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2006-08-22 01:36:32
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7126

david363 wrote:

Jim_Bred wrote:

Gay video, glorifying the stupidity of the american army
this douche needs to be banned,
Your whole damn continent needs to be banned, from the world, and at the rate your goverment is going, north-korea will soon do that banning.

Glorifying an army is pure mental insanes. I went to america about a year ago, and people at the airport actually applause for those who were dumb enough to do the oil war for mr. G. W. Bush.

I do not have problems with the US, I have a problem with your damn foreign policy, letting others do your fighting! The Dutch in afghanistan, the Brits, Italian, Japanese; all fighting your so-called war for democracy!

Last edited by Bernadictus (2006-08-22 01:39:38)

2006-08-22 01:39:39
drake666
when Hell is full...
+184|7099|austria
even I'm not an american i feel with the families and friends of the soldiers there!
when u see young men like 19-25 dieing in war that no one can understand....

and to the guy above Jim or something.. i you where a member of a folk that gets attacked by some religious idiots, wouldn't you be glad that someone helps you?
in 1946 when europe got saved by the Allies (USA England Russia France) everyone was thankful when they feed us, so STFU!
better go back to ground-school and learn more about history...
https://team-ex.de/imagehosting/daten/1323768139_m98b.png
Usque Ad Finem
2006-08-22 01:42:41
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7126

TeK||drake666 wrote:

even I'm not an american i feel with the families and friends of the soldiers there!
when u see young men like 19-25 dieing in war that no one can understand....

and to the guy above Jim or something.. i you where a member of a folk that gets attacked by some religious idiots, wouldn't you be glad that someone helps you?
in 1946 when europe got saved by the Allies (USA England Russia France) everyone was thankful when they feed us, so STFU!
better go back to ground-school and learn more about history...
What religious idiots? Place yourself in a muslim, your country is getting 'crusaded' by oil thursty christians.
And which religious idiot was there in Iraq? You mean Sadam Hussein?
Not to defend him, but the man has a damn Nobel Prize ffs! And the country is in much worse shape now then it was back in his days.
More likely to get worse as time progresses.

WW2 ended in 1945. Allies were US, Canadians, Brits, Polish, Dutch, France and a shitload of others. You go back to school. Know your history!

There is a major difference, being invaded and occupied for 5 years, and fighting out personal wars on the expences of other countries.

Last edited by Bernadictus (2006-08-22 01:47:39)

2006-08-22 01:46:52
drake666
when Hell is full...
+184|7099|austria
yeah thats true, but i don't think that the US-troops don't help the Iraqi (like children) civilians with medics, food and clean water...
thats what i tried to say..
https://team-ex.de/imagehosting/daten/1323768139_m98b.png
Usque Ad Finem
2006-08-22 01:48:53
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7126

TeK||drake666 wrote:

yeah thats true, but i don't think that the US-troops don't help the Iraqi (like children) civilians with medics, food and clean water...
thats what i tried to say..
Offcourse they are helping a small proportion of the poppulation. But I would rather go to Iraq on vacation with Saddam as their leader, then to go their present day!

david363 wrote:

I swear if any of you laugh at this i will kill you
Ha. Ha. Ha. Now make my day Yankee.

Last edited by Bernadictus (2006-08-22 02:15:14)

2006-08-22 02:35:29
JohnnySupreme
Member
+23|6884
I don't want to get involved in a serious political discussion.  However, I feel their are 2 sides to this.

Please read both my comments before replying.

The war in Iraq happened for what appears to be the wrong reasons.  Many believe it was a war fueled by George Bush's lust for oil while using the guise of a mission to free the Iraqi people.  There is a lot of evidence to support this theory.  If true then there has been a massive amount of suffering for such a selfish and greedy reason.  This is very wrong and so I can understand why some people get angry about it.

Then we have the other side of the arguement.  The soldiers and also the innocent people of Iraq.  Many thousands have died to date from all sides.  What is worse is that many involved in the fighting have little understanding of their reason to be there.  These are the people we must really think about and consider how they must feel.  It is not their war but they are serving their country as ordered in a hostile environment.  This is a far more brave and noble thing to do than most of us will ever do.
2006-08-22 02:44:33
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7126

JohnnySupreme wrote:

The war in Iraq happened for what appears to be the wrong reasons.  Many believe it was a war fueled by George Bush's lust for oil while using the guise of a mission to free the Iraqi people.  There is a lot of evidence to support this theory.  If true then there has been a massive amount of suffering for such a selfish and greedy reason.  This is very wrong and so I can understand why some people get angry about it.
True.

