BF2S Forums Pandemic thread

My distrust of the Chinese government and its reported numbers or control has very little to do with 'yellow scare', but nice racial angle. In detail I have no clue what the true extent of the lockdowns were, but safe to say considering how it's spreading throughout the rest of the globe, a shutdown just in Wuhan wouldn't cut it. They have over 100 cities with more than 1 million inhabitants, it's no stretch of the imagination to think these were all infected before the rest of the world was. At some point they had a few hundred cases in Beijing, Guanzhou , Shanghai, many other cities - did some big brother magic happen there which we or the news media missed? Lockdown in Wuhan happened way after it already spread elsewhere.

Then again I admit I'm arguing from limited information as I don't have the time to check these things in depth. Fair that bojo&co might have been out to mislead as well, but I don't hope they're manufacturing intelligence a la GW Bush&co.

Also if you're not centrist, liberal, socialist or anything really please define your political stance.


Edit: Yellow scare not yellow fever lol

Last edited by Larssen (2020-04-01 07:08:39)

Larssen wrote:

Then again I admit I'm arguing from limited information as I don't have the time to check these things in depth. Fair that bojo&co might have been out to mislead as well, but I don't hope they're manufacturing intelligence a la GW Bush&co.

Also if you're not centrist, liberal, socialist or anything really please define your political stance.

why do i need a political stance to point out that your thinking is suspect? you just literally said 'BoJo and co are onto something', this in a thread where you have repeatedly expressed incredulity at donald trump's press briefings. so why the sudden credulity for another ideologically driven lot, such as BoJo/Cummings? that executive is full of quacks and kooks at present, all of whom are very politically motivated to quite radical ends -- the parallel and analogy to the early 'Bannon project' white house is entirely apposite. i'm not sure why you're taking their every 'leak' to the press, 'letting it be known that they're furious' (i.e. dominic cummings sends a whatsapp message to robert peston, who faithfully relays it to the rest of the media corps; that's how comms work here in the UK at present), etc., it's all such balderdash.

this is the exact same circle of people who have just spent 3 years lying through their teeth repeatedly about the EU. johnson, gove, cummings. the same figureheads whose mendacity you have been confronting almost weekly when they spread misinformation about brussels, 'turkish immigrants', '£300 million a week', etc. why the sudden volte face on your part?

so you admit you know very little but treat one group of statements in good faith and another set of statements in bad faith. i wonder what the swing factor can be?

korea also had multiple outbreaks across several (very) large cities, not just seoul but many neighbouring cities with extremely high density. are they fabricating the figures there too?

Last edited by uziq (2020-04-01 07:05:33)

i don't distrust my government to that extent. do i distrust the executive branch inside downing street? yes. they all have the track records to show why that isn't an entirely imprudent line to take. don't forget cummings overlap with cambridge analytica and the whole nexus of dark arts implied therein. these people are full of shit, they're master manipulators of the old media and leap-years ahead of the opposition with new media/big data, too. i don't trust them and it seems entirely wise. do i distrust 'the government', bureaucracy, westminster, tout court? no. i have a great deal of respect and belief in those traditions. various institutions have proven their worth time and time again in recent events, for e.g. the house of lords and the supreme court.

i have never voted libdem. i voted labour pre-corbyn, but couldn't vote labour in the last election. i don't see why i have to wear a coloured armband or subscribe to some doctrinaire political ideology in order to engage in political debate; sometimes all the options on the table deserved to be damned by criticism.

you don't know anything about my political life, much like dilbert doesn't know anything about my creative life. frankly it would be suicidal to cross the streams and combine them here. i still don't agree that calling out vague or suspect thinking requires me to have a loudspeaker and proclaim from hyde park corner with a 'Cause'.

and, right. now i'm insecure. carry on reading boris johnson's press releases like the gospel, my good man!

weren't you PM'ing me to ask for reading recommendations all of 3 weeks ago? now i read too much, comment too much, act too little? you're a pretty strange guy.

