just as well with fewer employees and thus haven't had to hire in order to get back to where they were before? Necessity being the mother of invention, they figured out ways to get by with fewer employees after laying them off, so their business processes improved...

Just a theory.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6962|132 and Bush

FEOS wrote:

Maybe companies have realized they can produce just as well with fewer employees and thus haven't had to hire in order to get back to where they were before? Necessity being the mother of invention, they figured out ways to get by with fewer employees after laying them off, so their business processes improved...

Just a theory.
Yea that's up there in management practices. I also wonder if they are just talking about domestic jobs, because outsourcing would answer some questions.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5719|London, England

Kmar wrote:

I thought this was an interesting article.
The biggest lie in British politics.

Wherever it has been tried, it has worked. Look at the last Great Depression. The Great Crash of 1929 was followed by a US President, Herbert Hoover, who did everything Cameron demands. He cut spending and paid off the debt. The recession grew and grew. Then Franklin Roosevelt was elected and listened to Keynes. He ramped up spending – and unemployment fell, and the economy swelled. Then in 1936 he started listening to the Cameron debt-shriekers of his day. The result? The economy collapsed again. It was only the gigantic spending of the Second World War that finally ended it.
.. though it could be argued that the (relapse) collapse was the result of the previous years of spending, that it was not sustainable. With an economy the size of the US it takes a few years for the result of any action to be felt. Nothing is instant.
Keynesian economics has been dead for the past forty years. The only people that still trot out its corpse are the media because the concepts are simple enough for them to understand and economic liberals because it means they get to spend more money.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5719|London, England

FEOS wrote:

Maybe companies have realized they can produce just as well with fewer employees and thus haven't had to hire in order to get back to where they were before? Necessity being the mother of invention, they figured out ways to get by with fewer employees after laying them off, so their business processes improved...

Just a theory.
Not really a theory, it's fact. There will be a backlash in the form of burnt out employees here in a bit so the hiring will begin soon. Can only sustain productivity levels like this for so long before people have nervous breakdowns on the job.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,818|6467|eXtreme to the maX

11 Bravo wrote:

well it would be a nice gesture.  he is gone.  funny how it works.  everyone votes repubs out then like almost instantly they want them back.
And the people shouting loudest to impeach him will also be the same ones shouting loudly we should invade Libya.
Fuck Israel
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,818|6467|eXtreme to the maX

Jay wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Maybe companies have realized they can produce just as well with fewer employees and thus haven't had to hire in order to get back to where they were before? Necessity being the mother of invention, they figured out ways to get by with fewer employees after laying them off, so their business processes improved...

Just a theory.
Not really a theory, it's fact. There will be a backlash in the form of burnt out employees here in a bit so the hiring will begin soon. Can only sustain productivity levels like this for so long before people have nervous breakdowns on the job.
Its very much a fact, except where you wrote 'hiring' you should have put 'offshoring'.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2011-03-31 05:21:46)

Fuck Israel
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5719|London, England

Dilbert_X wrote:

Jay wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Maybe companies have realized they can produce just as well with fewer employees and thus haven't had to hire in order to get back to where they were before? Necessity being the mother of invention, they figured out ways to get by with fewer employees after laying them off, so their business processes improved...

Just a theory.
Not really a theory, it's fact. There will be a backlash in the form of burnt out employees here in a bit so the hiring will begin soon. Can only sustain productivity levels like this for so long before people have nervous breakdowns on the job.
Its very much a fact, except where you wrote 'hiring' you should have put 'offshoring'.
A) fuck off. B) No, the jobs I'm talking about are white collar jobs that are incredibly difficult to 'offshore'.

Go back to arguing with lowing.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,818|6467|eXtreme to the maX
A)Fuck off yourself.
B)There are very few white collar jobs which can't be offshored by one means or another.
Fuck Israel
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5719|London, England

Dilbert_X wrote:

A)Fuck off yourself.
B)There are very few white collar jobs which can't be offshored by one means or another.
troll elsewhere.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6360|...
Offshoring is at the expense of the quality of your product. Other countries simply can't provide skilled labor.
inane little opines
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,818|6467|eXtreme to the maX
Meh, people take a break with a nervous breakdown, their work gets distributed amongst those remaining, nothing changes.
Fuck Israel
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,818|6467|eXtreme to the maX

Shocking wrote:

Offshoring is at the expense of the quality of your product. Other countries simply can't provide skilled labor.
Most work has been de-skilled, its not a problem.

Not that there's a shortage of skilled people.

China is on course to overtake the US in scientific output possibly as soon as 2013 - far earlier than expected.

That is the conclusion of a major new study by the Royal Society, the UK's national science academy.

The country that invented the compass, gunpowder, paper and printing is set for a globally important comeback.

An analysis of published research - one of the key measures of scientific effort - reveals an "especially striking" rise by Chinese science.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-12885271

I blame rap music and offshoring about evenly.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2011-03-31 05:43:15)

Fuck Israel
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6360|...
How do people manage to get nervous breakdowns in 9 to 5 jobs
inane little opines
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6360|...