JohnnySupreme wrote:

Then we have the other side of the arguement.  The soldiers and also the innocent people of Iraq.  Many thousands have died to date from all sides.  What is worse is that many involved in the fighting have little understanding of their reason to be there.  These are the people we must really think about and consider how they must feel.  It is not their war but they are serving their country as ordered in a hostile environment.  This is a far more brave and noble thing to do than most of us will ever do.
The absurd thing is that people know what kind of rat-hole Iraq is, but still they sign up to fight for - as you said -  "the little understanding of their presence there". Why do people sign up when they do not understand the reason why they are fighting. WW2 was clear, the reason was to free Europe of the Axis. Vietnam, to push North Vietnam back. Korea, the red Khmer. Iraq - Gulf War - , to push Saddam back to Iraq out of Kuweit. Need to continue?

Looking back in history, the current war in Iraq, and the whole war on terror is pointless.
2006-08-22 03:51:29
Intheshadows
Member
+5|6932
@Bernadictus

I have a good friend that is contracted by the US State Department to do various things in Iraq, being there both as a US soldier and a private contractor he has a rather interesting photo collection, especially the ones of him standing on a uncovered stockpile of chemical and nerve agent warheads, rather dumb of him to be standing on them but its serves the purpose to show the weapons that many people claim were not there....WERE and still ARE there.

I have a cousin that flies helo's for the US army he has rather interesting stories of the al queda camps in iraq when they were raided south of baghdad.

That being said if we wanted oil we could invade Venezuela for much cheaper and with much less loss of life. I believe its more of a control grab meant to surround the extremist regime of Iran and remove the funding and training source of many anti-us terrorist groups with one stone.

I am assuming you live in the netherlands as your profile states. If that is the case why are you roasting americans when your own countrymen are taking part in all of this? Your tax dollars go to support the very thing you decry!

I have to credit my brother on the awesome video's and photos of his unit meeting up with a Dutch KCT unit and them spending the next several hours trying out each others weapons on 55 gallon barrels in the desert. Also rather interesting that many of the weapons your countrymen carry are of american make. So you have your own tax dollars paying for american weapons, and your tax dollars paying for those soldiers to take part in a war you do not agree with. Seems like you are just being screwed from all sides.

Last edited by Intheshadows (2006-08-22 03:52:40)

2006-08-22 04:18:55
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6889|Valley of the Dragons

Intheshadows wrote:

I have to credit my brother on the awesome video's and photos of his unit meeting up with a Dutch KCT unit and them spending the next several hours trying out each others weapons on 55 gallon barrels in the desert. Also rather interesting that many of the weapons your countrymen carry are of american make. So you have your own tax dollars paying for american weapons, and your tax dollars paying for those soldiers to take part in a war you do not agree with. Seems like you are just being screwed from all sides.
I am not 100% sure, but to my best knowledge the Dutch forces dont use US weaponry. At least not on an Infantry Platoon level. The weapons you might confuse for being US are in fact the Diemaco C7/C7A1 5.56 mm assault rifle and the Diemaco C8/C8A1 5.56 mm carbine. Both M16/AR15 clones made under license in Canada. Diemaco was recently (2005) taken over by Colt. The purchase of the weapons by the Dutch Army was before this date.
2006-08-22 04:28:35
spacepelle
Kniven Gaffeln Skeden
+37|7054|Sweden

Jemme101 wrote:

Intheshadows wrote:

I have to credit my brother on the awesome video's and photos of his unit meeting up with a Dutch KCT unit and them spending the next several hours trying out each others weapons on 55 gallon barrels in the desert. Also rather interesting that many of the weapons your countrymen carry are of american make. So you have your own tax dollars paying for american weapons, and your tax dollars paying for those soldiers to take part in a war you do not agree with. Seems like you are just being screwed from all sides.
I am not 100% sure, but to my best knowledge the Dutch forces dont use US weaponry. At least not on an Infantry Platoon level. The weapons you might confuse for being US are in fact the Diemaco C7/C7A1 5.56 mm assault rifle and the Diemaco C8/C8A1 5.56 mm carbine. Both M16/AR15 clones made under license in Canada. Diemaco was recently (2005) taken over by Colt. The purchase of the weapons by the Dutch Army was before this date.
OH snap!
2006-08-22 05:05:08
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6889|Valley of the Dragons

spacepelle wrote:

OH snap!
2006-08-22 05:13:26
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7126

Intheshadows wrote:

I have a good friend that is contracted by the US State Department to do various things in Iraq, being there both as a US soldier and a private contractor he has a rather interesting photo collection, especially the ones of him standing on a uncovered stockpile of chemical and nerve agent warheads, rather dumb of him to be standing on them but its serves the purpose to show the weapons that many people claim were not there....WERE and still ARE there.
Warheads - read: agent container - they were empty, there were no nerve agents or chemical weapons found.
And I'm sure he was allowed to show you - a civilian -  millitary information.

Intheshadows wrote:

That being said if we wanted oil we could invade Venezuela for much cheaper and with much less loss of life. I believe its more of a control grab meant to surround the extremist regime of Iran and remove the funding and training source of many anti-us terrorist groups with one stone.
Less loss of live? Uhm, remember Vietnam, that's what they thought back then.?
And why are there so many anti-us groups? Explain!

Intheshadows wrote:

I am assuming you live in the netherlands as your profile states. If that is the case why are you roasting americans when your own countrymen are taking part in all of this? Your tax dollars go to support the very thing you decry!
Because we are forced to cooperate in the war your president started. We are allies. We don't fight because we want it, but because our prime-minister loves to suck up to Bush.

Intheshadows wrote:

I have to credit my brother on the awesome video's and photos of his unit meeting up with a Dutch KCT unit and them spending the next several hours trying out each others weapons on 55 gallon barrels in the desert. Also rather interesting that many of the weapons your countrymen carry are of american make. So you have your own tax dollars paying for american weapons, and your tax dollars paying for those soldiers to take part in a war you do not agree with. Seems like you are just being screwed from all sides.
Dutch forces use mainly the Diemaco C7/C7a2/C8. But we do use M1A2 tanks, but those are steadily being replaced by Leopard 2's. Armored vehicles are also being replaced by european counter-parts.

And if he met that KCT unit in Afghanistan he might have had a rumble with a family member of me.

Last edited by Bernadictus (2006-08-22 05:24:57)

2006-08-22 05:23:13
Intheshadows
Member
+5|6932

Jemme101 wrote:

Intheshadows wrote:

I have to credit my brother on the awesome video's and photos of his unit meeting up with a Dutch KCT unit and them spending the next several hours trying out each others weapons on 55 gallon barrels in the desert. Also rather interesting that many of the weapons your countrymen carry are of american make. So you have your own tax dollars paying for american weapons, and your tax dollars paying for those soldiers to take part in a war you do not agree with. Seems like you are just being screwed from all sides.
I am not 100% sure, but to my best knowledge the Dutch forces dont use US weaponry. At least not on an Infantry Platoon level. The weapons you might confuse for being US are in fact the Diemaco C7/C7A1 5.56 mm assault rifle and the Diemaco C8/C8A1 5.56 mm carbine. Both M16/AR15 clones made under license in Canada. Diemaco was recently (2005) taken over by Colt. The purchase of the weapons by the Dutch Army was before this date.
Dutch forces dont use US weaponry?

dutch airforce:

F-16
CH-47 "chinook"
AH-64 Apache
Patriot Missiles
Stinger Missiles

dutch navy:

Tomahawk Cruise Missiles

dutch army:
M109 "Paladin"
Browning M2
Mossberg M590A1
Barrett M82
Dragon Shoulder Fired Missile system
TOW missiles

And that is just what is documented.....KCT uses top of the line I know they were using american weapons from my brother who was there. They also had AK's, RPG's and various HK and FN weapons

Last edited by Intheshadows (2006-08-22 05:32:58)

2006-08-22 05:26:48
Intheshadows
Member
+5|6932
@Bernadictus

First time I saw those photos was when he spoke at a political action dinner. Being that he is a private contractor he can photograph and divulge whatever he would like as long as it doesnt breech the security or give up any classified information. Do some research on the topic, numerous caches of chemical and nerve agents have been uncovered. I remember a reuters report several years ago with raw footage.