Last edited by uziq (2020-04-01 08:04:07)

in any case, i think your little thesis about needing to be activists and participants is also suspect, if not absolutely full of shit. one could just as easily say that politics right now is heating up and is full precisely of too much participation on behalf of citizens, precisely in that it is becoming emotive and increasingly angry, with everyone internalising 'big issues' as personal conflicts and identitarian struggles (look at the number of people who now feel personally embroiled in the EU question in britain, as compared to 10 years ago when plenty were 'meekly nodding' along to political currents. has a nation's greengrocers and hairdressers ever felt so strongly about something?). what is wrong with the distance of reflection and criticism?

it sounds to me like your problem, in less euphemistic terms, is you're upset that people aren't out in the streets waving placards for your own personal brand of politics. there's still time to mount a counter-insurgency for macronisme, larssen! but no, i won't be joining you taking to the counter-insurgency against the gilet jaunes in defense of that 'rational', 'progressive' meliorism you keep banging on about.

here's some recommended reading for you, yeat's 'the second coming':

Turning and turning in the widening gyre   
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere   
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst   
Are full of passionate intensity.

Last edited by uziq (2020-04-01 08:07:25)

the author's time, which is much like our current time, you mean? the inevitable heating up of discourse? instability? anger and invective? economic recession? political leaders railing against newspapers, newspapers accusing judges of being traitors? calls for independence, secessions? a growing right-wing? yeah, the 1920s were so much different from the 2020s. but you have a promising future career as a literary critic!

lots of people are involved in politics. i live in a city with a tremendous amount of grassroots political organization.

Last edited by uziq (2020-04-01 08:33:07)

yeats was not an aristocrat and was involved to varying degrees in the irish republican question. seeing many of his friends and associates executed for their role in uprisings rather understandably gave him a lukewarm view on all that ‘participation’ you talk of. let’s just move on as i don’t see much profit in helping you make sense of someone’s wikipedia.

we have different politics and different approaches. the end. i don’t even see why activism necessarily leads to meaningful change. localism and horizontalism have been two conspicuous failures of the Left in recent years.

Last edited by uziq (2020-04-01 09:22:17)

i agree, it's so much better when everyone holds strong convictions on topics, like dilbert. for someone who seems hyper-aware of 'the internet' as a shaping force, it's quaint that you keep recycling rorty's antique ideas about edifying exchanges. you'll be citing 'the public sphere' and habermas next!

back to the pandemic, please.

Last edited by uziq (2020-04-01 10:50:02)

We got some temperature guns but aren't using them till the lawyers give the ok.

They were told to buy em but cause we're not in a state that's requiring it its a lawyer thing

For the essential employees still coming in (warehouse, logistics, repair staff), we take temps every day and record them. We record every employee who enters the facility, too, so we can trace back any contact points if needed.

We have one worker in quarantine right now. Asymptomatic but HR had to remind him that just because he felt ok doesn't mean he can return back to work in a week. 14 days, bro.

We are currently paying our temporary workers even though they aren't coming in. I can't imagine that will happen for much longer though.

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

We are currently paying our temporary workers even though they aren't coming in. I can't imagine that will happen for much longer though.

My school district is still paying the janitors, food service, substitutes, and aides even though they aren't working. One of the great parts of working for the government is that leadership doesn't treat the budget as if they get to keep some of it later. The district is actually saving money right now due to not having to power the schools, pay for water, feed kids, use supplies, gas the buses, pay overtime, run field trips and whatever else they spend money on day to day. If the low wage and support staff continues to get financial assistance, I don't mind if the superintendent used some of the savings to buy a new Lexus or redo their kitchen or something.

And there is going to be plenty of savings during this period because school isn't going to open until September at least. They are saying they plan to open by May but everyone knows that isn't happening. I feel very bad for the freshmen and seniors. The two best years of high school cut short. Shame!

Larssen is Catholic?