Dilbert_X wrote:

Shocking wrote:

Offshoring is at the expense of the quality of your product. Other countries simply can't provide skilled labor.
Most work has been de-skilled, its not a problem.
de-skilled? what bull is that?

I know that many of the ship hulls nowadays get produced in China, many of them are of terrible quality - the steel being all wobbly and stuff. No, china can't provide skilled labor - they don't have the facilities to provide people with a proper education in order to meet the standard. If you're talking assembly line production type of work, a lot of it is being done by robotics.

And the people overseeing the assembly line; right, skilled labor.
inane little opines
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,818|6467|eXtreme to the maX
Do you know anything at all about China or manufacturing in China?
Fuck Israel
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6360|...
Yeah I do but they're not exactly the people you run to if you want difficult stuff being done right. Most of the assembly of complex machines or constructions still gets done by us because there's an immense attention to detail, we also have the proper facilities to help in the production.

I don't know what you're trying to argue because if you actually had any point the roles in this world would have been reversed.
inane little opines
11 Bravo
Banned
+965|5598|Cleveland, Ohio

Kmar wrote:

I'm having a difficult time getting a read on this logic.
well i can tell you for my company...our benefits have been shrunk yet we pay more this year (even took away vision insurance).  havent had a raise in 2 years (except a promotion but thats my hard work and not a raise).  we are maxed out with work and have minimum people yet we are getting more airplanes and opening new markets all summer yet we are about as thin as you can get.  so, they are bringing in more money than last year yet seem to be spending less on overhead.  its win win for them.  this crap makes the turnover rate high yet they do not care because they know so many people are looking for work.

now, i am not just going to blame the big bad companies here.  people need to wrap their head around the fact that you need to become highly mobile if you want a job.  no more of this putting down roots shit.  no more of well i grew up here or my family is here.  too fucking bad.  either move to the jobs or stay a burden to society.  you think i want to live in minnesota?  fuck no
11 Bravo
Banned
+965|5598|Cleveland, Ohio

Dilbert_X wrote:

11 Bravo wrote:

well it would be a nice gesture.  he is gone.  funny how it works.  everyone votes repubs out then like almost instantly they want them back.
And the people shouting loudest to impeach him will also be the same ones shouting loudly we should invade Libya.
?? not true at all
Shocking
sorry you feel that way
+333|6360|...

11 Bravo wrote:

Kmar wrote:

I'm having a difficult time getting a read on this logic.
well i can tell you for my company...our benefits have been shrunk yet we pay more this year (even took away vision insurance).  havent had a raise in 2 years (except a promotion but thats my hard work and not a raise).  we are maxed out with work and have minimum people yet we are getting more airplanes and opening new markets all summer yet we are about as thin as you can get.  so, they are bringing in more money than last year yet seem to be spending less on overhead.  its win win for them.  this crap makes the turnover rate high yet they do not care because they know so many people are looking for work.

now, i am not just going to blame the big bad companies here.  people need to wrap their head around the fact that you need to become highly mobile if you want a job.  no more of this putting down roots shit.  no more of well i grew up here or my family is here.  too fucking bad.  either move to the jobs or stay a burden to society.  you think i want to live in minnesota?  fuck no
Sounds harsh but logical from their pov, the problem is that there are so many unemployed people rather than the companies abusing people I reckon. If there were less people fighting over a job companies would have to start competing with one another again by providing a good work environment, being raises benefits etc.

Can't really blame them nope
inane little opines
SenorToenails
Veritas et Scientia
+444|6491|North Tonawanda, NY

Dilbert_X wrote:

China is on course to overtake the US in scientific output possibly as soon as 2013 - far earlier than expected.

That is the conclusion of a major new study by the Royal Society, the UK's national science academy.

The country that invented the compass, gunpowder, paper and printing is set for a globally important comeback.

An analysis of published research - one of the key measures of scientific effort - reveals an "especially striking" rise by Chinese science.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-12885271

I blame rap music and offshoring about evenly.
Quantity != Quality

How many of those papers published in China are cited?  How many are actually interesting?  Or vaguely important?

Few Chinese scientists would be surprised to hear that many of the country's scientific journals are filled with incremental work, read by virtually no one and riddled with plagiarism.
http://www.nature.com/news/2010/100915/ … 7261a.html

Approximately one-third of the roughly 5,000 predominantly Chinese-language journals are 'campus journals', existing only so that graduate students and professors can accumulate the publications necessary for career advancement, according to one senior publisher.
Now THAT is just fucking lazy!  And surprise, 31% of those articles are products of plaigarism!

Most Chinese journals make their money through funding from their host institutions, and by charging authors per-page publishing fees. "Most are never cited. Who knows if they're even really published. They're ghosts," says one publisher, who declined to be named. Wu Haiyun, a cardiologist at the Chinese PLA General Hospital in Beijing, says that only 5–10% of these journals are worth saving, and the rest are "information pollution".
"Information pollution"...lol

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