And you are correct in identifying the meeting of the US sf and dutch sf units was in afghanistan, rather small world if in fact we both have family in each respective units. I will try to compile the clips into one video and post them for you to see if you recognize anyone.

Last edited by Intheshadows (2006-08-22 05:31:41)

2006-08-22 05:51:21
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6889|Valley of the Dragons

Intheshadows wrote:

Jemme101 wrote:

Intheshadows wrote:

I have to credit my brother on the awesome video's and photos of his unit meeting up with a Dutch KCT unit and them spending the next several hours trying out each others weapons on 55 gallon barrels in the desert. Also rather interesting that many of the weapons your countrymen carry are of american make. So you have your own tax dollars paying for american weapons, and your tax dollars paying for those soldiers to take part in a war you do not agree with. Seems like you are just being screwed from all sides.
I am not 100% sure, but to my best knowledge the Dutch forces dont use US weaponry. At least not on an Infantry Platoon level. The weapons you might confuse for being US are in fact the Diemaco C7/C7A1 5.56 mm assault rifle and the Diemaco C8/C8A1 5.56 mm carbine. Both M16/AR15 clones made under license in Canada. Diemaco was recently (2005) taken over by Colt. The purchase of the weapons by the Dutch Army was before this date.
Dutch forces dont use US weaponry?

dutch airforce:

F-16
CH-47 "chinook"
AH-64 Apache
Patriot Missiles
Stinger Missiles

dutch navy:

Tomahawk Cruise Missiles

dutch army:
M109 "Paladin"
Browning M2
Mossberg M590A1
Barrett M82
Dragon Shoulder Fired Missile system
TOW missiles

And that is just what is documented.....KCT uses top of the line I know they were using american weapons from my brother who was there. They also had AK's, RPG's and various HK and FN weapons
I guess reading isnt required anymore in school these days, but I wrote ... At least not on an Infantry Platoon level ... ktxs.
Shotguns arent used in the field, only our SWAT teams use them. Our SWAT is also part of the Dutch Army.
Snipers are a seperate force within either SWAT, KCT or the Marines. The chance of having seen a KCT unit fielding the M82 is very slim. They usually use FN and HK equipment and apparently the Diemaco.
All the other weapons you mentioned arent used by the KCT.
The only interesting fact you mentioned is that they apparently field the AK and RPG, which seems to be a common tactic for Special Forces these days. The SAS does the same I heard so they can use enemy ammunition caches.
2006-08-22 06:01:32
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7126

Intheshadows wrote:

Dutch forces dont use US weaponry?
Failed. Reading, the hardest thing on these here forums.

But back on topic, why is are Americans so millitary driven, why they completely screw up during situation like St. Louis (The massive hurricane floods).

Last edited by Bernadictus (2006-08-22 06:04:10)

2006-08-22 06:15:48
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6889|Valley of the Dragons

Bernadictus wrote:

Intheshadows wrote:

Dutch forces dont use US weaponry?
Failed. Reading, the hardest thing on these here forums.

But back on topic, why is are Americans so millitary driven, why they completely screw up during situation like St. Louis (The massive hurricane floods).
New Orleans you mean

But to take a shot at your question. A large part of the US economy is geared towards the arms industry and in order to keep sales up you need to have a war now and again.
2006-08-22 06:25:02
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7126

Jemme101 wrote:

Bernadictus wrote:

Intheshadows wrote:

Dutch forces dont use US weaponry?
Failed. Reading, the hardest thing on these here forums.

But back on topic, why is are Americans so millitary driven, why they completely screw up during situation like St. Louis (The massive hurricane floods).
New Orleans you mean

But to take a shot at your question. A large part of the US economy is geared towards the arms industry and in order to keep sales up you need to have a war now and again.
So I should start building my personal atomic shelter ^^
2006-08-22 06:26:16
david363
Crotch fires and you: the untold story
+314|7128|Comber, Northern Ireland

Bernadictus wrote:

TeK||drake666 wrote:

yeah thats true, but i don't think that the US-troops don't help the Iraqi (like children) civilians with medics, food and clean water...
thats what i tried to say..
Offcourse they are helping a small proportion of the poppulation. But I would rather go to Iraq on vacation with Saddam as their leader, then to go their present day!

david363 wrote:

I swear if any of you laugh at this i will kill you
Ha. Ha. Ha. Now make my day Yankee.
your even more stupid than you sound, i'm not a yankee you stupid flatlander, i'm from Ireland and if you took the time to look at my details instead of shouting your mouth off you would have notcied that!
2006-08-22 06:26:56
Intheshadows
Member
+5|6932
I have a KCT sniper on film showing his prowess with a M82 by firing while standing so yes they do field it. Along with speaking to my brother several had colt stamped M4's with picatinny rails. So argue as you may but its true, they do use US weapons just as US SF uses austrian and belgian made weapons. Its about using what works when required. You can argue symantics or break down your paragraphs however you would like but I have you on both counts

To answer your question about New Orleans and Katrina. Being from Europe I guess you dont have any sense of scale. Your country is aproximently 16,000 Square Miles....The areas declared a disaster zone in the aftermath of hurricane Katrina was 90,000 sqm. That is an area almost 6 times the size of your whole nation. How can you even begin to speak against the american response to this massive natural disaster. Despite the amount of land and the millions of people affected there was only 1,800 deaths reported.

If you want to have a serious level-headed discussion we can, If you want to throw insults and speak about things that you dont understand go elsewhere.

Back on topic about the war and our troops, I support them and the war.

Last edited by Intheshadows (2006-08-22 06:45:50)

2006-08-22 07:24:46
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6889|Valley of the Dragons

Intheshadows wrote:

I have a KCT sniper on film showing his prowess with a M82 by firing while standing so yes they do field it.
I know they use it, because they were doing practice routines and firing practice on the same range I was on when I was in the army. Allthough I was serving in a different branch we frequently met the guys of the KCT on one of the big ranges we have here.
The kind of missions the KCT does in Afghanistan probably wont include the sort which would see them field the M82. At least that is what we are lead to believe here anyways.

Intheshadows wrote:

Along with speaking to my brother several had colt stamped M4's with picatinny rails. So argue as you may but its true, they do use US weapons just as US SF uses austrian and belgian made weapons. Its about using what works when required.
The default weapons used by the KCT dont include any US made weapons. It also doesnt include any AK's and RPG's, but you wrote you saw them to. All foreign material used in raids and operations is usually stuff found after weapons caches have been dicovered after which they sometimes are used in deep insertion operations.

Intheshadows wrote:

You can argue symantics or break down your paragraphs however you would like but I have you on both counts.
You dont have me on any count so I suggest you start showing some respect. Its ok to try to argue a point, but it is not that smart to do this with somebody who fought side by side with this force.
2006-08-22 07:42:32
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|7086|Germany

Bernadictus wrote:

What religious idiots? Place yourself in a muslim, your country is getting 'crusaded' by oil thursty christians.
And which religious idiot was there in Iraq? You mean Sadam Hussein?
Not to defend him, but the man has a damn Nobel Prize ffs! And the country is in much worse shape now then it was back in his days.
I think Bernadictus here is one of the few people who have that open-minded view and can see things from the other perspective,I really appreciate that in a person.

Maybe an analogy to Stars Wars can help you guys understand at least a little bit:
If you were a Stormtrooper in the Empire - would you think Luke Skywalker and his rebel friends are the "good guys"?
There's no good,there's no evil,there's no right nor wrong,it's all in perspective.
2006-08-22 07:49:47
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6889|Valley of the Dragons
I think the Kurdish people are glad the US and its coalition forces dropped by. After 180.000 deaths in what must be one of the largest genocides in the past decades they probably welcomed them.
2006-08-22 07:52:32
Ducatti20
Member
+1|7051|Arizona
I am not wading in on your little debate.... For more military video's (and the place that this video debuted) go to www.grouchymedia.com, it has been on that site for years.
2006-08-22 07:58:54
Gentlesouljah.e
Member
+14|6851|United States

Ducatti20 wrote:

I am not wading in on your little debate.... For more military video's (and the place that this video debuted) go to www.grouchymedia.com, it has been on that site for years.
Thank you. +1 for you

 

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